Would like to begin with Soft Swap

[Baconheads 438]

Nice to meet you all, here’s where we are all at. T is my name, the dude, T & A we are. Has a nice ring to it don’t you think? Baconhead is an old summer camp nickname I just pulled off of the top of my head. Don’t ask why, don’t know. Maybe true anonymity. So we have never swung…swang? Swinged? If it were my choice, we would so be swingers. I fell in love with the lifestyle when I read my first Heinlein science fiction novel. A, however, would never think of such a thing, as she does not like wearing a skimpy (not thong) bikini on a deserted beach, even though she has a great body. She has said that sex is a very personal thing that shouldn’t be shared with anyone.

 

So here is the deal. We are going to Hawaii with two couples next week. The sexual banter is very thick with these people. They stayed after a party after the other guests left at our house a few weeks ago, presumably so that the conversation could get a little more bawdy. You all should have heard it after McSteamy broke his you-know-what on “Greys Anatomy.” [Read “McScreamy!]

 

Anyway, we’re staying with one of the couples in their condo (Two bedroom) and I would like to see something evolve into a same room, same partner scenario, but I know doggone well that if I suggest it, it will fall on the floor like a stinking turd. It has to be the girls’ idea, or at least think it’s their idea, for the thing to fly.

 

Any suggestions?

[ncmd_couple 597]

Well, my suggestion to you, based upon what you have put in your post, it to maintain the fantasy in your head, and just be smart during this trip. Being smart means not getting drunk (and lose your good judgement) or try to push your fantasy into reality. Enjoy your trip, don't have any expectations, and at the very least, you will have a great trip with your lovely wife and friends.

[Baconheads 438]

That's what I was thinking, but also to make just enough noise with Mrs. BH to keep the other couple interested. The gal from the other couple was amazed at one time that we don't use toys and that I could keep my wife satisfied without them.

[ncmd_couple 597]

Well, that doesn't speak well of the other guy's skills. You might want to consider if this is the right couple for a first experience for your wife in the first place. As an example, on our first full swap I was having a great time with the lady, but the guy had the sex skills of a brick and my wife did not have a good time. Just something for you to consider.

[Baconheads 438]

Yeah, they could be all talk, but I don't think so. At least we could watch them use their toys while Mrs. BH goes off like a tea kettle! Ahhh, I have a vivid imagination.

[VANudistcpl 109]

Baconhead, if you haven't brought up the subject during sex as part of a fantasy, then during the trip just keep it as a fanasty. I know from experience that if you don't things don't go very well before during and after. If you slowly bring up the soft swap or even watching another couple during sex if the seed might be planted and it might eventually happen. That is how Ms. Nudist and I started.

[Chicup 42]

Nice to meet you all, here’s where we are all at. T is my name, the dude, T & A we are. Has a nice ring to it don’t you think? Baconhead is an old summer camp nickname I just pulled off of the top of my head. Don’t ask why, don’t know. Maybe true anonymity. So we have never swung…swang? Swinged? If it were my choice, we would so be swingers. I fell in love with the lifestyle when I read my first Heinlein science fiction novel. A, however, would never think of such a thing, as she does not like wearing a skimpy (not thong) bikini on a deserted beach, even though she has a great body. She has said that sex is a very personal thing that shouldn’t be shared with anyone.

 

So here is the deal. We are going to Hawaii with two couples next week. The sexual banter is very thick with these people. They stayed after a party after the other guests left at our house a few weeks ago, presumably so that the conversation could get a little more bawdy. You all should have heard it after McSteamy broke his you-know-what on “Greys Anatomy.” [Read “McScreamy!]

 

Anyway, we’re staying with one of the couples in their condo (Two bedroom) and I would like to see something evolve into a same room, same partner scenario, but I know doggone well that if I suggest it, it will fall on the floor like a stinking turd. It has to be the girls’ idea, or at least think it’s their idea, for the thing to fly.

 

Any suggestions?

 

Good old Robert Heinlein, making nerds into swingers for 40 years. I got my idea on swinging from his books as well.

 

If you are going to Maui I have to suggest you go to little beach. Its a very well known and very beautiful nude beach. The trick is to go to big beach (which is very nice) and you walk north up the beach, over a little cinder cone (there will be a good number of people going to and from easy to find) and you are at a very beautiful beach.

 

Now I would NOT suggest you go there with your friends the first time, she might be to embarrassed and feel the need to protest to maintain what she sees as proper behavior. The first time I went with my wife we were very newbie swingers but Mrs. Chicup was to shy to go nude in public like that. Well since EVERY woman was at least topless, that made her stand out for not being topless and she removed her top. Finally by the end of the week she was going full monty and had a blast. If you go Sunday its full of music playing hippies which can be quite fun to watch. There is no rule that you have to be nude there either so she can warm up to it (or not) at her own pace. Its such a nice beach that there is no real reason not to hang out there beyond the nude bit, so it won't give her to many secondary reasons to leave. Be warned though the currents are strong, (and thats true of all the beaches on that side of the island) so don't leave standing areas in the water unless you are strong swimmers.

 

Oh and whatever you do DON'T push play of any kind with your friends without her agreeing to it prior, and sober.

[Day&Night 15]

that shouldn’t be shared with anyone.

 

but I know doggone well that if I suggest it, it will fall on the floor like a stinking turd.

 

Any suggestions?

 

 

Holy Triple Threat Batman !

 

This looks like a scenario to do three things:

 

1. Lose a wife and forever turn her off to the idea of swinging

2. Lose some friends, that you have no idea if they are swingers or not

3. Ruin a perfectly good vacation

 

I say leave it in your head as a fantasy unitl you have discussed it with your wife.

 

I have several vanilla friends where we banter back and forth about sex and stuff all the time at parties ect. But I know for a fact that they would never be swingers.

[slevin 1,374]

I get the impression that you haven't brought this up with your wife at all yet. That is the first step, well before trying to setup some elaborate plans to make something happen with your friends. Even then, I definitely recommend /against/ swinging with your friends. Lots of info on here about the good and bad sides of doing that.

[iapr 24]

Ok, lets all take a little time out for a reality check here. There are a number of red flags here that are just flapping in the breeze and all of them are falling in the Danger Will Robinson zone.

 

#1. From what you have said of your wife, she is not swinger material. Period. If she has strong beliefs that sex is sacred and only to be shared between spouses, that is not a platform from which you can readily build a swinging relationship. Every woman has some reservations and questions when swinging is first brought up but if someone has strong beliefs against recreational sex in general there isn't much that can be said or done to work around that.

 

#2. Trying to seduce traditional vanilla friends into a sexual situation is ALWAYS a bad idea and puts three separate relationships in jepardy. You are your wife's, Their marriage and your relationship with them. Read through a few pages of topics here and you will see that screwing friends almost always turns out bad and you will also see that all of the most knowledgable and experienced posters almost always strongly discourage sex between traditional vanilla friends.

 

#3. If you know that your suggesting it will fall on the floor like a stinking turd then you can bet the farm that if you try to underhandly scam something into happening then it will blow up like a frigging shit bomb. Using dishonesty, deception and schemes is 100% guarenteed to piss everyone off and cause lots of pain and turmoil and the one that is going to have the most crap dripping off his nose after the shit bomb goes off is you.

 

Successfull legitimate swingers deal with things out in the open and on the table with honesty, communication, respect and courtesy to all and informed consent is paramount. What you are dreaming up here is little more than a fraternity schoolboy prank to try and score a little extra ass and get your jollys at other people's expense.

 

Bad idea.

 

Enjoy your Heinlein books and enjoy the fantasys but keep your marriage and your friendships intact and keep your hands to yourself.

[Baconheads 438]

Thanks for the info, guys. I think you are all correct that if my wife isn't hot for it ahead of time, bringing it up spur of the moment while on vacation would be a mistake. The suggestion would have to come from one of the ladies to be a consideration for my wife at this point, in which case, I can only hope and fantasize and think really positive.

 

It's not really my fantasy to play with the couples involved, although I wouldn't have the sense to turn it down of it were offered sincerely. I was thinking of more a same room, same partner thing. Worse, I could be being tested, like her asking me if I wanted to play with them, only to find out it was a ruse to test my faithfulness.

 

We did go to Little Beach about five years ago, for our twentieth; I went nude, she did not. As a total mood killer, she asked, "Is it everything Ablout that you imagined?" About that time, I got up and left.

 

We are going to the big island this time around, there may be some deserted beaches way south. Cross your fingers for me!

[Baconheads 438]

Ok, lets all take a little time out for a reality check here. There are a number of red flags here that are just flapping in the breeze and all of them are falling in the Danger Will Robinson zone.

 

#1. From what you have said of your wife, she is not swinger material. Period. If she has strong beliefs that sex is sacred and only to be shared between spouses, that is not a platform from which you can readily build a swinging relationship. Every woman has some reservations and questions when swinging is first brought up but if someone has strong beliefs against recreational sex in general there isn't much that can be said or done to work around that.

 

#2. Trying to seduce traditional vanilla friends into a sexual situation is ALWAYS a bad idea and puts three separate relationships in jepardy. You are your wife's, Their marriage and your relationship with them. Read through a few pages of topics here and you will see that screwing friends almost always turns out bad and you will also see that all of the most knowledgable and experienced posters almost always strongly discourage sex between traditional vanilla friends.

 

#3. If you know that your suggesting it will fall on the floor like a stinking turd then you can bet the farm that if you try to underhandly scam something into happening then it will blow up like a frigging shit bomb. Using dishonesty, deception and schemes is 100% guarenteed to piss everyone off and cause lots of pain and turmoil and the one that is going to have the most crap dripping off his nose after the shit bomb goes off is you.

 

Successfull legitimate swingers deal with things out in the open and on the table with honesty, communication, respect and courtesy to all and informed consent is paramount. What you are dreaming up here is little more than a fraternity schoolboy prank to try and score a little extra ass and get your jollys at other people's expense.

 

Bad idea.

 

Enjoy your Heinlein books and enjoy the fantasys but keep your marriage and your friendships intact and keep your hands to yourself.

 

As I said, no suggestions will come from me. Too much is at stake to risk it. One card played wrong and I lose my wife, family, all of my friends, and my business reputation *when* the story gets out back home.

 

Thank you all, your wisdom is appreciated.

[Chicup 42]

We did go to Little Beach about five years ago, for our twentieth; I went nude, she did not. As a total mood killer, she asked, "Is it everything Ablout that you imagined?" About that time, I got up and left.

 

Yea I think you are hosed. There needs to be SOME spark there on her own, and she doesn't seem to have it.

[2plus2fun 143]

I wish I had a dollar for every guy who contacted us that is in the exact same situation as you... my advice is... if you like being married... forget the Heinlein novels and look for a new hobby.

[Baconheads 438]

I wish I had a dollar for every guy who contacted us that is in the exact same situation as you... my advice is... if you like being married... forget the Heinlein novels and look for a new hobby.

 

I'd give you a dollar! If it would help. Again, I don't see anything i could say that would change her tune, and most likely destroy some of the trust we have together.

[sexcupid 809]

We did go to Little Beach about five years ago, for our twentieth; I went nude, she did not. As a total mood killer, she asked, "Is it everything Ablout that you imagined?" About that time, I got up and left.

 

The others have offered great advice here.

 

But this bit of your last post sort of stuck out to me.

 

Your wife went out of her comfort zone to do something she knew you wanted to try/experience...and then when she asked if it was all you thought it would be, you describe it as a mood killer? We usually go to Hippie Hollow in Austin...there is one couple we've seen on a hand full of occasions...he always strips down, and she always keeps her bikini on. It's called compromise, these places are clothing optional so staying clothed is an option.

 

Was she being snotty? How was your behavior up to this point (ie: were you so wrapped up in looking at the other naked people/sporting a hard on/zoned out that you were failing to notice that she wasn't comfortable)? And then you actually got up and left her there? What were your expectations of her during this little adventure?

 

Good luck on your vacation. What has your wife's reaction to the flirting that is already going on between the couples? Does she enjoy it and actually participate or does she just sit back and watch it happen?

[Baconheads 438]

No, we left Little Beach together.

 

Yeah, I think she was being snotty, or at least a little bit condescending.

 

I think she enjoys the flirty conversation, she joins in and laughs with the rest of us, I just don't think she would go the next step without the other females egging her on, if that were ever in the cards.

[JustAskJulie 2,595]

Holy Triple Threat Batman !

 

This looks like a scenario to do three things:

 

1. Lose a wife and forever turn her off to the idea of swinging

2. Lose some friends, that you have no idea if they are swingers or not

3. Ruin a perfectly good vacation

 

I say leave it in your head as a fantasy unitl you have discussed it with your wife.

 

I have several vanilla friends where we banter back and forth about sex and stuff all the time at parties ect. But I know for a fact that they would never be swingers.

 

Amen!

 

Dude. It's not going to happen. Realize it. It's a fantasy and it's going to stay that way. It's not going to be suggested by your wife and doubtfully by the other woman.

 

If your wife is this closed off about sex and even nudity, she's not swinging (even soft-swinging) material. It's not worth the risk!

[Baconheads 438]

Yeah. I realized all that before we left. The opportunities were there if anyone were to pipe up, but no one did. My wife and I did start talking about fantasies, which was great!

 

It was an excellent vacation, I got some great vanilla flavoured sex nearly every day, she even tried a bullet toy after we all six went to the sex shop, which she never ever does.

 

But like you say, she's just not swinger material, never will be, so therefore, neither am I...

[MrkLin 393]

But like you say, she's just not swinger material, never will be, so therefore, neither am I...

 

THAT is probably one of the most profound things I've read on this subject in a very long time!

 

Kudos to you for realizing and admitting it. I think you might just be on your way to accepting it. It's fine to have the fantasy - in fact I think fantasies are healthy for the imagination. Just don't let the fantasy come between you and your wife - at the end of the day, it's your relationship with her that is the most important thing here.

 

You know what? There's absolutely nothing wrong with not swinging. A lot of people on this board have gone out of their way to let it be known that swinging isn't for everyone. A major pat on the back to you for realizing that it isn't for you as a couple before something tragic happened.

 

I wish you and Mrs.BH the best, my friend.

[sexcupid 809]

Baconheads said:

It was an excellent vacation, I got some great vanilla flavoured sex nearly every day, she even tried a bullet toy after we all six went to the sex shop, which she never ever does.

 

But like you say, she's just not swinger material, never will be, so therefore, neither am I...

 

Let me be the first to pipe up with the notion that just because only 2 people are involved, does not mean the sex can not be off the wall as far from vanilla as it comes.

 

I mean, I know what vanilla means on this board and others like it...but for some reason in my mind it always conjures up the image of ho-hum missionary position with the female counting the cracks in the ceiling (laying back and thinking of England, going over her to do list, etc lol) and the man staring at the pillow under her head just wanting to get it over with.

 

Opening up about fantasies can be a good thing...but that is a whole other discussion.

 

Seems like a good vacation...and lots of people have good vacation sex (new location, leaving the everyday stresses behind, etc).

[QriousCoupleIL 15]

Why don't you start off by telling her how important it is to you? Sex is important. And since fantasies are an important part your sex life, she should want to at least discuss the issue with you and consider it.

 

I have no idea why men automatically defer to some preconceived (usually uninformed) notion of what the wife will or won't do. Maybe you just haven't given her the space to open up about the fact that she is curious about it, but won't admit it because it'll make her look immoral.

 

Does she have other fantasies? If she does, then she understands how powerful the whole thing is. If she doesn't have or admit to having any fantasies, then I'd suggest that you have some serious sexual problems or you've married a woman who doesn't value that part of our relationship the way you do.

 

Either way, it warrants a discussion. But it does not seem fair to me (the male half) that you simply must shut up and sit on your desires simply because she has certain ideas of what sex "should or shouldn't" be.

 

In other words: man up! Talk to your wife and get it out in the open.

 

The absolute WORST advice (which is often given here) is that you should do nothing and keep it to yourself. Bullshit!

 

Should you do that if you have concerns about money? Raising children? Religion? Where you live? No. So don't get run over about sex either.

 

Just my two cents.

[fun4Ds 1,098]

Why don't you start off by telling her how important it is to you? Sex is important. And since fantasies are an important part your sex life, she should want to at least discuss the issue with you and consider it.

 

I have no idea why men automatically defer to some preconceived (usually uninformed) notion of what the wife will or won't do. Maybe you just haven't given her the space to open up about the fact that she is curious about it, but won't admit it because it'll make her look immoral.

 

Does she have other fantasies? If she does, then she understands how powerful the whole thing is. If she doesn't have or admit to having any fantasies, then I'd suggest that you have some serious sexual problems or you've married a woman who doesn't value that part of our relationship the way you do.

 

Either way, it warrants a discussion. But it does not seem fair to me (the male half) that you simply must shut up and sit on your desires simply because she has certain ideas of what sex "should or shouldn't" be.

I think your missing something important !

 

Yeah. I realized all that before we left. The opportunities were there if anyone were to pipe up, but no one did. My wife and I did start talking about fantasies, which was great!

 

It was an excellent vacation, I got some great vanilla flavoured sex nearly every day, she even tried a bullet toy after we all six went to the sex shop, which she never ever does.

But like you say, she's just not swinger material, never will be, so therefore, neither am I...

 

 

In other words: man up! Talk to your wife and get it out in the open.

I think Baconheads is doing that. In his own way ! We all came here from different paths.

 

The absolute WORST advice (which is often given here) is that you should do nothing and keep it to yourself. Bullshit!

Not sure why you would think that about the Swingers Board ? Swinging isn't for everyone, and we would be the first to understand that. For some it comes natural, for others it takes time. For others, it will never be.

 

"You can lead horses to water, yet cant make them drink.

You can lead people to knowledge, yet cant make them think...."

[Baconheads 438]

I read both of the new threads, thank you both for your insight. If I pushed the issue as Q said, it would go like, "Maybe we aren't right for each other, after all..."

 

In order for a same room, same spouse thing to happen, it would have to be the girls' idea first.

 

I need to set the drag very light on this one.