is Kissing Required

[New2theSwingSet 15]

When my wife and i first started discussing some boundaries about what we wanted to do with other people, or what we thought might not be good for us... we talked about kissing the other people we were with. Specifically kissing on the lips, to us it seemed unneccesary, moreover it was something that we felt was more intimate between us and didnt really have much role to play with other partners in the bedroom. The people we play with can enjoy us and we can enjoy them but we dont need to kiss each other to get the pleasure we desired.

 

The few people we played with understood this and were quite happy to just have sex and not the kissing. But we've been to places where alot of swingers were and it seemed even when they were just being introduced they would lean in and kiss on the lips, sometimes a lot deeper then i would have expected. Like it was just a greeting formality. I mentioned it to my wife and she had noticed it as well, and suggested we consider taking the no-kissing rule off the list. Now i'm comfortable when meeting someone, or we're already friends, to share a kiss on the cheek, since its got no intimacy to it. but i guess i want to find out how much of a role kissing plays during the whole swinging experience. Our no-kissing policy isnt set in stone, but since we're new, we previously didnt think it made much difference.

 

***

If kissing is the new way of shaking hands, then it's no wonder i didn't make it through that last job interview very well.

[LikeMinds321 1,527]

For us, kissing has to be a part of swinging. And I'm talking about kissing on the lips.

 

From what I've read, most often couples leave kissing out because they feel it is a sign of intimacy (I think they mean love) that they don't want to express to anyone but their spouse.

 

For us, we know that kissing each other is what makes the kissing special and loving. We could kiss hundreds of other people - even using the same "techniques" of kissing - and it would never feel, or mean, the same with those swing partners.

 

Think of it this way, is it the meaning behind your actions, or your actions that mean the most?

 

I always have to begin with kissing.

 

LM

[RMRx2 24]

For us, kissing has to be a part of swinging. And I'm talking about kissing on the lips.

Dito

For us, we know that kissing each other is what makes the kissing special and loving. We could kiss hundreds of other people - even using the same "techniques" of kissing - and it would never feel, or mean, the same with those swing partners.

 

Think of it this way, is it the meaning behind your actions, or your actions that mean the most?

 

I always have to begin with kissing.

 

LM

Dito

 

I/We agree. Mr RMRx2 here. It was I that couldn't see kissing, figured it unnecessary. I felt that would be harder for me to handle, GO FIGURE?! What did I know! Many things get adjusted as you proceed. For us that was the first! We started with a mfm, and within the first 15mins I was encouraging VERY passionate kissing between mrs rmrx2 and our guest. I personally can't see getting worked up without some passionate kissing. And when we have a gentleman join us for mfm, well I want the mrs to be treated well and shown she is desired. When with a cpl or female, it is the same. So for us, that was one rule that changed very quickly and we agree "it is the meaning behind your actions" that make the difference. We have had many encounters in the lifestyle and still, when we talk of such things, agree it still feels like we have only made love to each other,,,,,because that is the way it truely is. We can have and enjoy passionate sex with friends, but it is not making love with them. rmrx2

[starlinn 17]

We used to be one of those couples who didnt allow kissing. Because we were relatively new at a MFF, I didnt know how I would react to it. My hubby, on the other hand, needed it, so we came to a compromise. If at anytime, I feel unconfortable with him kissing another, I would give him a signal. The first time we were with another female, he went for it, and not only didnt I mind, it excited me! We still have the boundry of confort for me, but now I cant even remember what the signal is. If another person has that boundry we do respect it though, it would not be a reason to not play with them.

[good times 991]

For us, kissing is an important enough part of sexual play that if someone has a no kissing rule we won't play with them. I guess kissing for me is an essential part of getting aroused and sexually excited, without it I just don't get that turned on no matter how hot the woman is.

[two4youinswva 3,068]

I personally can't see getting worked up without some passionate kissing.

 

Dito

 

If you wanna get Mrs two4you hot, show her how good a kisser you are! I have posted this before, but will say it again; good kissing goes a long ways to deciding whether or not our potentials get to go a long way.

[Dynamar 246]

If you wanna get Mrs two4you hot, show her how good a kisser you are! I have posted this before, but will say it again; good kissing goes a long ways to deciding whether or not our potentials get to go a long way.

Dito Kissing is definitely the "gateway drug" for me. No kissing = no play. Ya gotta get the engine started before you can get anywhere!

[jennandjamesinm 87]

Dito - We are with everyone else here....to us kissing is just a part of foreplay, and we won't swing with someone who has this rule. Kissing is the turn on for us.

 

Jenn and James

[DBL D 120]

We have been with one couple that had the no kissing rule. It was weird Now we make sure we are all on the same page with the kissing.

We like to strat our foreplay with kissing a "gateway drug" for sure.

 

Fem D

[intuition897 2,179]

Sorry New2, I'm inclined to agree with everyone else! There's something about deep passionate kissing - experiencing it OR watching it - that just makes me weak at the knees. We used to have the no-kissing rule, too. But I think we were looking for boundaries to set up...just so we'd have them! As someone had suggested in another thread, I think we just watched Pretty Woman one too many times. But after we'd been in it a while with a few experiences under out belt, we realized that it wasn't the act that defined betrayal, but the intent behind it. After that, we loosened up a bit and the rules went out the window. As long as we could both go into an encounter 'on the same page', knowing fully what was in each other's hearts, we found that being given carte blanche as far as sex play went was much more exciting than feeling like we had given one another a script to follow, or a rule book to lug along with us. We just kinda pared down the 'rule book' to a simple "I'm not going to do anything that I think would hurt you." As long as we both promised this and believed one another's promise, and of course ensured that we didn't break our promises, everything was just fine.

[playmatesinpgh 18]

Kissing is where it all starts.

 

No Kissing=No Play

[AlanCatherine 18]

A question has been raised once about what you actually keep for your partner. The no-kissing rule means that there is at least something intimate that is reserved for your partner to make them special.

 

If there is nothing that you do with your partner that you don't do with someone else, what makes your partner special? We also knocked out the no-kissing rule not long ago but we still feel a little bit betrayed if kissing takes place.

 

What does your partner get that no-one else gets?

[Dynamar 246]

What does your partner get that no-one else gets?

Ummm... love?

[bear_and_babe 68]

We had the no kissing rule for about 10 minutes. Then we rethought that rule. We to feel that kissing is the first step to playing with someone. I guess we have been lucky, we have only met 1 couple with the no kissing rule, and we were only interested in friendship with them anyway. I can not even figure out how you would play with someone without kissing. It is just a natural part of playing for me.

[Vespertine 31]

What does your partner get that no-one else gets?

Ummm... love?

Exactly.

[New2theSwingSet 15]

Well, i guess it seems almost unanimous that most people expect kissing to be part of the process. Although, we're not alone with the initial no-kissing rule to start out with. It seems some people had the rule and then realized that kissing was an essential peice of the puzzle and dropped the rule.

 

I think we'll end up coming to that conclusion on our own as well, as it becomes more comfortable for us. Thanks for all the insight.

[AlanCatherine 18]

Vespertine, that is the answer we already had. If our hearts remained faithful to each other, the rest was just physical. So how do you know where your partner's heart is? You can't see where it is going. You have to trust them. We have the trust but it's awfully thin ice you are skating on. Kissing gets a lot closer to being inside the other person's head than anything else you can do. There is a lot of communication in kissing that you don't get with any amount of sex. You can virtually tell the other person how you feel about them with a kiss. You can't do that with a cock in a pussy.

[RMRx2 24]

A question has been raised once about what you actually keep for your partner. The no-kissing rule means that there is at least something intimate that is reserved for your partner to make them special.

 

If there is nothing that you do with your partner that you don't do with someone else, what makes your partner special? We also knocked out the no-kissing rule not long ago but we still feel a little bit betrayed if kissing takes place.

 

What does your partner get that no-one else gets?

 

 

AH,,,,,,,,how bout Love, Commitment being what's left to make your partner special?!

 

There is so much that defines a marriage or relationship that transends the physical to the spiritual. That we have not shared with others nor do we ever intend to. Alura has been qouted as saying that even when he and the mrs's start out to have sex or just fuck, it always ends up "making love". We think that is the fundamental difference. We have not been with anyone else since we have been together, becuase we have not made love to anyone else.

 

The rmrx2's

[Chicup 42]

We enjoy the kissing part, it does add to the experiance but we have played with a couple with a no kissing rule.

 

Finally YEARS later we break the rule, turns out they are bad kissers

[twoplayful2 16]

It sounds corny and all, but we both agree with those who said "love" is the thing you keep between yourselves. I kiss others with curiousity and lust, it doesn't come close to how I feel when I'm really into the moment with my wife. When I touch her or hold her hand I do it because I love her and just want to feel her. That's what we save because we could never match that with others even if we tried.

[MJ&DD 15]

Though our playing is still in the fantasy stage we have shared very passionate kisses with others. I must say that my enjoyment in seeing my wife being kissed in that way has led me to want to watch her do even more with with a man of her choosing. Maybe someday. Mr MJ&DD

[Jamie&Kieth 36]

I love kissing, anywhere anyplace ... all over. Makes the SEX that much better!

[bear_and_babe 68]

I have already posted a reply on this subject, but someone said something I wanted to coment on.

 

I never had a problem with kissing or seeing Bear kiss someone else. What I did and do have a problem with is hand holding. To me, that is a very intimate thing. That is something that only Bear and I do. We were in a exclusive relationship with another couple. We did a lot of hand holding and sometimes seeing Bear hold "her" hand really set me off! I even have a problem if a guy likes to link his hands in mine while we are having sex. That is a little too intimate for me sometimes.

 

It is funny what will bother some people. Some think kissing is too much, I think holding hands is a little too much, go figure...

[Dynamar 246]

What I did and do have a problem with is hand holding. To me, that is a very intimate thing.

Now see... this I can agree with!

[RMRx2 24]

Now see... this I can agree with!

ditto

 

hmmmmm, ya know , maybe that was the "thing" that bothered me about one cpl,,well the guy in particular. Hell I can love seeing some cut young stud banging my wife, kissing her too, but this guy (not all that) just made me want to pound him one. We let that opportunity pass, heeding my sixth sense.

 

But now that you mention it, we went to a movie together and her hubby and my wife sat inboard. I looked over and he was holding her hand and occassionaly lightly stroking her arm. I almost pounded him right there!.

 

Yep does seem pretty funny given what I am okay seeing :rollseyes

 

mr rmrx2

[bear_and_babe 68]

I am glad that I am not the only one who has a problem with holding hands. I thought for sure people were going to laugh at me for saying this!

[RMRx2 24]

I am glad that I am not the only one who has a problem with holding hands. I thought for sure people were going to laugh at me for saying this!

 

not only didn't I laugh, but think it helped me a bunch,,,,,,I mean go figure, here was the cpl we got along great with and was nice enough and all,,,,and I just couldn't get used to the guy being around the mrs. had me pretty confused, I mean I love finding her some guy better looking, more hung, cut and all to join us,,,,,,,and this guy wasn't all that,,,,just couldn't figure it out, every time we were around him I got protective as hell,,oh well,,,,,,,think it was all the efforts to hold hands and be touchy feely that I didn't observe him doing at all with his own wife.

[lovedoctor 15]

I remember hearing some romantic notion that kissing involved sharing of the souls. Then the movie "Pretty Woman" popularized the notion that womping someone was less intimate than kissing them! LOL! I don't get it!

 

The thing that bothers me is if there is whispering going on. Not that I have been in many swinging situations (yet) but I've gotta hear what's going on...

[Vespertine 31]

I am glad that I am not the only one who has a problem with holding hands. I thought for sure people were going to laugh at me for saying this!

Hand holding is waaaaay too intimate, IMO.

 

Same with cuddling.

[Just_us49 32]

Hand holding is waaaaay too intimate, IMO.

 

Same with cuddling.

 

Same here...kissing no problem. Cuddling or hand holding NO WAY.

 

-D

[parcarcaliente 15]

I think most people have already said so, so I just would like to add that we also started with the no kissing rule, and found out, there's no way we could kiss other people like we kiss between us, so it's normal to feel nervous when you start, as you are, but with practice you both will get better and pass that feeling. Keep it up.

 

Take care

[destin-ez 15]

My experience only.....We weren't "smart" enough to set up rules that were all that in depth. The 1st swing experience we had was spur of the moment, so to speak. When she kissed him it stung pretty good for about 10 seconds. Their kissing really got things heated up and the night was amazing.

 

To this day, I enjoy seeing her/him kissing, that lets me know she's ready, hot and set for a good time. Kissing between them has NEVER changed my "partership" feelings toward her.

 

NOW, as for the cuddling and hand holding.....I hadn't thought of those issues, but hey, that's why we're here on the Swingers Board, right?

 

Mr. D

[WildMiCouple 325]

Kissing is also important with us during our playing . It's funny though......we never really go over any rules or boundaries with the couples we meet at dances. Guess we've gotten lucky in that most of the couples we've played haven't had any rules.....other than the obvious safe sex one we have. If we found out that they had a "no kissing" rule after we got back to our room, we'd probably still play.....but just keep it that one time .

 

I'd be willing to bet that if a couple has a "no kissing" rule, along with others....that it is by far the one broken first.

 

Brett (and Tammy)

[AlanCatherine 18]

So the no-kissing rule has been superseded by the no-holding-hands rule?

 

Doesn't the "love and commitment" that could handle a deep passionate kiss also handle hand-holding? Or do we really have some physical limits after all?

[DBL D 120]

I know what you mean AlanCatherine. I think for many, it just gets too close to poly. Fem D and I haven't talked about it that much probably because we haven't seen a problem from it. Well, on the other hand, there may have been a problem with it from the other couples view. We met a couple once and on the way back to our cars I walked with the other lady and Fem D walked with him. She grabbed my hand. We ended up playing with them but haven't been with them since. Maybe her hubby had a problem with it, or even thought that I'd initiated the maneuver. Some things will always remain unknown in the swinging world.

 

We both feel that if our relationship is strong then these things shouldn't be a problem. We know how we feel about each other and actually look forward to being with couple who can feel secure enough in their relationship to be able to do that. It helps us know that they really want to be with us. We all know that we have to split up and won't see each other (the other couple) for as long as several months. I'm not saying that people who have this rule aren't secure, but I think we place road blocks to really being fulfilled.

 

We always want to be left satisfied.

 

Male D

[EvilMJ 65]

For us kissing is part of sex, it helps get things going, makes thing hot. However cuddling, hand holding..etc, these things are part of a relationship they are expressions of affection and that is something that is for me and hubby alone.

 

Not everyone is going to have the same rules...all i know is watching hubby have sex with another woman is hot, watching him cuddle another woman would hurt me. so that's why we just don't allow it.

[DBL D 120]

I understand. We don't rule out people who have other rules, believe me.

 

Male D

[CharmCityCpl 15]

To Kiss or Not To Kiss...everybody is different in their comfort level. What works for one couple may not work for another. Rules can be changed. A couple can try new things. If you don't like it you can always make it a rule not to kiss again. Find your comfort level as a couple and go with it.

[intuition897 2,179]

So the no-kissing rule has been superseded by the no-holding-hands rule?

 

Doesn't the "love and commitment" that could handle a deep passionate kiss also handle hand-holding? Or do we really have some physical limits after all?

 

I think it's not the act, but what it implies. Why do we kiss? Because it gets us hot and it's fun. Why do we hold hands? Usually not to get us hot. I think maybe there's a connection in the mind, not about the sexual intimacy, but the emotional intimacy of hand-holding. It's something we've done with each other while I was in labour, while walking downtown eating ice cream on our anniversary date, while watching TV together, while driving in the car, while watching our kids play at the beach. It's such a simple thing. As familiar as your favorite old sweater. Maybe that's why it would seem so loaded with symbolism. Mr. intuition is the only person I'm interested in walking through life with, hand in hand. If it seems to me that he wants to do this with someone else, it raises some concerns for me. I'm fine with it as long as I know what's going on with it. If it's just part of foreplay, or a friendly hand squeeze as everyone basks in the afterglow, or if it's something that sexually turns someone on...I'm fine with that. But if it seems to me that there's some emotional "drifting" going on, I just think it needs to be dealt with. If we were looking to expand our emotional relationship into a triad (or whatever), then hand-holding would be ok.

[DBL D 120]

I'm not sure who's hand you've been holding, Intuition, but when I hold hands with Fem D ...I get hot. flamethrow

 

I think it's just like one of those boundaries that you can go back and forth on. With some couples it might be okay, and with others ...no way. It's about the level of intimacy, I Think!!!

 

Male D

[Lustman 15]

Guess it is a matter of personal preference. I have been with as others have said above, those who won't kiss cause they say it is too personal. So exploring and venturing into your other private parts is not personal? Please help me understand. Is this and emotional feeling or something? I really, really, really enjoy kissing especially deep kissing. It really gets me excited and hard.

[WesternSwing 504]

For us kissing is a neccessity. I like kissing, flirting and lots of foreplay. In fact, "making out" is a huge part of foreplay for me. We couldn't think of having sex with someone if we didn't kiss them. But to us, kissing isn't as intimate with others as it seems you and your wife feels it may be. Kissing between my wife and I is as intimate as sex between us is, and kissing between us and others just isn't the same. To us it's probably the least intimate act in swinging.

 

Mr. WS

[nicecpl89511 15]

For us kissing is an integral part of foreplay. We really would not want to swing with a couple that does not want to kiss. Like kissing gets it going

[rosybear 15]

i have been reading this with a lot of intrests now comes my problem on this, we have played off and on for a few years, mostly mfm, there was a female some years ago that he got started, heck he talked to her about it and then asked me to join them! so we played and it whent ok, he got a lot more out of it then me.. but now about a year ago we tired the cpl thing again with a cpl that was only a cpl in swinging, anyways i had to potty and do a little clean first so in the bathroom i when and when i came out he was down to just his pants, she was in underware and locked in a very passinate kiss, and from there they kept it up, i never looked, it was sending me over the moon-- i left there very hurt and in tears,, you see hubby has been a more wam-bam with me for a few years, very little forplay, and maybe just a peck or 2. so i set the rule, no kissing, now comes a new problem, he is having proformace problems, he missies the kissing! so how can this be? it truns him on very much with other women but with me its a no go. now we have a very high sex life, nigthy that is but no kissing. so what do i do? alow this for him ?

[rosybear 15]

we have played off and on for a few years, mostly mfm, there was a female some years ago that he got started, heck he talked to her about it and then asked me to join them! so we played and it whent ok,he never kissed her, he got a lot more out of it then me.. but now about a year ago we tired the cpl thing again with a cpl that was only a cpl in swinging, anyways i had to potty and do a little clean first so in the bathroom i when and when i came out he was down to just his pants, she was in underware and locked in a very passinate kiss, and from there they kept it up, i never looked, it was sending me over the moon-- i left there very hurt and in tears,, you see hubby has been a more wam-bam with me for a few years, very little forplay, and maybe just a peck or 2. so i set the rule, no kissing, now comes a new problem, he is having proformace problems, he missies the kissing! so how can this be? it truns him on very much with other women but with me its a no go. now we have a very high sex life, nigthy that is but no kissing. so what do i do? alow this for him ? let me add that in the play with the mfm, kissing has never been a problem as i dont start it and the male never seems to eather, thou i have gotten a few kisses on the neck or shouldre, they just never seemed to bother with it.

[intuition897 2,179]

i have been reading this with a lot of intrests now comes my problem on this, we have played off and on for a few years, mostly mfm, there was a female some years ago that he got started, heck he talked to her about it and then asked me to join them! so we played and it whent ok, he got a lot more out of it then me.. but now about a year ago we tired the cpl thing again with a cpl that was only a cpl in swinging, anyways i had to potty and do a little clean first so in the bathroom i when and when i came out he was down to just his pants, she was in underware and locked in a very passinate kiss, and from there they kept it up, i never looked, it was sending me over the moon-- i left there very hurt and in tears,, you see hubby has been a more wam-bam with me for a few years, very little forplay, and maybe just a peck or 2. so i set the rule, no kissing, now comes a new problem, he is having proformace problems, he missies the kissing! so how can this be? it truns him on very much with other women but with me its a no go. now we have a very high sex life, nigthy that is but no kissing. so what do i do? alow this for him?

No, if it's going to cause hurt feelings, don't say that it's ok. Because it's just not. I get the feeling that there is something that isn't being communicated here. Obviously, for him, deep passionate kissing is not indicative of deep love. Otherwise he'd be doing it with you and not with a person he barely knows. Seems like it's very much a sexual thing for him, pure and simple. If passionate kissing is something that you associate with your deepest feelings for him, he needs to know that. And if he doesn't already, he should know that it hurts you to see him sharing something with a stranger that he will not share with his wife. It doesn't particularly matter at this juncture who is going to do the changing; what matters is that he recognizes this as a real problem for you.

 

I can think of two possible explainations.

1) There is something in your relationship that is causing him to feel awkward about kissing you in such a way. Find out how he really feels about this kind of sexual contact and what it means to him.

 

2) Perhaps it's a matter of physical attraction. I hate to say it, but it's a factor. Do you get regular checkups and cleanings at the dentist? Floss? Brush every day? Poor oral health can be a REAL turn-off. It sure won't hurt to pay some extra attention to it. Not flossing for a week does to the teeth what not showering for a week does to the body. Ick. Breath mints, sprays or gum can help, but there's really no substitute for good oral hygiene.

(Bonus points for anyone who guesses what I was in a former life?)

 

Just a thought.

[WantingU4Us 15]

I/we think the no kissing thing is a personal preference... I (Mrs) tried to kiss another male and it was not the same as with (Mr) but that was because it wasnt him..I have to agree though kissing to us is part of getting the party started...For me (Mrs) it is was sparks the match to lead to the fire.

[Sweet_Candy 54]

Tell him what you've told us. The journey for us is learning new things together. Perhaps you two are in a set ritual of familiarity. Tell him what you want...I know it's hard ...but we can't read each other's minds yet.

[HotMoCpl 20]

I have to agree with Sweet Candy. Tell hubby you want kissess before, during and after. My wife and I have been together over fifteen years and only recently did I realize what kissess meant to her. We kiss a LOT now.

[SwingHile 15]

Hi. Just figured I'd add my 2 cents worth.

My wife and I are new to swingin as well, and I had the same thought as you did. I didnt want there to be any kissing either. That was until I mentioned this to my wife. She got this funny look on her face and slowly said "ok?". I, at that moment came to the conclusion that if we where to be intimate with others that leaving out the most intimate act would seem odd. I then thought how I'd feel kissing another woman and also came to the conlusion that it wouldnt ever be the same as kissing my wife. So with that said I relized that she feels the same way which ultimatly made me feel ok about it. Personaly I dont think it matters much what others want from you when you swing, If it does'nt make you two feel comfortable theres a saying I have "When in doubt, Dont.".