My husband, his confidence, and shy vs. nonshy women

[Guest Unregistered]

This is the female half writing. I do most of the stuff online in fact. I was the one with prior experiences before we were together. I'm the kind of woman who never seems to hurt for male attention since I was 13- not "perfect" but very curvy and fairly attractive. My husband is outgoing and handsome, but he's been going through a rough period within himself- just not feeling at the top of his game professionally or physically. I think he's brilliant and beautiful. And regularly tell him so.

 

We have some amazing experiences together, but a common theme has unfortunately been that most women are simply more shy than I am in the bedroom. Because he's a gentleman, he never wants to be pushy and has often felt that the woman wasn't into him when in fact they were, but just much more inherently shy than myself. Meanwhile, I'm trying to enjoy myself (with him and with another couple- I'm bi and our swinging time is my only time I get to be with another woman). I never want to leave him out, nor do I try to, but he's had that feeling at times.

 

We met up with a fabulous couple last night and I had a great time, but at the end of the evening when they left, he told me he felt she wasn't at all into him and again was feeling left out. I made a strong conscious effort to pay him a lot of attention and probably 80% of my attention was toward him. He says he doesn't feel jealous, but left out. We got an e-mail today from the couple saying what a great time they had and including how handsome and what a gentleman she thought my husband was and also how after that first playtime happens for them, she tends to become far less shy. I'd love to get together with them again, but right now he's thinkig about it.

 

As for me, I'm kind of at a loss. I want to make him happy, but I don't know what else to do at the moment. Should we ONLY play with couples with women we know are as assertive as me? I'm leaning toward a three month break to re-group and suggested that and he's thinking about that as well. I love my husband and do not want to hurt him, but my gut feeling is he needs to get his own psyche together and build up his confidence again. We've been swinging almost two years by the way, so not newbies.

 

Sorry for the anonymous thing, but we have the same name here as our profile name and I do not want to offend anyone or be a potential "drama couple".

[lustylearning 705]

I wonder if what your husband really needs is more time in the lifestyle. The confidence problem can diminish with greater experience. Just a thought...

 

It sounds like the email from the other couple addressed the shyness of the other female. Your husband should probably take that as a very positive signal:)

[NotSorry 155]

if she said he's handsome, a gentleman, and wants to get together again... what more of a positive signal does he need?

 

mr notsorry

[looking4ward 15]

I agree with 'not sorry'. They should meet that couple again and enjoy themselves. The woman is ready for him and he might have a great time. What better for his ego?

[two4youinswva 3,068]

My husband is outgoing and handsome, but he's been going through a rough period within himself- just not feeling at the top of his game professionally or physically.

Lots of men (including myself) tend to tie their self-worth to how well they are doing in their professional careers. When our careers are doing well, we're the "Cock of the walk". When they're not going so well, we feel as useless as tits on a bull. So, you're smart not to underestimate the impact career issues can have on a man, generally speaking.

 

I'm leaning toward a three month break to re-group and suggested that and he's thinking about that as well. I love my husband and do not want to hurt him, but my gut feeling is he needs to get his own psyche together and build up his confidence again.

I don't think it's a bad idea. Three months isn't that long, and it will allow you two time to focus on getting his mojo back. It may even take a little longer than that.

 

FWIW, the letter you received from the other couple sounded very promising.

[MrkLin 393]

What they said^^^! The other couple's e-mail should help quite a bit, but I do agree that a break in the action until he's feeling better about himself, life, the universe, and everything might be what he needs. It happens. We all can't be operating at 100% all of the time. Still, that e-mail should be a bit of an ego boost.

[The Fuse 1,012]

I am in a similar situation. I am outgoing and can be assertive, while my husband errs too far on the side of caution. He is a very handsome guy, but unlike the OP's husband, he is shy. I can say from long experience that it does no good to point out to him that the other lady is obviously interested in him. He knows this is true, but still has a lot of trouble being the pursuer. And since the other lady often wants to be be pursued (and who can blame her?), it has gone poorly more than a few times. Recently the other lady directly told me, "I need more than a smile". I think we would have seen that couple again if Mr. Fuse could have been more assertive.

 

Again, like the OP, I almost feel that we should limit ourselves to couples where the other lady has a strong, outgoing personality and doesn't have a strong need to be pursued. I have tried to build his confidence and provide specific examples of things he should do or say.

 

He really has to expand his comfort zone to fix this problem. He knows it is a problem, and keeps talking about "being aware", and "trying", and "making an effort". He gets angry with me when I suggest that all those things are passive, and he needs to be active. And he really wants to improve himself in this area.

 

I have to say I never expected to be in the position of being angry with my husband for being reluctant to seduce other women.

 

If anyone has advice that is outside the box, I would appreciate it. I don't want to rule out couples where the lady wants to be chased a little -- because that is almost everyone, and because it is a normal, reasonable thing to want.

 

Help!

[Chicup 42]

Sure sure, so I'm the out going husband who married the shy wife.

 

I have to say I never expected to be in the position of being angry with my husband for being reluctant to seduce other women.

 

Heh, thats my feeling in reverse I don't have a cure either.

[The Fuse 1,012]

Sure sure, so I'm the out going husband who married the shy wife.

 

I have to say I never expected to be in the position of being angry with my husband for being reluctant to seduce other women.

 

Heh, thats my feeling in reverse I don't have a cure either.

At least according to accepted norms, your wife can expect the man to pursue her. Most men find this somewhat natural or at least accept that it is their role. Yes, I'm being sexist. Men and women are different. But I still can sympathize.

 

By the way, that new avatar is g*damn mesmerizing. Make it stop, so I can go do something else... anything else!

[Chicup 42]

At least according to accepted norms, your wife can expect the man to pursue her. Most men find this somewhat natural or at least accept that it is their role. Yes, I'm being sexist. Men and women are different. But I still can sympathize.

 

Except in swinging, an aggressive female helps, a ton

 

 

 

By the way, that new avatar is g*damn mesmerizing. Make it stop, so I can go do something else... anything else!

 

Thats part of my evil plan

[The Fuse 1,012]

Except in swinging, an aggressive female helps, a ton

Yes, it does, no argument.

 

But please, does anyone have any help for the OP (or for me)? I am usually pretty creative but I have no more ideas for this situation.

[Chicup 42]

Yes, it does, no argument.

 

But please, does anyone have any help for the OP (or for me)? I am usually pretty creative but I have no more ideas for this situation.

 

As we speak my wife is filling out a new profile for us at my request. Seeing if getting her involved directly helps with the confidence part.

[swinging_in_NE 15]

This is the OP (I had forgotten I had a pseudonym last year when facing another problem). My husband has a few issues on several levels that I know is affecting him. The first being the career stuff (like I mentioned before). He took a pay cut to change careers a couple of years back and he's not enjoying it as much as he thought (although much MORE than the former career. However, I do make significantly more now. The couple we were with obviously were pretty well off and though both have good incomes, we're still rebuilding somewhat after our prior divorces five years ago.

 

Another issue has to do with past situations where it seemed like the couple was there for a threesome and just kind of "put up with him" without the other woman having much interest. I did my best to focus on him in those situations and tried to make the best of it, but he'd feel so left out afterward that it was like a huge blow to his self esteem. So upset he lost sight of my pleasure and enjoyment and realizing the pleasure I have with other women. It's like it became my fault. Maybe I should have stopped in the middle of things and I would have if he spoke up, but jeesh, I can only control my actions, not those of other women.

 

I just think everything came together really badly in his head. To top it all off we were grocery shopping today and the college kid cashier blatantly hit on me right in front of him. I know how he thinks and right now his insecurity button is going off about money and his looks (he thinks he's fat now with a 34" waist).

 

We have plans (which have been set for the last 6 weeks) with some other friends we've already been with in a couple weeks. She's very assertive. This will not be an issue with them. If they were willing, I'd love to let her have some one on one time with him. I think he could use it. Then after that, a little break and I personally think it's time for him to talk with someone (like therapy wise). Obviously his self esteem issues are affecting more than just our swinging, but communication as a whole.

[swinging_in_NE 15]

I am in a similar situation. I am outgoing and can be assertive, while my husband errs too far on the side of caution. He is a very handsome guy, but unlike the OP's husband, he is shy. I can say from long experience that it does no good to point out to him that the other lady is obviously interested in him. He knows this is true, but still has a lot of trouble being the pursuer. And since the other lady often wants to be be pursued (and who can blame her?), it has gone poorly more than a few times. Recently the other lady directly told me, "I need more than a smile". I think we would have seen that couple again if Mr. Fuse could have been more assertive.

 

Again, like the OP, I almost feel that we should limit ourselves to couples where the other lady has a strong, outgoing personality and doesn't have a strong need to be pursued. I have tried to build his confidence and provide specific examples of things he should do or say.

 

He really has to expand his comfort zone to fix this problem. He knows it is a problem, and keeps talking about "being aware", and "trying", and "making an effort". He gets angry with me when I suggest that all those things are passive, and he needs to be active. And he really wants to improve himself in this area.

 

I have to say I never expected to be in the position of being angry with my husband for being reluctant to seduce other women.

 

If anyone has advice that is outside the box, I would appreciate it. I don't want to rule out couples where the lady wants to be chased a little -- because that is almost everyone, and because it is a normal, reasonable thing to want.

 

Help!

 

This is the OP. Mine is outgoing, but SUCH a gentleman, he always waits for the lady to take the lead. Some women just don't. Most women certainly don't as much as I do. What gets to me is that somehow this seems to be made as something I'm doing wrong by him. For crying out loud, she's there with her husband, boundaries are already communicated, no one's going to get too upset if you gently lead her hand to your cock after going down on her for 20 minutes! The thing about being a gentleman is he attracts the very women who are more shy. We've had more assertive women say to him directly, "Will you please just fuck me already."

[TNT 1,155]

As for me, I'm kind of at a loss. I want to make him happy, but I don't know what else to do at the moment. Should we ONLY play with couples with women we know are as assertive as me? I'm leaning toward a three month break to re-group and suggested that and he's thinking about that as well. I love my husband and do not want to hurt him, but my gut feeling is he needs to get his own psyche together and build up his confidence again. We've been swinging almost two years by the way, so not newbies.

 

 

Playing with couples where the female half is a bit assertive isn't a bad idea. Or...you could do like the wife of one couple we played with who had a shy husband.

 

Her and I talked a bit before we played and she told me he was a bit shy so I might need to take the lead. I was glad to have her go ahead. They weren't exactly newbies but, hadn't been playing as long as Ted and I and I was glad to know that it was okay to do what I wanted and that both of them would be okay with it. It did help that I'm a bit assertive myself and I do enjoy the shy men...call me strange but, it's nice to see them come out of their shell and I have no problems whatsoever leading the way. It's been my experience that it's those shy ones that are the real freaks and the most fun once you get them warmed up

 

Maybe the next time you two are with a couple, take the time to let the other female know that he is shy but really wants to enjoy himself and that her taking the lead is appreciated and okay with both of you. If she's not willing to do this, then maybe they're not the right couple to play with at the time. I think, the more assertive women he comes in contact with over time will help build his confidence level and he'll eventually realize that it's okay to be assertive himself where women in swinging are concerned.

 

As to taking a break...that's never a bad idea either. If you two enjoy going out and enjoy the atmosphere of clubs, continue to do that but, take the pressure off of both of you by stating...No playing, we're just here for US. Even in those times where things aren't going good at work, a night out reminds you that...yeah, I may hate my job right now but, it's allowing me to be able to go out, have a good time and enjoy life, so it's not that bad.

 

Self esteem/confidence issues are always hard to deal with, especially when it's someone we love and their having a hard time. I think the best thing you can do is just be there to listen when they want to talk, reassure them they're loved and wanted and encourage them to make changes if needed...including getting outside help.

 

 

Teresa

[JustAskJulie 2,595]

I feel like Teresa has read our book. Pet is a bit on the shy side, so I totally know where you are coming from. I am assertive and tend to take the lead in things related to swinging... but at the same time I always go to him to make sure he's ok with where things are at or the couple that we may be looking to play with or whatever before anything happens.

 

Like Teresa's friend, I've been known on a few occasions when there's a couple we are both interested in to take the woman aside and let her know that we are very much interested but that he is a bit shy at taking the lead, so the more assertive she is the better. It's worked out well for us and we've had some great playtimes from doing so.

 

Also, like Teresa, I tend to prefer the more reserved guys, always have. It's the guys who have no idea how great they are that are the best ones in my book (that's just one of the reasons I love my Pet). Perhaps, having your husband read this thread may make him feel better - just knowing that shyness alone is not enough to keep us away

 

(fyi - if you want to reply to this thread and still stay anonymous, just start a new thread with the same title and we'll merge it).

[lustylearning 705]

It's the guys who have no idea how great they are that are the best ones in my book... shyness alone is not enough to keep us away

 

So, so true.

[iapr 24]

This is going to be a long post but please try to read it thoroughly and try to understand what it is I am saying.

 

Throughout this thread you have been asking what YOU can do and what kind of women YOU can pick out for him and some of the other posters have suggested who they think YOU should choose for him so that these other women will pursue him and court him so that THEY can take the lead. That goes completely against the natural order of the male species.

 

 

- Let's go ahead and be sexist here, men need to feel like men and part of that can come down to letting them make the moves and letting them be the pursuers and the seducers....even if it takes them a long time to get around to it. Others have suggested setting him up with more aggressive women and for some men that may be just the ticket. BUT FOR OTHERS it will make them feel that much more self conscious and inadequate.

 

Perhaps he will come around more if you tone it down and behave a little more demure and let him take the lead in social and sexual matters at home and while in lifestyle venues. You may find it painfully slow and inactive for awhile but perhaps it would give him a chance to velcro his balls back on and feel like a man again. Let him approach who he finds attractive and interesting and let him take a lead in the social engagements.

 

- Another thought to consider is instead of basing your contacts around strongly bisexual women where you are going to be the center piece, perhaps become more engaging with some couples where the female is predominantly straight to where she will have more innate interest in him than in you. It's bad enough when the ego and masculinity is feeling a little flat but when your wife is picking up more chicks than you it can really rub your ego in the dirt that much more.

 

- You said you feel like he blames you in part for some of his issues. DOES HE? DOES HE HAVE VALID REASON? In general I believe most problems in the lifestyle originate from within the dynamics of the primary relationship. I'm not pointing fingers or trying to appoint blame here but are you often the assertive one and the one that makes things happen in your relationship in general? (that's my politically correct way of asking if you are the one that wears the pants at home?)

 

While you may believe you are doing the right thing by taking some of the load off of him and you may believe that if you don't do something and leave it up to him that nothing will get done, you may actually be making the problem worse by making him feel more self conscious and inadequate as opposed to helping. Many men feel emasculated and defeated when their wives take over decision making and start calling the shots.

 

Perhaps instead of YOU doing all these things to help make him feel better about himself, maybe you should sit back and do nothing...nothing at all. Do nothing and let him start making some of the decisions and let him start doing what he wants to do and what he thinks should be done.

 

I have the feeling you are a go-getter and that it will seem painfully slow and awkward to you to let him go at his own pace and to approach people of his choosing in his own manner but that is what men do. The natural order is for men to approach the women that THEY like and that THEY find attractive and then THEY do THEIR maiting dance and try to court the females of their choosing.

 

Often times in the lifestyle those decisions are intentionally or unintentionally turned over to the female half and some men do not function well with that.

 

So bottom line, instead of you emasculating him more by you trying to find the solutions to his problems. Sit back and don't do anything and let him be a man and problem solve and make decisions for himself and take his own actions on his own behalf.

 

It worth some serious consideration.