Do you trust enough to be flexible?

[TNT 1,155]

Or...do you trust enough to be flexible?

 

Ted and I found ourselves in a situation Saturday night that upon further discussion we came to the agreement that for some it would have caused major problems.

 

We attended a house party where we had no intentions of playing with anyone. It was never spoken out loud between the two of us that this was our agreement, it was just one of those things that was understood by both of us wouldn't be happening that night.

 

However, as things have a way of happening they sometimes don't go how you plan.

 

During the night I was presented with a most beautiful dick that was attached to a most beautiful young hottie...so...I sucked it .

 

Now, I knew that Ted and I had our unspoken agreement that there would be no playing however, I also knew that we were flexible enough in this agreement that neither of us would be upset with the other taking advantage of an opportunity like this. We had our agreement but...there was wiggle room in it.

 

After him and I talking about this it was determined that even had I taken full advantage of that beautiful dick and not only sucked it but fucked it, it still would not have been a problem.

 

As it turned out in our case, Ted joined the hottie and myself for a bit of a MFM threesome...no problems, no hard feelings just a sense of mild regret that... "We should have taken him to one of the bedrooms and really had some fun".

 

Which...has led us to not really understanding others who have such hard and fast rules that if they are broken why do they cause major trauma/drama?

 

Maybe we're just weird and really do believe that it's just sex so it does not affect our core relationship. We do respect others rules we just don't understand the trauma that is felt if a rule has been bent or broken.

 

We trust each other enough to allow flexibility and not get upset if one of us stretches a boundary...we know it can stretch without breaking.

 

Teresa

[shymxcpl 71]

"Which...has led us to not really understanding others who have such hard and fast rules that if they are broken why do they cause major trauma/drama?"

 

 

I agree with you completely. Rules are made to be broken and people who make up strict rules are heading for trouble for sure. It's like that 3 stroke rule on that other troll thread.

 

I think people should trust their instincts and follow ONE simple rule. Respect your partner at all times. It's nice to know that you guys have such an open and honest relationship! KUDOS!!!

[CXXC 435]

T

You ponder the question, "Why the trauma/drama?" when a couple establishes a rule that ends up being broken. Perhaps I can shed a little light on the matter as Mrs. CXXC and I have established some ground rules that, when bent or broken, will cause the two of us sitting in a corner chatting for a few moments.

 

As the lifestyle is all about trust and communication, any time a decision is made to go against the established designs for an event; both trust and communication are temporarily ignored. This leaves one member of the couple feeling disenfranchised or worse, ignored.

 

Mrs. CXXC has taken liberties in two cases in our 1.5 years in the lifestyle. Both situations prompted an immediate discussion (Far from anyone and very quietly) to cover the matter completely. The situations were discussed, analyzed and resolved within minutes and we were both back in the thick of things and enjoying ourselves.

 

Mistakes happen. Having the ability to communicate makes these little bumps in the road tolerable and easy to get over. We openly discuss the activities, the plans and then the resolution to the matter.

 

I do not want her to be curtailed or limited in her fun or activities. She would never think of doing so with me. The issue is a simple matter of following the plan. Slight deviations in the plan are expected. However, if a plan, made well in advance, is not followed, one of the parties will feel neglected, ignored or simply not cared about.

 

Neither Mrs. CXXC nor I are jealous individuals. We do not watch each other like hawks or stand "Chained" at the hip at lifestyle functions. We are both given complete freedom to go about and have a great time. The established rules we do have are set in stone. They are more for her safety and our well being than anything else. It is only when these are bent or broken that you will see us in the corner talking.

 

I hope this view into our way of thinking helps you a little bit.

 

Mr. C

[Chicup 42]

I really need to play advocate for the dark lord on this one.

 

You are a very experienced couple who is into MFM's. You had less of a rule than an agreement, and even then agreement is to strong. You have been in these situations enough and know your husband well enough that you knew what his reaction would be to you doing it. Basically you broke nothing, and acted as you are both comfortable with.

 

Now lets take the same scenario with a different couple. Its their first time at a house party and they only did soft swap with close friends once in a hot tub 2 years ago. They agreed they wouldn't play with anyone that night and talk about it together after to see if they want to go further. They were very taken aback at how relaxed and non-pressure the party was and were having such a good time socializing they felt it ok to split up a while chatting with all the new people. Later she goes to look for her husband and find hes getting a BJ from a beautiful woman. She is shocked but he says she was such a beautiful woman and she wanted to give him a bj so he just had to do it and wished he could have taken her to a private room.

 

I don't think we need to guess what the advice on the above ladies post describing that situation would be if she were to post that story here.

 

Sometimes a couples rules are just silly. My wife and I had some VERY silly rules in retrospect but they were rules that kept us comfortable at the time. Having specific rules like "he can touch your breasts and fondle your nipples but can't kiss you on the neck unless your shirt is on" is asking for issues, but rules like 'We won't have any sex' are pretty straight forward. Those are rules NOT made to be broken unless both agree to break them.

 

Really the original post is a great story in terms of knowing your spouse and being secure in what you are doing, but I just don't see it having anything to do with rules. I don't want to belittle those with rules and I sure don't want them to think its ok to break them before they really KNOW their spouse in these matters. Hell my wife and I are pretty experienced swingers now, I know her and she knows me, and as such if we made a rule about no play without the other consent we would stick to it, and be a little pissed if the other didn't. Thats being true to each other in our case, and knowing each other completely.

[CXXC 435]

wise words form the "Dark Lord's" council!

Good analogy too!

[NotSorry 155]

I too think experience is the key. When you are taking the jump from fantasy to reality there may be some kinks to work out along the way. Even if you thought you had plenty of trust before this is a whole new kind of trust and view of your relationship!

 

While my husband and I don't really have that many rules, we are just starting out and are strict about the tentative ones we do have (always play together/same room). This is because this is all new to us. As we gain experience we will decide what is okay with us and what is not okay. It may turn out that everything is okay. We just want to make sure that both of us are happy and feel safe.

 

I do agree that having too many hard and fast rules that never change may be an indicator that the couple (or one person within the couple) may have some issues that need to be resolved (I can't help but think that a couple with a 'no kissing' rule might have some serious jealousy issues...). If I got the vibe that all the rules a couple had meant that jealousy was an issue, we'd back out. But I can respect some reasonable boundaries.

 

It sounds like you guys are really comfortable trusting each other. That's awesome.

[Speed & Trixie 163]

Well said, Chicup.

 

Since Speed and I are so new to all of this, we've talked about what our "rules" should be, expectations/ what's always off-limits, what we'd consider in the future, etc. But honestly, we're not REALLY gonna know what's ok until we start exploring.

 

If we go into a situation where we've set a specific rule/limit on behavior, each would probably be upset if the other broke the rule. However, we also both know that we love and respect each other. Neither of us is out to be selfish or make the other uncomfortable, so if one of us DID break a rule, I'd think the other would seriously try to understand (rather than flying off the handle and getting into drama ).

 

Also, we would keep communication open ALWAYS. "Honey, this sexy woman over there wants to suck my cock. I know we said we wouldn't play tonight but I'm really attracted to her and want this. What do you think?" I might say "hell yes, I want to watch/ help/ go down on her hubby too!" or "why don't we get her number and set up another day?" or "I don't think that's a good idea because xyz." And Speed would respect ANY answer I give him (and vice versa).

 

Rules are made to be broken...but only the stupid rules

 

Honesty and communication, paying close attention to your partner and saying NO when you're not comfortable -- those are non-negotiable. And ending the night together!

 

Trixie

[JustAskJulie 2,595]

We were in a similar situation a few weeks ago. We went to the club with the understanding between us that we weren't planning to play with anyone. As the night went on I was propositioned by another woman. As it was, I wasn't really in the mood to just do the girl/girl thing and so it was nice that we had already agreed to not play. Now had that same couple (or a few other couples) offered a 4some we would have gone for it despite our earlier agreement.

 

As the night goes on things do change and I think we all have to allow enough flexibility to allow for change. However, I can also see Chicup's points in that in both of these cases it's not really about "rules" being broken but more just that things can change as a night goes on.

[TNT 1,155]

Thanks for the replies...we were hoping as we were posting this that we'd be able to get what it was that had us baffled across and that we'd get some good discussion going.

 

T

You ponder the question, "Why the trauma/drama?" when a couple establishes a rule that ends up being broken. Perhaps I can shed a little light on the matter as Mrs. CXXC and I have established some ground rules that, when bent or broken, will cause the two of us sitting in a corner chatting for a few moments.

 

As the lifestyle is all about trust and communication, any time a decision is made to go against the established designs for an event; both trust and communication are temporarily ignored. This leaves one member of the couple feeling disenfranchised or worse, ignored.

 

Mrs. CXXC has taken liberties in two cases in our 1.5 years in the lifestyle. Both situations prompted an immediate discussion (Far from anyone and very quietly) to cover the matter completely. The situations were discussed, analyzed and resolved within minutes and we were both back in the thick of things and enjoying ourselves.

 

Mistakes happen. Having the ability to communicate makes these little bumps in the road tolerable and easy to get over. We openly discuss the activities, the plans and then the resolution to the matter.

 

 

Thanks for that explanation...it's kind of what we were getting out...you two trust enough to be flexible that things that come up or happen won't cause trauma to your relationship.

 

I really need to play advocate for the dark lord on this one.

 

You are a very experienced couple who is into MFM's. You had less of a rule than an agreement, and even then agreement is to strong. You have been in these situations enough and know your husband well enough that you knew what his reaction would be to you doing it. Basically you broke nothing, and acted as you are both comfortable with.

 

 

Really the original post is a great story in terms of knowing your spouse and being secure in what you are doing, but I just don't see it having anything to do with rules. I don't want to belittle those with rules and I sure don't want them to think its ok to break them before they really KNOW their spouse in these matters. Hell my wife and I are pretty experienced swingers now, I know her and she knows me, and as such if we made a rule about no play without the other consent we would stick to it, and be a little pissed if the other didn't. Thats being true to each other in our case, and knowing each other completely.

 

Thanks and good points throughout you whole post, not just what I quoted.

 

We do have an advantage over most couples in swinging in that we literally have had our whole lives to know one another...it's also a disadvantage in that a lot of times we don't understand problems and "problems" isn't really the word I'm looking for...maybe issues is a better word...that a lot of couples deal with in swinging.

 

I sure hope it didn't come across that we would EVER encourage someone to bend or break a rule they had established between each other...it's more of a tale of don't make such hard and fast rules that you leave no room for flexibility that a bending/breaking of that rule would cause damage to the trust of your relationship to cause trauma for either one.

 

 

Respect your partner at all times.

 

Each couple will have their rules/guidelines/agreements...we understand that, I guess we just don't understand them being so deeply set in stone that the slightest deviation from them would cause a major blow up.

 

If you remember to respect your partner and trust that that respect is returned...regardless of the situation....you're able to allow for flexibility.

 

It really was one of those times that we both realized that for us it was a situation that wasn't even a blip on the radar but, for someone else it could have been an atomic bomb going off.

 

Teresa

[TNT 1,155]

Goodness...get interrupted while in the middle of making a post and come back to a whole lot more input .

 

Thanks for the responses.

 

 

Teresa

[LFM2 1,482]

Teresa, this so reminds me of my blog I wrote about not that long ago. I beat myself up for doing something that was not discussed beforehand, yet, Dave really thought nothing of it.

 

I agree with you that it's a trust issue. While we haven't been swinging but about two and a half years, we've been married for so long, that sometimes our unspoken words are just understood between both of us. That night, the synapse was gone for me, but Dave was totally game for playing even though we meet others without expectations.

 

Sometimes situations change during the course of the evening and our love and trust allows for that. Thanks for bringing this up.

[CXXC 435]

T

Our trust stems from 10 years of marriage. She knows the warning signs where I may screw up and I know hers.

Other than that, we are pretty sure of each other.

It sounds like you have the very same ability.

Dont beat yourself up over something that was not intentional nor taken as an offense!

You both know your limits. Enjoy the game. this little experience will just sure up what you already know!

[The Fuse 1,012]

I think couples make rules based on what would make each partner feel uncomfortable or insecure.

 

If one partner breaks a rule that was made in that spirit, then the other partner may have the feelings they had made the rule to avoid.

 

I may not agree with rules another couple has made, or even with some things that would cause my husband to feel insecure or uncomfortable. But if I were to break the rule, it might show that I cared about my own pleasure more than I care about the feelings of others.

 

Certainly mistakes can be made, and things happen that were not discussed beforehand. If all parties involved are comfortable and feel secure and respected, then no worries.

 

The first time Mr. Fuse and I went into separate rooms, it wasn't something we had expected. It was early in our swinging experience, and we had said we were a same room couple, just because we felt more secure with the other in the room. But at the time, it was obvious that we both felt very comfortable and not in the least insecure or emotionally threatened. I think that's what happened with the OP. Something happened that they had previously thought they'd refrain from, but when the situation came up (pun intended), she knew her husband would not feel dissed or threatened.

[The Fuse 1,012]

Also, we would keep communication open ALWAYS. "Honey, this sexy woman over there wants to suck my cock. I know we said we wouldn't play tonight but I'm really attracted to her and want this. What do you think?" I might say "hell yes, I want to watch/ help/ go down on her hubby too!" or "why don't we get her number and set up another day?" or "I don't think that's a good idea because xyz." And Speed would respect ANY answer I give him (and vice versa).

I'd just like to note that sometimes something will happen and Speed might not be right there. If I read the OP correctly, this is what happened in their situation. Her husband was serving drinks, and this yummy challenge was thrown at her. By the way, that sounds like a lot of fun.

 

You might be at a party... Speed has gone to get you drinks, or is talking to someone in the next room. A sexy woman or man is flirting with you and leans in for a kiss, or wants to touch your breasts. You like this person and you're excited, but don't know if it's okay, because you and Speed haven't talked about that particular person or couple. You've said you wouldn't play without talking it over first. But it's just a little kiss... and you're so excited...

 

Boom, the moment is over. What did you do? You either lose the moment, interrupting something potentially very fun (or avoiding a big mistake), and perhaps making the potential playmate think you are skittish. Or you go ahead because you think Speed will be okay with it, or because you simply didn't stop it. This is one kind of thing that happens, especially with new and eager people who are evolving quickly, but aren't sure where their boundaries are.

[NCfuncouple98 367]

This was a very good topic. Mr. NC and I talked about it today after reading this. We both were curious how the other might react in a similar situation.

 

Now we're still new, so while our love and trust for each other is very strong, we both agreed that we might have the initial "shock factor", but trust each other enough that it wouldn't cause drama or a major scene. We would discuss any concerns or issues after we got home. If it were someone we both already knew, versus a complete stranger, the reactions would be different.

 

But right now, we only go to an on-premise club, so it's a little different. At this point in our relationship, neither one of us would take that step without the other present. But if we did, we now have discussed it up front. And we both agreed that maybe someday it wouldn't be an issue at all. It goes right along with our comfort level within the lifestyle.

 

So thank you Teresa, it's discussions like these that do open up those lines of communication.

[TNT 1,155]

T

 

Dont beat yourself up over something that was not intentional nor taken as an offense!

You both know your limits. Enjoy the game. this little experience will just sure up what you already know!

 

Oh goodness, there is NO beating my self up at all.

 

This morning while we were talking about the party (particularly the young hot cutie) Ted made the comment that...You know, there are people out there that would have gotten upset over what you did with him...I looked at him and said...It never crossed my mind that you'd be upset over it, I knew you'd like it. He replied...Well there's no reason you should have thought it would have upset me and I did like it. He turned it around and asked if I would have been upset if I had came upon him eating pussy or having his dick sucked...No, not at all, I would have done just like you and joined in.

 

I did agree with him that there were some swingers who it would have upset greatly if they had an agreement between them (spoken or unspoken) that there would be no playing on any particular night and one of them didn't stick to it 100%.

 

We thought there was a good discussion topic somewhere in there and tried to post it coherently. We both knew exactly what we wanted to get across but alas, had problems getting it across exactly like we wanted (we both said after it was posted that it was probably one of those things he and I saw crystal clear but it would probably not be as clear to others).

 

Basically, we just don't understand why some get so upset over the slightest bending of an agreement or rule. We have seen people storm out of parties or start fighting because one of them made the slightest deviation from what they had agreed upon for the evening.

 

Maybe it's hard for us to understand because even though there are certain times we'll agree this or that isn't going to happen tonight we both know it's really okay if it does.

 

 

 

 

Teresa

[TNT 1,155]

This was a very good topic. Mr. NC and I talked about it today after reading this. We both were curious how the other might react in a similar situation.

 

Now we're still new, so while our love and trust for each other is very strong, we both agreed that we might have the initial "shock factor", but trust each other enough that it wouldn't cause drama or a major scene. We would discuss any concerns or issues after we got home. If it were someone we both already knew, versus a complete stranger, the reactions would be different.

 

But right now, we only go to an on-premise club, so it's a little different. At this point in our relationship, neither one of us would take that step without the other present. But if we did, we now have discussed it up front. And we both agreed that maybe someday it wouldn't be an issue at all. It goes right along with our comfort level within the lifestyle.

 

So thank you Teresa, it's discussions like these that do open up those lines of communication.

 

You're very welcome Discussing any, all and every scenario you can think of, no matter how silly one might think it is, is the best way to assure being successful in swinging.

 

 

Teresa

[TNT 1,155]

I'd just like to note that sometimes something will happen and Speed might not be right there. If I read the OP correctly, this is what happened in their situation. Her husband was serving drinks, and this yummy challenge was thrown at her. By the way, that sounds like a lot of fun.

 

You might be at a party... Speed has gone to get you drinks, or is talking to someone in the next room. A sexy woman or man is flirting with you and leans in for a kiss, or wants to touch your breasts. You like this person and you're excited, but don't know if it's okay, because you and Speed haven't talked about that particular person or couple. You've said you wouldn't play without talking it over first. But it's just a little kiss... and you're so excited...

 

Boom, the moment is over. What did you do? You either lose the moment, interrupting something potentially very fun (or avoiding a big mistake), and perhaps making the potential playmate think you are skittish. Or you go ahead because you think Speed will be okay with it, or because you simply didn't stop it. This is one kind of thing that happens, especially with new and eager people who are evolving quickly, but aren't sure where their boundaries are.

 

You brought up some good points for those who are new to swinging to think about and discuss.

 

After reading over the replies again...it dawned on me I never stated why we had both silently agreed or instinctively knew there would be no playing that night. Normally when we are at house parties anything goes for either one of us...on this particular night the ONLY reason we weren't going to play was because Ted had just gotten home after being gone for two weeks and we like to have our reconnect time with each other before we play with others. We hadn't had the chance for that reconnect time before the party. Had we even had five minutes alone with each other prior to the party things would have gone very differently.

 

I do want to stress it was something that we didn't have a problem with, just something that we recognized that others would/could or might have had.

 

Teresa

[bbarnsworth 2,652]

I think I go with some others regarding the experience aspect, plus personality types, plus relationship types. There's all sorts and all combinations out there.

 

A couple that is just starting out may find one or the other partner nervous about the rules, and fearful of the unknown. This couple might have overthought things, and think they've anticipated all scenarios. This is of course naive, and when faced with a situation like The Fuse raised, even if no rules were actually broken, it might be a confidence shaker. The couple might retreat and think "woah, that was too far. What happened?" This is when a moment with an experienced couple to kind of mentor them could help, but that's not going to happen.

 

My wife and I had a bunch more rules starting out than we do now. It's not so much that we considered the rules we did have and voted up/down to remove them. It's that we realized the more important rule is that we trust each other implicitly to not do something to intentionally hurt the other person, and be considerate of each other and what we know our limits to be.

 

You just can't anticipate all situations, all circumstances. They are as varied as there are people out there. Given the scenario outlined by the OP, no it wouldn't have bothered me if we'd more or less agreed not to play and while off getting drinks my wife decided to start giving a guy head. It's not like it's something she hasn't done before, and I know she enjoys it. Fine by me.

[iapr 24]

While I am in pretty much agreement with all the statements being made here I do need to bring this up for some food for thought.

 

Don't y'all think, at least to some degree, that swingers going to a swinger's house party with any kind of "agreement" NOT to play is just setting yourself up for some kind of issue like this?

 

I mean, call me old fashioned but don't you think that you are just tempting fate to go to a house party with a predetermined plan NOT to play?

 

Don't get me wrong, I have gone to clubs many times when I wasn't in the mood to play and let mrs iapr know of my lack of motivation but we have never once closed the door on the "possibility" of playing to some degree.

 

There is a big difference between the attitude of "y'know, I'm really not in the mood to put in the time and effort to try and get someone into bed" VS "we're not playing tonight. period."

 

I am all for free choice and not doing what you don't want to do but if there is some reason that play just isn't an option, then IMHO that might be a good night to go rekindle some old vanilla friendships or see some family or just have a cuddle night on the couch with a bowl of popcorn.

 

Everyone on here always preaches about going to parties and events with "no epectations" but isn't going to a house party with the intent NOT to play still an expectation?

[The Fuse 1,012]

Basically, we just don't understand why some get so upset over the slightest bending of an agreement or rule. We have seen people storm out of parties or start fighting because one of them made the slightest deviation from what they had agreed upon for the evening.

 

I can see both sides of this (except for the part about fighting in public). It can be hard to understand why people get upset about things that seem like nothing to people who have become very comfortable with swinging. To those who are starting out or just not as comfortable or confident, their partner's deviation from their agreements seems like a threat. "Aren't I the most important thing?" They don't feel secure yet, and maybe they are afraid their partner will like the new experiences a little too much.

 

Another important distinction is that what Theresa did would have been just fine on any given night. The expectation of her not doing something like that was actually an exception on that night. So it's not like she did something that hasn't been fine in the past.

 

Mr. Fuse and I are at the point when some former rules can be bent and sometimes exceptions are made. We don't have a long list of rules, but for instance we don't play with only half of a couple. That more or less means that I don't get to play with a guy if Mr. Fuse is not going to get to play with his wife. The reason for that is that he is afraid of getting "left behind", that is, of me having a separate sex life from him. So if I broke that rule, he would be afraid I was going to leave him behind.

 

Unlike TNT, we are not into MFM. If we were, then me sucking someone I found attractive would only require Mr. Fuse approving of that guy -- but it would require that approval. You see, he would not feel comfortable with me playing with someone he didn't like or had a negative feeling about. So he insists on this rule. I wouldn't like it if he fucked someone I didn't like either, but it wouldn't be a huge problem if he did. It would be about as annoying as him forgetting to turn the iron off, which he does frequently. It would actually be less of a threat than the iron, which can start a fire, for fuck's sake.

 

Maybe it's hard for us to understand because even though there are certain times we'll agree this or that isn't going to happen tonight we both know it's really okay if it does.

 

I think you really nailed it there. The people who get upset are those who don't think "it's really okay if it does." The proscribed actions are ones that make the rule-makers afraid.

 

I'm not getting down on rules or overly positive about them either. Some rules I think are silly and just asking for trouble. But if something is important to your partner (as in it's not okay for the rule to be broken) (doesn't that mean it's not really a rule?), then following the rule shows respect and consideration.

 

I guess I find this subject compelling, which is why I keep coming back and being a nuisance, because I am one of those people who is a bit of a stickler. If someone makes a commitment to me about what they will or won't do, then in my opinion if they break that commitment it says something about their respect for me. I don't think that's what happened with TNT. They had a general understanding that was not really hard and fast about what they wouldn't do that night. And Mr. Fuse is much more literal about that stuff than I am. He is really easygoing about almost everything. But the things he cares about, he really cares about. It would shake his confidence in our bond if I stepped over one of those lines. So unlike Theresa, who knows "it's really okay if it does", I know it's really not okay in our case.

[Chicup 42]

Fuse quit posting these things that make me wish you were in the midwest

 

We seem to be of the same mind on this one.

[Speed & Trixie 163]

Oh Mrs. Fuse, you're wonderful -- every time you post, Speed and I have an amazing discussion!

 

Reading back to the OP, I realize you're correct. You can't be glued to your partner every second you're at a club, and sometimes an opportunity presents itself just once. After talking about it, Speed and I came to the conclusion that we are both fine with the other "seizing the moment" with a woman. We both enjoy watching the other with a woman, and it would be fun to join in after a bit.

 

However, Speed is not sure he's comfortable seeing me with a man (because we've never experienced that before), so I would respect that and NOT take the opportunity with a man. Later down the road, this may change. (I would be fine with Speed and another man but this does not appeal to him so much...)

 

The more I'm on this board, the more I like to play the "what if" game with Speed, and the more we SERIOUSLY consider the hypothetical situations and talk openly about them. It's great way to think about your/ your partner's limits and boundries, and the more we can expand those boundries (at our own pace), the more potential FUN we can have! As Newbies, we will take fewer liberties with our rules at first and constantly check in with each other, but as time goes by and we're more confident and secure, I think we'll have a good grasp of "bendable" rules vs. our "hard and fast" rules.

[The Fuse 1,012]

Thanks, Chicup and Trixie!

[MrkLin 393]

I'm with iapr on this one. If we had decided that we weren't going to play, we wouldn't have gone to the party in the first place. I too think you're kind of slapping fate in the face by setting up a situation where rules can be bent or broken. I keep coming back to the fact that if a rule is that important to you, neither of you will put yourselves, or each other, into a position where that rule could be broken. As Fuse said, it's about respect.

 

Having said that, I don't see a problem or even an issue with what happened that night, TNT - other than the fact that you probably missed out on a lot more fun by stopping at oral. I think if he would have had a problem with anything you were doing, he would have made it known. If you had continued on after he had let you know he had a problem with something, then there would be an issue. With that not being the case, I don't think there ever was a problem.

 

Still, you might want to ask the host of the party if the aforementioned hotty will be at their next party...

[socolais 696]

I think it was a generously charitable thing to help friends with their party especially when it meant sacrificing "reconnect time" for themselves. It's heart warming to read about that same level of generosity being applied to a spouse and finding value in their pleasure rather than feeling threatened upon discovering the situation. That's the kind of respect for each other that makes life worth living....

[Baconheads 437]

You brought up some good points for those who are new to swinging to think about and discuss.

 

After reading over the replies again...it dawned on me I never stated why we had both silently agreed or instinctively knew there would be no playing that night. Normally when we are at house parties anything goes for either one of us...on this particular night the ONLY reason we weren't going to play was because Ted had just gotten home after being gone for two weeks and we like to have our reconnect time with each other before we play with others. We hadn't had the chance for that reconnect time before the party. Had we even had five minutes alone with each other prior to the party things would have gone very differently.

 

I do want to stress it was something that we didn't have a problem with, just something that we recognized that others would/could or might have had.

 

Teresa

 

I was wondering why you guys would attend a house party intending *not* to play, especially with you two not being never evers. Thanks for clearing that up.

[TNT 1,155]

Please people....let me reiterate one more time. TED AND I HAD NO PROBLEM WITH WHAT HAPPENED. I do NOT feel guilty and he was NOT upset.

 

We made an OBSERVATION upon discussing the nights events that for OTHERS it could have, would have or might have been a problem...which we couldn't understand WHY it would have been such a problem that it would/could cause trauma in someone's relationship. The events of that night were used as an example...nothing more. The main question was...why would such a small thing cause problems? There's no need for it to in OUR opinion if you never let your rules/agreements/expectations/understandings (whatever) with each other be so strict that you never allow room to maneuver...trust enough to allow flexibility.

 

 

Don't y'all think, at least to some degree, that swingers going to a swinger's house party with any kind of "agreement" NOT to play is just setting yourself up for some kind of issue like this?

 

 

I'm with iapr on this one. If we had decided that we weren't going to play, we wouldn't have gone to the party in the first place. I too think you're kind of slapping fate in the face by setting up a situation where rules can be bent or broken. I keep coming back to the fact that if a rule is that important to you, neither of you will put yourselves, or each other, into a position where that rule could be broken. As Fuse said, it's about respect.

 

There are lots of reasons couples/singles would attend a house party with no intentions of playing....you get to meet new people, you get to see some of your old friends, you get to socialize, you can watch others playing, you get out of the house for a few hours and the list can go on.

 

 

Still, you might want to ask the host of the party if the aforementioned hotty will be at their next party...

 

No need to ask the host at all...he was given our contact info and we've already been in contact with him since the party

 

 

I think it was a generously charitable thing to help friends with their party especially when it meant sacrificing "reconnect time" for themselves. It's heart warming to read about that same level of generosity being applied to a spouse and finding value in their pleasure rather than feeling threatened upon discovering the situation. That's the kind of respect for each other that makes life worth living....

 

Thank you ....We happen to really love the friends that were hosting and I'd say 99% of the time we are always their co-hosts. They wanted and felt they needed us there and asked us to come...so, we went.

 

 

Teresa

[JustAskJulie 2,595]

I think it might be the title that is throwing some folks off, I think (as often happens) some people are reading the title (taking it literally) and reacting to it instead of to the actual post. Perhaps a change to the title of this thread is needed.

[NednWendy 15]

I would think going to a party and meeting someone attractive would be a good reason to play.

[TNT 1,155]

I think it might be the title that is throwing some folks off, I think (as often happens) some people are reading the title (taking it literally) and reacting to it instead of to the actual post. Perhaps a change to the title of this thread is needed.

 

I think your right and had had the same thought...the title did however bring a lot of folks in to read

 

Teresa

[fun4Ds 1,098]

Please people....let me reiterate one more time. TED AND I HAD NO PROBLEM WITH WHAT HAPPENED. I do NOT feel guilty and he was NOT upset.

Ugh Ohhhh, I clearly see your both in total denial. This problem is bigger than I thought at first, reading the title

 

We need to dig deep into this matter to find the core of this problem. For now, the only solution I can see is physical therapy. That would involve licking, sucking and teasing you Teresa, and perhaps even some light flogging on Ted by Mrs fun....... Its the only way to enlightenment and happiness now.......

 

I hope you see the humor/satire in my thoughts as I did, when I first read this thread title. I think I got it, because we know you guys a little better.

 

I do think its a good topic to discuss. Especially, because it is thought provoking. Not only to seasoned swingers who might see this as ...... Well, Possible drama ?.... I don't know if thats the right word....., but along the lines of understanding how someone exploring and understanding their own feelings, might interpret something like this scenario.

We made an OBSERVATION upon discussing the nights events that for OTHERS it could have, would have or might have been a problem...which we couldn't understand WHY it would have been such a problem that it would/could cause trauma in someone's relationship. The events of that night were used as an example...nothing more. The main question was...why would such a small thing cause problems? There's no need for it to in OUR opinion if you never let your rules/agreements/expectations/understandings (whatever) with each other be so strict that you never allow room to maneuver...trust enough to allow flexibility.

Given your understanding and experience, I can see how you feel. But sometimes with people who are less comfortable, Its not always easy to step back and say " Remember the uneasy feelings we had at times "

 

Suppose a new couple who hadn't had a chance to connect on solid sexual ground between each other had the same scenario. I could see a person feeling uncomfortable, leading to at least an issue that needs discussed later. I can say we have been close to this. For us, there have been times we worked long hours before a planned party. We don't always get to have sex between ourselves due to these type of things in life. We have gone to parties to just socialize and clearly said before going " We have had no intentions of having sex with others, lets just party and end up with each other" Then it happens, opportunity presents its self. You know, someone sexy comes along and damned if we don't wanna get it on.

 

I know in the beginning with that "lets do each other first mind set" Passing on the opportunity, we found each other the next morning still wishing we would have. Its just kind of hard to call those potential playmates at 8 am asking if they want to do it now..... we're pretty sure they would hang up on us. So we don't call..... It has happened a time or two

 

Thats what led us to our understanding now. Our connection is important after long hours away from one another but reconnecting with playmates in the middle is cool also.

 

There are lots of reasons couples/singles would attend a house party with no intentions of playing....you get to meet new people, you get to see some of your old friends, you get to socialize, you can watch others playing, you get out of the house for a few hours and the list can go on.

Exactly, thats what we not only tell new people, but we show that as well. Its not always about the sex. There are times we go to socialize and have sex, and there are times we go all revved up to fuck playmates and end up just socializing........ Both ways happen..... Either way, we want in on the midnight door prizes..... Thats cool too.....

 

No need to ask the host at all...he was given our contact info and we've already been in contact with him since the party

Ohhhh, that lucky bastard. Don't forget to share

 

Thank you ....We happen to really love the friends that were hosting and I'd say 99% of the time we are always their co-hosts. They wanted and felt they needed us there and asked us to come...so, we went.

I have a horrible cold and am pretty tanked up on niquell if I haven't made any sense so far....... Wish we could have been there

[TNT 1,155]

Ugh Ohhhh, I clearly see your both in total denial. This problem is bigger than I thought at first, reading the title

 

We need to dig deep into this matter to find the core of this problem. For now, the only solution I can see is physical therapy. That would involve licking, sucking and teasing you Teresa, and perhaps even some light flogging on Ted by Mrs fun....... Its the only way to enlightenment and happiness now.......

 

I hope you see the humor/satire in my thoughts as I did, when I first read this thread title. I think I got it, because we know you guys a little better.

 

I got it...now come clean off the coffee I spit all over my monitor

 

I shouldn't have used the all caps in that post...I apologize for that. I was getting aggravated that the focus of discussion seemed to be on Ted and I having a problem with what happened and not on the topic we failed to adequately convey.

 

The original title also threw people off I believe...it was a play on the many different threads we've seen here where couples have so many problems with one of them not sticking totally to what they had agreed to. Bad title choice on our part.

 

I do think its a good topic to discuss. Especially, because it is thought provoking. Not only to seasoned swingers who might see this as ...... Well, Possible drama ?.... I don't know if thats the right word....., but along the lines of understanding how someone exploring and understanding their own feelings, might interpret something like this scenario.

 

Given your understanding and experience, I can see how you feel. But sometimes with people who are less comfortable, Its not always easy to step back and say " Remember the uneasy feelings we had at times "

 

We too felt it was a good topic to discuss...people's rules/agreements and the breaking of them causing problems within their relationship is something we never really have been able to understand. Even in the beginning for us we didn't have many and with what few we did have we knew there was a possibility of them being bent or broken and we allowed for that by trusting that the other one would be flexible enough not to get upset over it.

 

There are so many different situations a couple will find themselves in when exploring swinging and/or having been in swinging for years and remembering to be flexible with things will help you weather whatever storm might come along without causing your feelings to be hurt or causing trauma to your relationship.

 

There have been some wonderful and excellent points made throughout this thread...hopefully those who are new will read them, think about them, discuss them and that it will help them in their journey.

 

I hope my little hissy fit a couple of post back won't keep others from posting...there's still a lot of good advice and points of views to yet be explored.

 

I really am trying to get a grasp and understand why some have problems and some don't. Might never get there but I am trying.

 

Teresa

[Tia Vampire 167]

we are sort of flexible. if we went out when it was that time of month for me, my SO could play with his fantasy girl. not just anyone though. he has a fetish for asian woman. there are not alot of asian women in our area. so is she was to come along, he has my blessings to go and play.

[tnt69couple 64]

This is exactly why we have one rule. Full disclosure.

 

We don't have all these rules. We like to have sex. We don't have all these rules that lead to drama. If she wants to kiss someone, blow someone have sex with someone. I don't care. I don't care if she wants to play alone. Just tell me. Although she says she would not be comfortable with it. This is just what works for us.

[10thBadger 25]

On 3/2/2009 at 10:32 AM, TNT said:

Or...do you trust enough to be flexible?

 

Ted and I found ourselves in a situation Saturday night that upon further discussion we came to the agreement that for some it would have caused major problems.

 

We attended a house party where we had no intentions of playing with anyone. It was never spoken out loud between the two of us that this was our agreement, it was just one of those things that was understood by both of us wouldn't be happening that night.

 

However, as things have a way of happening they sometimes don't go how you plan.

 

During the night I was presented with a most beautiful dick that was attached to a most beautiful young hottie...so...I sucked it .

 

Now, I knew that Ted and I had our unspoken agreement that there would be no playing however, I also knew that we were flexible enough in this agreement that neither of us would be upset with the other taking advantage of an opportunity like this. We had our agreement but...there was wiggle room in it.

 

After him and I talking about this it was determined that even had I taken full advantage of that beautiful dick and not only sucked it but fucked it, it still would not have been a problem.

 

As it turned out in our case, Ted joined the hottie and myself for a bit of a MFM threesome...no problems, no hard feelings just a sense of mild regret that... "We should have taken him to one of the bedrooms and really had some fun".

 

Which...has led us to not really understanding others who have such hard and fast rules that if they are broken why do they cause major trauma/drama?

 

Maybe we're just weird and really do believe that it's just sex so it does not affect our core relationship. We do respect others rules we just don't understand the trauma that is felt if a rule has been bent or broken.

 

We trust each other enough to allow flexibility and not get upset if one of us stretches a boundary...we know it can stretch without breaking.

 

Teresa

So what you are saying is that even if you have rules,  you are about to break them? So Why have any rules at all to protect yourself and your partner?

I’m sorry that doesn’t make sense to me because rules are supposed to be hard fast or the bed rock for success or am I missing something.