Hot Tub Scenario, not knowing if everyone swings.

[Lee55 15]

Here's the overview:

 

We're having a house party pretty soon and have invited 3 couples. We all plan on spending a lot of time in the hot tub after having dinner and some drinks (no suits allowed, but nothing further has been discussed). One of the couples (call them couple A) are pretty good friends of ours and the guy told me recently that they are interested in swinging (not specifically with us, but in general). Another couple (call them couple B) are our neighbors that we have become friends with. The other couple (call them couple C) are friends of my neighbors that we are getting to know and would like to become friends with. On a recent gathering during a conversation, couple C mentioned that they were friends with a couple that swing. Unfortunately at that time, I wasn't able to get more specific information or talk to them further on the subject. I got the feeling however that they may swing themselves. So the evening has potenial for a lot of excitement. Couples A & B are pretty open minded, and from what I can tell couple C is also.

 

Now the questions and concerns:

 

My SO is not attracted to the guy in couple A, but has some attraction to the men in couples B & C. She is not Bi-curious. Otherwise, I'd say there's some attraction between all of the couples.

 

My main concern is how to either bring up the subejct, or how to play it out so that playing becomes a strong possibility. The subject of swinging has never come up with couple B, and I don't know couple C well enough. I would like to just bring up the possibility, but I'm afraid of offending couples B & C.

 

I definitely need some guidance on this as it is new to me.

 

I appreciate any info.

[Reef99 30]

I would not mix friends and neighbors with swinging.

[ncmd_couple 597]

Lee,

 

My honest opinion is that you need to make the assumption that NOTHING is going to happen!

 

Couple A - Pursue that as a seperate issue, or not, as your wife is not interested in the husband.

 

Couple B - They are your neighbors. If you assume too much, you might have a very unhappy neighbor!

 

Couple C - I would play that as a seperate issue as well.

 

Assume that this party will be pure vanilla. To do otherwise might find you without possibilities with all three couples. Remember, most couples are pretty discreat in their play. To bring the subject up or try to push things in that direction might force one couple, or all of them, to back off because they don't want the others to know.

 

However, if something does happen, be damn careful, alcohol in a HT can cause hands to wonder and creat one hell of a mess the next morning!

[ShellyM 0]

I'm with them; I'd assume nothing in regards to swinging. Number one, mixing swinging and neighbors is like mixing swinging with existing vanilla friends; mad mojo. Like mixing sex and the workplace, in my opinion its usually best to keep them separate. Just my opinion. Now if they blatantly say "we are swingers" thats one thing...but I would not start getting frisky until something like that happened.

[bill&sabrina 22]

Tread lightly, but if everyone has agreed to naked hot tubbing, I think some playing could happen.

 

Bill

[GerdOEvert 51]

Swinging with neighbors is Dangerous. I think even having a swinging party at your

own home is dangerous. We tried a party at our place and lived to regret it. There may

be some settings that are fine, but they probably are few and far between.

 

As to getting it on with close friends and neighbors, better one one one first at a hotel or motel as couples, and then see where it leads. You need only to have one couple who is offended or a gossip to get the word out all over the world.

 

We were very discreet in our active days, and were surprised three or four times by

comments from people we had no inking knew of our interests. The best for us

was the local swing club.

 

T & E

[ShellyM 0]

Swinging with neighbors is Dangerous. I think even having a swinging party at your

own home is dangerous. We tried a party at our place and lived to regret it. There may

be some settings that are fine, but they probably are few and far between.

 

As to getting it on with close friends and neighbors, better one one one first at a hotel or motel as couples, and then see where it leads. You need only to have one couple who is offended or a gossip to get the word out all over the world.

 

We were very discreet in our active days, and were surprised three or four times by

comments from people we had no inking knew of our interests. The best for us

was the local swing club.

 

T & E

 

T&E, We are the same way. We aren't necessarily discreet because of our jobs and we have face pics in our public area on sls. However, we are in a pretty small town and I have a huge family....family lives 2 houses away as a matter of fact so we do not entertain at home. Did I say nosey family? LOL If you have gastric issues they call and ask if you need Tums LOL.

[Lee55 15]

Thank you everyone for your replies. It is much appreciated - please keep them coming!

 

I wanted to address some of the comments made. I agree that it is probably a bit too risky to swing with the neighbors. As far as playing with friends, my SO would be much, much more comfortable doing so with people she knows. I've heard numerous times that many couples that are friends often wind up playing together. So I guess my main question is how do these couples bring up the subject, or what situation brings this to fruition? In my scenario, I think couple C would be the ones we would approach since we do know them, although not as well as the neighbors. I'm sure we can get time alone with them in the hot tub, but I'm not sure of the best way to approach them. And as some of you said, it may be better to do a one on one at some other time. I'm just not sure the best way to handle it with them.

 

T & E - I hear what your saying, and I would definitely agree with you if we were inviting people over that we just met at a club or online. But in this case they are all friends who know where we live and work. So I'm not sure what the difference would be going to a hotel. Please let me know what the pitfalls would be playing at home in this case.

[fun4Ds 1,098]

Personally, I wouldn't want the get together to be anything more than just a dinner with everyone getting to know one another. The hot tub being a bonus for those who enjoy hot tubbing. We have said it before, swinging not only takes good communication between a married couple, but also between couples that are playmates.

 

We see time and time again that the couple to couple communication is either misunderstood or based on assumptions. Your playing on (hopefully) these people are swingers, or at least are open minded about the lifestyle and may want to try it. But unless the swinging is put on the table straight up at dinner or before, This situation could wreck havoc on friends and neighbors.

 

I mean what is to happen now, after dinner and everyone has had a few drinks ? Your naked in the hot tub and you just say hey, we are swingers and we think we are getting the signals that everyone here is too, so lets pick partners ?.

 

Sometimes vanilla people can be pretty flirty with a few drinks, then give misunderstood signals to those of us who actually swing. We have had it happen. Thankfully through good communication on our part, we heard the female half saying "no we don't go that far" yet from her husbands communication we heard "swing on"

 

I think this should be discussed sober at the table, with good communication skills, before checking things out in the hot tub. Find out how everyone feels about the swinging lifestyle first. If you put it out there and find out that maybe they are seasoned swingers, talk about their rules or boundaries. And by all means, share yours. They don't even know your wife isn't bi yet.

 

It sounds like your setting this up with just go with the flow, and see what happens attitude. And if we were a vanilla couple. Thats what it would end up as...a set up

 

Like I say, we feel that a great swinging experience begins with good communication. Not only between us ourselves, but with the couples we play with as well.

 

We hope you have a great party, and see that communication between everyone involved is as important as it should be.

[Alura 2,774]

Fun4Ds is absolutely right. If y'all blindly forge ahead without learning what the others are really thinking, you're apt to find serious trouble.

 

We're not opposed to playing with friends, but they certainly require more open communication that a couple you might run into at a swing club.

 

If it were us in your situation, where we had some indication that the folks might be receptive to the idea, we'd simply ask (at dinner):

 

"Y'know, all y'all seem to be fun and open minded. How do y'all feel about swinging?" Your wife, not you, should ask and the question must be one that can't be answered with "Yes" or "No." Then have a loooong discussion before getting into the spa.

 

Mr. Alura

[ShellyM 0]

As far as playing with friends, my SO would be much, much more comfortable doing so with people she knows.

 

I'm going to give you a piece of advice. I KNOW it sounds like playing with existing friends is going to be a blast cause you know them, you know you have things in common................but hear my words.

 

"You can make great friends from swingers. But you cannot make great swingers from friends."

 

Now, has it been done successfully? Yes. However. I think that alot of people who have done this can tell you that the majority of the time the friendship is awkward after and is never the same. We did this with friends that WERE in the swinging world dabbling; but they were our vanilla friends first. Has never been the same. She and I are good friends still; but she has told me that since she and Jay have had sex she would feel awkward being around him with her husband there...her husband had ED issues (which are normal, he was pretty hesitant and I think took one for their team since she and Jay had great chemistry to be honest) and to this day will not face me. That 4some friendship is over. I have talked to lots of people about this and it pretty much usually ends up that way, or love ensues...

 

Am I saying do NOT do it? No. You do whatever is best for you and your girlfriend and I only wish you the best of luck; however, I would tread lightly if I were you. Best of luck!! And remember to have fun.

[fun4Ds 1,098]

She and I are good friends still; but she has told me that since she and Jay have had sex she would feel awkward being around him with her husband there...her husband had ED issues (which are normal, he was pretty hesitant and I think took one for their team since she and Jay had great chemistry to be honest) and to this day will not face me. That 4some friendship is over.

 

Thats a shame Shelly, especially since you consider yourselves still good friends.

 

But you see, that is what Mrfun4ds was talking about. Couples that fail to be able to have good communication skills between themselves, and the couples they are either potentially playing with, currently playing with, or no longer playing with.

 

lee55, I hope you see that sometimes friends or even just playmates, drift away from one another that might have been long term, because of the lack of good communication. And it is sad in a way. The playmates we have kept long term, sometimes are not just because of the damn good sex.. But because we have good communication with them as playmates.

 

Mrsfun

[ShellyM 0]

thats a shame Shelly, especially since you consider yourselves still good friends:(.

 

Mrs. F, we are still very good friends; it is a shame. Right after she mentioned to me that he was very upset and frustrated with himself because his penis failed to cooperate with his brain...to be honest we sat there and chuckled because it honestly was not a big deal to us. As experienced swingers Jay and I know that this happens sometimes, especially since they were not very active swingers; I felt for him though. I have no idea how bad it must feel to a man knowing that his wife got it good and he was not able to perform at all. So I was more concerned about his ego and how he was feeling and got a good chuckle with her lol. But yeah, ever since that day forget it, not a word. He used to talk to me on the phone when she and I was at Taco Bell for lunch or something lol, now nothing. So I know first hand how bringing the sexual element into an existing friendship can really throw a monkey wrench into the situation. Its a shame too, because she and I never gave it a second thought lol...but telling that to a man is another thing so we just leave well enough alone

[Alura 2,774]

Bravo, Mrs. Fun! It really isn't what one does but how one does it... and how much effort all involved are willing to invest.

 

Mr. Alura

[ShellyM 0]

Bravo, Mrs. Fun! It really isn't what one does but how one does it... and how much effort all involved are willing to invest.

 

Mr. Alura

 

This is absolute truth; however with him, I feel it best to leave him alone. His wife relayed the fact that I was absolutely not upset in any way so I think kind of leaving well enough alone is best. He is doing his thing and I do mine and I think thats best lol. But yes, you are absolutely correct; we will not be playing with vanilla friends in the future....you live and you learn!!!

[lovinher 505]

Right after she mentioned to me that he was very upset and frustrated with himself because his penis failed to cooperate with his brain..[/shelly]

 

Jesus Christ, no wonder the guy has problems. Don't women realize that when it becomes an issue like that the problem snowballs? I know she is your friend but she sounds like a real bitch. When a guy is worried or thinking about getting it up, it don't happen usually. I take medication sometimes that can affect my buddy. If I forget I'm on it...no problem most of the time. If I go in thinking "I hope the med's don't mess with my buddy tonight" I'm screwed.

 

Back to the topic. I'd love to see Lovinhim do a couple of our lady friends but I wouldn't want to risk our friendship doing them myself. Too many horror stories around here for that. A quick search by the OP would or should show him that.

[ShellyM 0]

Right after she mentioned to me that he was very upset and frustrated with himself because his penis failed to cooperate with his brain..[/shelly]

 

Jesus Christ, no wonder the guy has problems. Don't women realize that when it becomes an issue like that the problem snowballs? I know she is your friend but she sounds like a real bitch. When a guy is worried or thinking about getting it up, it don't happen usually. I take medication sometimes that can affect my buddy. If I forget I'm on it...no problem most of the time. If I go in thinking "I hope the med's don't mess with my buddy tonight" I'm screwed.

 

Back to the topic. I'd love to see Lovinhim do a couple of our lady friends but I wouldn't want to risk our friendship doing them myself. Too many horror stories around here for that. A quick search by the OP would or should show him that.

 

Nah, shes cool; he wasn't there when she told me that lol. I think she wanted to explain to me why he was no longer talking to me. but naw, shes really cool.

[fun4Ds 1,098]

This is absolute truth; however with him, I feel it best to leave him alone. His wife relayed the fact that I was absolutely not upset in any way so I think kind of leaving well enough alone is best. He is doing his thing and I do mine and I think thats best lol. But yes, you are absolutely correct; we will not be playing with vanilla friends in the future....you live and you learn!!!

 

You see for us, Shelly, we don't do that as far one partner speaking to another for either of us. That can come off far too easy as apples to oranges, or she said you heard....Bad communication skills.

 

Bravo, Mrs. Fun! It really isn't what one does but how one does it... and how much effort all involved are willing to invest.

 

Mr. Alura

 

Thanks Mr.Alura. You see what we are trying to say. Sure its not always ground breaking sex. But that doesn't mean that it can't be fun, sensual, exciting or even comical and still everyone leaves on a good note, as long term friends.

[ShellyM 0]

fun, I see your point; but you have to know him in order to understand why I feel that its best to leave well enough alone. He is a ummm, how should I say it...a good ole boy lol. For me to walk up to him and talk with him about it would make things muuuuuch worse. Much. Its been almost a year now and he is fine, so I honestly think that if I were to have talked with him (like I normally would in truth and have with other gentlemen) it would have caused all kinds of problems. You are right, its probably not the best way to handle it. But they have not been in the lifestyle since from what I understand. In truth it should have never happened in the first place, but it did. This is the main reason why you never take one for the team; both he and I did on that one and it was the wrong thing to do. But again, you live and you learn from it. But yes normally I would say you are dead on right; communication is key. But in this particular case it would have freaked him out to even talk about his issue that I honestly think their marriage or sex life at least would have been affected.

[mark069 15]

My main concern is how to either bring up the subejct, or how to play it out so that playing becomes a strong possibility. .

 

As others have mentioend, the possibility of things going really badly is high since you don't have enough information on everyone. I would treat this first party as an information gathering session and assume that no sex will occur.

 

Don't try to force anything. Once you know for sure who's into swinging, have a second party where you can maybe be a little more explicit in the invites.

 

If your lucky, the non-swingers may pick up on the swinger vibe (everyone naked in the hot tub is a good start) and may depart the party early leaving you to safely broach the subject with those who you are sure definitely swing. But by that time, it's late and these couple(s) may be tired and want to go home.....

[Lee55 15]

I'm going to give you a piece of advice. I KNOW it sounds like playing with existing friends is going to be a blast cause you know them, you know you have things in common................but hear my words.

 

"You can make great friends from swingers. But you cannot make great swingers from friends."

 

Now, has it been done successfully? Yes. However. I think that alot of people who have done this can tell you that the majority of the time the friendship is awkward after and is never the same. We did this with friends that WERE in the swinging world dabbling; but they were our vanilla friends first. Has never been the same. She and I are good friends still; but she has told me that since she and Jay have had sex she would feel awkward being around him with her husband there...her husband had ED issues (which are normal, he was pretty hesitant and I think took one for their team since she and Jay had great chemistry to be honest) and to this day will not face me. That 4some friendship is over. I have talked to lots of people about this and it pretty much usually ends up that way, or love ensues...

 

Am I saying do NOT do it? No. You do whatever is best for you and your girlfriend and I only wish you the best of luck; however, I would tread lightly if I were you. Best of luck!! And remember to have fun.

 

Shelly - thank you for the advice. We are new to this, so we definitely need guidance. The more I think about it, the more I agree that it isn't worth the risk to play with our neighbors or long time friends.

 

The dilema for us though is that my SO at this time only wants to play with people we know. She does not want to go to a club as of yet, or meet people on-line. Hopefully that will change in the future, but that's the limitation for now.

 

What would your advice be for "Couple C"? They are not established friends, and we only know them through a few social gatherings that our neighbors have invited us both to.

 

I also agree with bringing up the subject during dinner. I'm actually thinking of asking couple C about their friends that are swingers and see where that conversation goes. I figure this would be less risky since they had previously brought up the subject. I'm just not sure whether it would be better to bring up the subject at dinner, or sidebar where we are only talking to couple C.

 

Again, I apprciate all of the input.

[fun4Ds 1,098]

I also agree with bringing up the subject during dinner. I'm actually thinking of asking couple C about their friends that are swingers and see where that conversation goes. I figure this would be less risky since they had previously brought up the subject. I'm just not sure whether it would be better to bring up the subject at dinner, or sidebar where we are only talking to couple C.

 

Again, I apprciate all of the input.

 

We try to be cautious and its hard sometimes to not say to much to vanilla couples. lol

 

It's easy to mention things without giving your self away. Like the Aluras' say for instance, let your wife bring things up maybe. If not, just slightly mention that you have heard of the lifestyle and wondered what they might know or feel about it. you don't have to give anything more than your curiosity thats all.

[Alura 2,774]

 

its easy to mention things without giving your self away. like the aluras' says let your wife bring things up maybe. if not just slightly mention that you have heard of the lifestyle and wondered what they might know or feel about it. you don't have to give anything more than your curiosity thats all;).

 

Sorry, I forgot to mention: When you ask a question, always SMILE. It will take the edge out of your nervous voice and make the question less threatening. If you don't believe me, try smiling the next time you answer the telephone and see how often the caller says, "Well, you certainly sound happy!" Practice asking beforehand. That will also make you feel more assured.

 

We've found that when we ask, "How do y'all feel about swinging?" we will get a question in return. For example, "Are y'all into that?" Big mistake on their part! Never ask a question that can be answered with "yes" or "no."

 

To which, smiling kindly with twinkling eyes, we'll say, "Now, it's not polite to answer a question with a question. We asked you first. But, I'll answer anyway. I wouldn't say we're INTO swinging, but we tend to be adventurous and we've discussed the subject. We find it intriguing. How do y'all feel about it?"

 

Suppose you get a really bad response such as: "How dare y'all ask us such a question??? We would never swap wives!!!!"

 

"Oh, I'm sorry! I didn't mean to offend; just to open up a different subject. How do y'all feel about Harry Potter movies?" Never, ever, bring the subject up again!

 

The goal is not to convince but to find out how they feel about swinging. Tread lightly.

 

Mr. Alura

[Maxgirth 15]

i whole heartedly agree with not playing with neighbors!

[Alura 2,774]

Maxgirth wrote:

 

i whole heartedly agree with not playing with neighbors!

 

A lot of people agree with you, Maxgirth, but that's not the question Lee55 asked. It was:

 

My main concern is how to either bring up the subejct, or how to play it out so that playing becomes a strong possibility. The subject of swinging has never come up with couple B, and I don't know couple C well enough. I would like to just bring up the possibility, but I'm afraid of offending couples B & C.

 

I definitely need some guidance on this as it is new to me.

 

I appreciate any info.

 

In my opinion, we Swingers Board members often overlook the main question about which members ask for advice and, in fact, answer another. It's true that we hear a lot of horror stories about swinging with neighbors, previously vanilla friends and even coworkers. But there are some very nice friendships that have thrived when taken sexual.

 

In my opinion, (and others... see posts above) the deciding factor between success and failure is not closeness but quality of communication and degree of honesty between not just spouses, but all people involved.

 

Your advice is valid and needs to be offered, but it was my impression that the option of not broaching the subject had been considered and disregarded. Lee55 wanted to know how to ask the question. Perhaps I'm wrong.

 

Mr. Alura