Do Swingers suffer from low Self-Esteem?

[atlas 15]

I had a thought today. Are swinger clubs filled with people of low self-esteem? It sounds inflammatory, so let me explain.

 

I was thinking that swing clubs are the only place where people welcome to simply walk up to you and tell you how attractive you are without creating a bizarre situation. To me, this sounds wonderful. It's one thing to get it from your wife, but for a complete stranger to honestly express their interest is another thing. I think it could be a wonderful experience for anyone who has suffered from low self esteem. In addition, I think it's exactly the place to embolden people to make advances where they'd normally feel unworthy.

 

This is a broad generalization and has all the problems with all generalizations, but what do you think? I'm an unexperienced newbie that had a "hmm... I wonder" thought. Please don't smear me. It was just a thought.

[Spoomonkey 421]

atlas said:

I'm an unexperienced newbie that had a "hmm... I wonder" thought.

 

It is actually a pretty good thought. Anyone who knows me knows that I have always struggled with a low self-esteem and swinging has helped me get past that quite a bit. There really is nothing like having attractive women interested in you that can "right the emotional ship" so to speak.

 

But there is another side of it as well - and that is the damage it can do to self-esteem. Just as quickly as swinging can improve your self-esteem, it can also hurt it. Rejection is a rampant reality and I see a lot of couples sit at tables completely unapproached - and afraid to approach.

 

While cumulatively our experiences in swinging have improved our self-concept, I would say that some of our biggest (since becoming adults) self-esteem blows have come since getting into swinging - and this is for me and (I'm thinking of a particular experience right now) for Mrs Spoomonkey.

 

I would definitely say that one of the reasons many women enjoy swinging is because it reminds them that they are beautiful and worth pursuing.

 

Does this mean that swing clubs are filled with people with low self-esteem? I am not sure about that. I've met a lot of folks and many of them like themselves more than they should. Like all things, swinging is really just a cross section of society as a whole. The boost in self-esteem is a great benefit - just as getting noticed for a good job at work boosts your self-concept. But - people with low self-esteems are no more or less in a swing club than they are in a church, at the local softball field or in any given movie theatre.

[good times 991]

Dito with what Spoomonkey said.

 

But to answer your question myself, I would have to say I doubt it. The reason I doubt that swing clubs are full of people with low self-esteem is because it seems to me that people with truly low self-esteem would have trouble handling the rejection that is inevitable when approaching people for sex. I think it takes at least a certain level of good self-esteem to just be able to, put yourself out there, so to speak. We all have our insecurities, but my experience has been that most swingers seem to have a higher self-esteem than average.

[Chicup 41]

Interesting thought.

 

I don't think it would hold up to well. Mrs. Chicup who is a very attractive woman has some issues with her looks, always has since a child. Its almost comical since she is very good looking, but reguardless they are there. This makes her quite shy at a swing club and I know she wouldn't have the guts to do it if i wasn't there. Sure people telling you you look great is good, but it seems when someone has low self esteem all it takes is that one rejection to bring them back down to insecurity.

 

So while I think under some circumstances swinging could be great for people with undeserved low self esteem issues, such people would not make up even a sizable minority of swingers.

[WesternSwing 504]

I think there is the same cross section of self-esteem in swinging as there is in general society. Just us personally, Mrs. WS battles with low self-esteem, and I have never experienced it. We were raised totally different. I was probably over-nurtured and she was constantly told by her mother that she was ugly, fat, stupid, etc. I entered the world overconfident and had a rude awakening, and Mrs. WS has always had to keep her attitude good and self-esteem up.

 

And as Spoo said about rejection, for instance it doesn't bother me, I just move on to the next. Mrs. WS takes it more personally.

[Tia Vampire 167]

I thought the same thing when i first started into the lifestyle, I also thought that the couple must not really be in love if they could lay with other people and not be jealous. After reading a lot of these threads and speaking with other swinger it is quite the opposite. I'm sure you'll find this to be the same way when it comes to self-esteem. I myself am a very confident person, but I'm also a newbie. Good luck and read as much as you can from the board. It helped with a lot of my questions.

[cuzzeyesaidso 31]

The thing that gets under my skin from time to time is when we have profiles on sites like SLS and others, i see a counter of how many times our profile has been viewed, and yet we haven't gotten any emails, IM's, etc. I wonder about our compatibility and whether or not we look good enough. It's discouraging at times.

[Spoomonkey 421]

cuzzeyesaidso said:

I wonder about our compatibility and whether or not we look good enough. It's discouraging at times.

 

Think of it this way:

 

How many times have you looked at a profile and thought to yourself, "out of my league - not even going to try." And just clicked on to the next one...

 

Sure - many people look at our profile and based on pictures or something we've written about ourselves decide that we are just not their cup of tea. I have to believe at the same time that there are people who - just like us - look at our profile and say, "no way... Out of our league." I'm not saying they are right - just like we might not be right - but it happens; and it means that some of those views that come without contact are a compliment

[TheSwingerSet 205]

cuzzeyesaidso said:

The thing that gets under my skin from time to time is when we have profiles on sites like SLS and others, I see a counter of how many times our profile has been viewed, and yet we haven't gotten any emails, IM's, etc. I wonder about our compatibility and whether or not we look good enough. It's discouraging at times.

 

I have to agree with Spoo on this! But I don't think it is so much an "Out of our League" issue I think its more of getting over the putting yourself out there issue. No one likes to be turned down and I know that for the first few years of our using the net to find and meet people I had a issue of what to say in the first contact e-mail to, A) make sure that our e-mail stood out from the rest and B) not make us look like we were bed post notchers.

 

Now I have the same issue 2 fold in that we use the same accounts for personal use (to find and meet potential playmates) and to promote our club.

 

To back this up, Look at the hints on most sites for how to meet people and one of the first ones is always telling you to make the first move don't wait for someone to e-mail you.

 

The same goes for clubs, In our newbie orientation we tell people that they will only get out what they are willing to put in, by this we mean that if you sit and stare into your drink all night then you won't get much but if you get up talk to people, ask them to dance and make yourself available then you will be a person that others find approachable. We have several of our regular couples that we can count on to go and introduce themselves to new people, and get them involved, which is a great help!

 

As to the original post, I think that as a whole most swingers have a higher self-esteem than the population as a whole. This thought comes to mind because you have to be somewhat self confident in order to try new things, believe me inviting others into your marriage bed is a "new thing" and one of the biggest decisions that most couples will ever make.

 

Case in point. a few months ago we got an e-mail on AFF from a young single female (22) who said she was interested in meeting us (a huge ego boost) we e-mailed back and forth a few times and then set up a meeting for the following Sat night. Now we have been around a bit and we know that these meetings usually end up with us sitting in a bar waiting for the unicorn to show, which they rarely ever do. In this case how ever she called us a few minutes before we arrived to ask us if we were going to show up because she was there waiting for us. When we got to talking she let us know that this was her first venture in meeting people this way and that she was scared shitless, but in her gut she knew that it was something she had to do. (I am going to post the story of the rest of the night in another thread)

[catslaughing 45]

To start with IANAP ( heh ) but your assumption is reasonable other than the fact that you will have your self-esteem improve when others are attracted to you, no way you can help but feel good about yourself when that happens.

 

I get a thrill off of how sexy people find my wife, she gets a thrill when someone finds me attractive, and we both enjoy the freedom to be able to let someone else know how attractive they are, basically swing parties/clubs melt it all down and let people be open about their sexuality. People with esteem issues either improve or stop going.

[Chicup 41]

cuzzeyesaidso said:

The thing that gets under my skin from time to time is when we have profiles on sites like SLS and others, i see a counter of how many times our profile has been viewed, and yet we haven't gotten any emails, IM's, etc. I wonder about our compatibility and whether or not we look good enough. It's discouraging at times.

 

While pictures do help you get responses, I'd guess 95% of people who look at a profile with pictures are just looking to see if there are any nude shots, so the number of times viewed is meaningless.

[havefuninsun 122]

The thing that gets under my skin from time to time is when we have profiles on sites like SLS and others, i see a counter of how many times our profile has been viewed, and yet we haven't gotten any emails, IM's, etc. I wonder about our compatability and whether or not we look good enough. It's discouraging at times.

 

I don't even look at those statistics, because they're meaningless. I look at profiles all the time and don't email -- sometimes it's because the tag line caught my eye, or I liked the pic, or the pic was "interesting" to me in some way (sometimes good, sometimes not so good).

 

I did the online dating thing before, and learned VERY quickly to develop thick skin. The first profile I posted I didn't post pics, and some guys would write and I'd email back a pic and never hear from them again. Instead of getting my panties all in a wad, I'd find it comical as hell -- I know I'm no runway beauty, but I also know I have the right number of eyes and all of my teeth.

 

And, I guess I don't suffer from low self-esteem, and actually find it obnoxious if I'm heavily hit on too much ("god girl, did the angels just drop you from heaven??") -- I like "real" -- if you're attracted to me, say hi, flirt, smile -- I get the picture.

 

Attraction is a very fickle thing ...

[wifes_sex_slave 16]

TheSwingerSet said:

As to the original post, I think that as a whole most swingers have a higher self-esteem than the population as a whole. This thought comes to mind because you have to be somewhat self confident in order to try new things, believe me inviting others into your marriage bed is a "new thing" and one of the biggest decisions that most couples will ever make.

 

 

My wife and I are fairly outgoing people and I can honestly say there are no problems with our self-esteem.

I find that the club gives us a "safe" place to say the things we "openly" feel like saying to someone we are interested in. We don't have to worry about getting our faces slapped or our asses kicked in the parking lot by a jealous wife or husband.

We go to the club to meet couples that are there for the same reason we are - sex!

 

There are 2 sides to the situations of what happens in the club - successful connections and rejections.

 

If I had a self-esteem problem - the last place I would want to be is in a place when I know there is a good possibility that my advances would be rejected.

[HappyPeople 17]

The best part about swinging as a couple is that even if you don't hook up, you still don't go home alone.

 

The self-esteem issues involved in swinging are much easier to deal with than those of singles/swingles. Perhaps being coupled so long as made it easy to forget how rough things can be when you're "on the market". At least in couple's swining, you've got someone to share your disappointments and highlights with.

[NakedInSeattle 159]

I feel that swingers, in general, have a high self-esteem. That's the way we are. I don't think you can start swinging if you aren't pretty confident about who you are and what you have in your relationship. I don't feel you go into swinging to boost your self-esteem. And swinging has made our self-esteem even higher. Mrs. Naked has told me several times since our New Years Eve party that if felt good that she could still get a total stranger hard dancing and teasing.

[all4234 15]

Swingers (especially women, but also men) general do not have a great self-esteem under these circumstances - but the do have the drive to try and enjoy their surroundings and quickly become comfortable with the situation, mainly because the partners are considerate and truly interested, I have always found men in swing clubs to be totally nothing but gentlemen. Once the woman gets that, they are totally willing (and they mean it) to begin sharing an atmosphere which brings their self esteem to abounds and they smile for the rest of the evening some (as I have) become a little to confident but that is a good thing.

 

I am the Mrs. part of all4234 and this is the first time I ever replied to a subject on this swingers board. I hope I have helped some of you to understand, it is a great way to go, go, go enjoy

[getnit2gethr 15]

In reading this I wonder what exactly is self esteem and how does one determine when someone has or lacks it. Here's what Wikipedis says:

 

[in psychology, self-esteem or self-worth includes a person's subjective appraisal of himself or herself as intrinsically positive or negative to some degree. Self-esteem involves both self-relevant beliefs (e.g., "I am competent/incompetent") and associated self-relevant emotions (e.g., triumph/despair, pride/shame). It also finds expression in behavior (e.g., assertiveness/timorousness, confidence/caution). In addition, self-esteem can be construed as an enduring personality characteristic (trait self-esteem) or as a temporary psychological condition (state self-esteem). Finally, self-esteem can be specific to a particular dimension (e.g., "I believe I am a good writer, and feel proud of that in particular") or global in extent (e.g., "I believe I am a good person, and feel proud of myself in general").]

 

So if a person expresses assertiveness/timorousness or confidence/caution does this mean they have high/low self-esteem? Maybe, or maybe just in some particular dimension, or maybe they are just learning about the particular dimension.

 

Sorry, but IMO your hypothesis is ridiculous in that it cannot be tested.

 

Here's another ridiculous hypothesis. People become swingers because they all have tremendously high self esteem but get themselves into trouble telling vanillas they want sex with them.

[sereneiders 263]

I agree with Spoo here, and as he said, you cannot jump into conclude that just because something happens between the people in a club, that's the cause or the main motivation for them to be there.

 

As an example, it's know that the sexual activity is healthy, a great excercise for your heart, your muscles and your brain, however, I don't know of anyone who fucks because of this. People fucks because it is pleasurable. I guess the same happens here.

[JustAskJulie 2,595]

I don't think the clubs are FULL of people with low self-esteem but I think that swinging has definately helped improve the self-esteem of a lot of people. The idea that swinger clubs are a place where anyone can just walk up to anyone else and express interest without fear of rejection is an invalid one. The fear of rejection (and the possibility of it) is the same as it is anywhere else. I think what does help people's self esteem within the world of swinging is being able to look around the room and see others who are equally attractive (or less attractive) having a great time and meeting others, it makes you feel that it's possible for you as well.

[easleyfuncpl 58]

Very interesting thought. I have struggled with self esteem issues for most of my life. However before we ever considered swinging, I was big into erotic photography. I never really considered myself that sexual or attractive of a person until I started doing that. The photos were so sensual and sexy...it's like 'wow..that, that's me!' And then to go from there to posting them on the web and have people guffaw about them did wonders for my self-esteem.

 

When we started swinging, it was much of the same experience. When people write us and say things like "I am shuddering right now just thinking about being with you,"...I mean, that's better than therapy! Of course there's always enough rejection to put you back in your place.

 

SO, lol, to answer the question...I think people do this for various reasons and have various back stories. It is evident that there can be some bonuses to your esteem as well as a lot of let downs. However, I don't agree with the idea that people who swing are actually more self-confident. Swinging in and of itself attracts people that have a more open-minded view about sex and share a unique openness and honesty with their partners. None of these, necessarily, have anything to do with confidence.

 

My two cents anyway...

[JustAskJulie 2,595]

Here's a good poll related to this thread: Has swinging improved your self-image?

[pervgeeks 119]

I disagree. I think it takes a lot of confidence to risk the possible rejection that is there for everyone. I think there's a certain amount of validation one can get from it from playing with others, but it's been our experience that swingers tend to inherently be more confident and secure types.