Husband agreed "no more play" then broke his promise...

[MissConfused 67]

I have been reading through the posts, and various questions asked. I found this site when looking for answers to my particular situation. I am or should I say "was" part of a swinging happy couple. I am still 100% with this man whom I have been with for 9 years this december but the swinging and happy part is gone right now. Ok so here's my situation from beginning to end.

Decided to officially start swinging last fall. We had talked and talked and talked about it and decided it was something both of us definitly wanted to try. Add some spice and take it all slow... at our own comfortable pace.

So first play date came early december with a single playing man. We met up at a local pub where swingers get together for drinks. It is just a regular bar/pub but a discrete choice as its less frequented. Decided we would go back to the single males place and see where things might lead. I let the men talk and get comfortable with the situation and didn't know quite how to start anything so I asked hubby if he would go start the car. I gave him a look and a kiss as he walked out the door smiling. Well needless to say fun was had. Hubby came back up a short while later while we were still in the act. He wasn't sure how to go about getting involved so waited in the living room and peeked into the bedroom from time to time. I came out and asked if he would have liked to join but he said we should get going as it was very late. So I got dressed bid playmate goodbye and we left. When we got back to our place my husband ravaged me in a way he has never done before. Amazing sex with the most amazing man!

Fast forward... been talking to a lot of people and attending little mini social meets with swingers here and there. Hubby got a job away from home and I see him only a cpl days a week. He has frequented the usual spot a few times and nothing has ever come of it. Anyways, I always told him I wanted him to play but I wanted to have knowledge of who and when.

 

Now this is where it get's confusing...

 

I met a woman at our usual meeting bar/pub which we had both chatted with a bit online. I said hello and that was about it. She had other people she felt she had better connections with which was absolutly fine with me. But to my surprise, my husband and her had sex a few days later without talking to me about first. I was not angry but extremely uncomfortable with it. I let him know and he said he understood and he would TALK to me before anything every time from then on out. He couldn;t reach me when they were discussing the possibility because my cell was dead and I was at his families. Kind of confusing I know. But that was his first experience. Rushed and not approved by me.

The very next day, my family said some things that made me second guess the person I am. So I got really self conscious and told my hubby I wanted no more "play" time until I was more comfortable with myself and our whole situation. He was more than happy to oblige. BUT not two nights later he went out with a mutal swing FRIEND ( nothing has ever happened with this gal) and he ended up getting oral from her and fingering her.

I was heart broken because I had just told him no. No more playing for a bit. So I was extremely angry and hurt, debated leaving because I no longer trusted him. He said he was sorry BUT he also said these things:

The whole time we've been on our swinging site he has been EXTREMELY uncomfortable with the whole thing and only doing it for me even though I had told him multiple times he was enough for me and would shut it down in a second if I ever had too (which I did today).

He has been trying to set up more play dates with the man I first played with. I have repeatedly told him no as I was not looking to be physical with anyone else right at that time.

He also said he would be more into the swinging scene if the people interested in him were more attractive. He said that I have all these good looking well hung men approaching me and he gets not so attractive women.

 

There's so much more to this but I'm trying not to write a book. I can answer additional questions. I really need some help with this. I don't know what to feel anymore and I'm angry that I can't talk to him face to face because he is away wrking.

In all honesty, I can leave the lifestyle. I DID cut off every thread I had connected to it. No more profile or anything. BUT I'm sad I can no longer be around like minded people. Not so much for the play time but for the friendship. I do consider a lot of the ppl I met friends, not friends with benefits but genuine friends. When I told him this he said there are no friends just people who want to fuck.

I don't know if he said everything to turn the table onto me but I get the feeling there is way more to this then he is letting out.

 

PLEASE I need some opinions. And like I said, more than willing to provide answers to things I may have not touched on enough.

 

Thanks in advance!

[two4youinswva 3,068]

The very next day, my family said some things that made me second guess the person I am.

What kind of things did they say? Are they aware of what you and your husband are doing?

 

So I got really self conscious and told my hubby I wanted no more "play" time until I was more comfortable with myself and our whole situation.

Good choice. Any time you aren't comfortable, don't be afraid to shut it down until you are comfortable. Even if that means permanently.

 

The whole time we've been on our swinging site he has been EXTREMELY uncomfortable with the whole thing and only doing it for me even though I had told him multiple times he was enough for me and would shut it down in a second if I ever had too (which I did today).

Either this is not true, and he's trying to make you own this situation, or it is true, and his screwing around with the other ladies is his way of "getting back". Either way, it's not healthy, or fair.

Your next statement makes me think it falls into the "not true" category, because you said.....

He has been trying to set up more play dates with the man I first played with.

 

 

I have repeatedly told him no as I was not looking to be physical with anyone else right at that time.

Stick to your guns on this one. Don't do what you don't want to do.

 

When I told him this he said there are no friends just people who want to fuck.

I don't think I have to tell you this is incorrect. I'm sure you already know this.

 

I don't know if he said everything to turn the table onto me but I get the feeling there is way more to this then he is letting out.

I think that is the case, based on what you've written.

 

 

If you are asking if you made the right decision to not swing, then my opinion is a strong "yes". You may be able to swing again in the future, it just isn't going to work right now, obviously.

 

I think the two of you need to sit down, figure out what exactly you want out of swinging, if anything at this point. Set some ground rules that you can both live by (IE: No playing without permission, and if you can't get me on the phone for permission, then too bad), and stick to those rules.

 

Swinging separately has it's own set of challenges. Are you two opposed to swinging together, with other couples only?

 

If you would, lay out exactly what questions, concerns, and the type of feedback you are looking for. That will help us give you the information you are looking for.

[Alura 2,774]

from Oklahoma, Miss Confused! We're pleased you've sought your answers here. The folks who post here know how to be friends. They will offer good advice.

 

The physical separation cannot be helpful to y'all's situation. How long is it expected to last?

 

Alura

[MissConfused 67]

What kind of things did they say? Are they aware of what you and your husband are doing?

 

 

Good choice. Any time you aren't comfortable, don't be afraid to shut it down until you are comfortable. Even if that means permanently.

 

 

Either this is not true, and he's trying to make you own this situation, or it is true, and his screwing around with the other ladies is his way of "getting back". Either way, it's not healthy, or fair.

Your next statement makes me think it falls into the "not true" category, because you said.....

 

 

 

 

Stick to your guns on this one. Don't do what you don't want to do.

 

 

I don't think I have to tell you this is incorrect. I'm sure you already know this.

 

 

I think that is the case, based on what you've written.

 

 

If you are asking if you made the right decision to not swing, then my opinion is a strong "yes". You may be able to swing again in the future, it just isn't going to work right now, obviously.

 

I think the two of you need to sit down, figure out what exactly you want out of swinging, if anything at this point. Set some ground rules that you can both live by (IE: No playing without permission, and if you can't get me on the phone for permission, then too bad), and stick to those rules.

 

Swinging separately has it's own set of challenges. Are you two opposed to swinging together, with other couples only?

 

If you would, lay out exactly what questions, concerns, and the type of feedback you are looking for. That will help us give you the information you are looking for.

 

 

 

Our family is NOT aware of our situation. They know I decided to go healthier and have been making comments on my body and my expectations. All in all negative things. So these were personal things and I didn't feel comfortable with hubby playing. Which is why I made the choice to put off the lifestyle again until he was back home and we were back to normal.

 

Update on the he wasn't comfortable part. We've been talking a lot over the phone and he said it turns him on to think of "US" playing together. He has always been there when I have done anything sexually but he feels as though he was left out which made him uncomfotable. He liked watching and hearing about it, its just the fact he didn't know how to be a part of it made him uncomfortable.

 

I called him out on the man he has been trying to get over for a playdate and he said because he wants to do it right and be fully involved this time around. I did state that I was not interested in that man again and I didn't want anyone else but him for now and maybe for the next long while.

 

We talked more lengthy into the fact that some of the people we have met are indeed our friends. I told him outright that I would not begiving up a friendship to one of the women I met because she has introduced me into the healthy lifestyle and I want to keep getting her support and advice. He totally agrees but still thinks some people are just there to fuck which I know is true as well.

 

We are definitly NOT swinging right now at all. I guess I'm having a really hard time dealing with the oral sex he recived from this girl who supposed to be a mutual friend. But together they went behind my back and did what they did even though both of them fully knew that I had said no to any playing what so ever. I say KUDOS for coming clean but there is more to the story now. Here's how it goes...

 

We had talked on the phone after he had sex with the one girl and I was already uncomfortable about everything so I told him no to anything. I said I needed to feel stronger with the relationship before any playing went down but since there was so much giong on on the weekend he could still "visit" and socialize with our friends. I expressed to him that with the distance starting to take a toll and almost being over with (tomorrow he comes home actually) I didn't want him taking part in any other activities with anyone but me. So his story goes like this. He went there with no intentions of doing anything. He told me he honestly did not find her attractive (which I know is true) and that nothing would happen. Apparently he got drunk and could not drive home. So one thing led to another and he ended up getting oral but never did have sex with her. I asked him if he thought of me and if she did to which he responded yes and the two decided I would never have to know. Later, after spending the night there and sobering up he decided he had to come clean despite agreeing that I would never hear of it.

 

Now this is where I get confused. I don't know how I should feel. I thought when I had said NOTHING as far as playing he understood which he did. But went against my words anyways. I questioned whether or not he really loved me which he claims he does. He also claimed he never again wants to play seperatly as it does nothing for him. He enjoys me playing with other men and wants to play with a couple TOGETHER when the time is right. It's very confusing for me as I don't want to give up the lifestyle but I could if he absolutly wanted too.

As far as the girl goes she played me like a fool. She is bisexual and I am straight. she did express interest in both of us and I made it quite clear I was a friend only. Hubby on the other hand was free game UNTIL I decided that we were taking a break.

 

I don't know what I'm asking exactly but thoughts are definitly appreciated!

[bbarnsworth 2,643]

I don't know if he said everything to turn the table onto me but I get the feeling there is way more to this then he is letting out.

 

I think there's a lot more going on here than has been discussed.

 

His notions of swinging and yours are not on the same page. They should be before any attempts are made to swing again (if ever). It is very unfortunate and sad that he chose to lie to you and cheat on you. It never ceases to amaze me that a person would cheat on a spouse who has given them permission to play. Why do it? It just doesn't make sense to me.

 

I know, given the constraints of his work situation, that it is hard to find time to sit down and talk. But, that's precisely what you need to do. With each other, not at each other. It's going to take a long time to clear the air and get things sorted out. If/when you can, you'll feel a great sense of relief.

 

I wouldn't consider swinging, at least for now. You've got a relationship to work on with respect to some fundamentals.

 

he feels as though he was left out which made him uncomfortable. He liked watching and hearing about it, its just the fact he didn't know how to be a part of it made him uncomfortable.

 

I don't mind my wife playing solo, and she has. But, one time she came home and was quite tired. She went to bed shortly thereafter, without much in the way of discussion. I felt horribly left out. We talked a lot the next day, and all was fine, but the feeling of being left out is something I can empathize with. It does not feel good.

 

There's plenty of ways that two men can simultaneously please a woman. My wife enjoys MFMs for this reason. One of her favorite things is to give head and have sex at the same time. If you swing again with a single male, get him directly involved.

 

I did state that I was not interested in that man again and I didn't want anyone else but him for now and maybe for the next long while.

 

Your husband needs to respect your "no" when it is voiced. There's nothing wrong with no. There's times I'd love for my wife to play, and she's said no. It's disappointing, but far, far worse would be the idea of her playing when she doesn't want to. That's not acceptable. Your husband needs to respect that.

 

since there was so much giong on on the weekend he could still "visit" and socialize with our friends.

 

Oops. You can't get fire without the basic ingredients. It's a common mistake many people make; you assure yourself and maybe others that nothing will happen. You walk in with the best of intentions, and then things happen. If you never go, nothing can happen. But, that is a tough decision to make sometimes.

 

the two decided I would never have to know. Later, after spending the night there and sobering up he decided he had to come clean despite agreeing that I would never hear of it.

 

This is a fundamental breaking of trust and is intolerable. That he came clean about it only corrects it partially. There's damage here that must be mended. Trust is a very, very strong thing. But, it can also be brittle. Your husband shattered trust, disrespected it, and worse plotted to obscure permanently. This is completely unacceptable. I'm not suggesting you break up with him or anything like that, but this needs to be corrected and the trust must be rebuilt before swinging ever happens again.

 

I don't know how I should feel.

 

Betrayed? Insulted? Treated with disrespect? Angry? Lots of possibilities come to mind. It seems obvious you want to stay with him (which is a fine choice), so the next steps are rebuilding the trust and other fundamentals of the relationship. This is not easy, and it will take a lot of time and patience.

[Newpants 21]

There are way too many issues here to address individually. To sum it all up in a nutshell, you two are way too unstable and have too many issues and too many communication and mutual respect issues to be swinging.

 

Focus on getting back in touch with each other and work on getting connected and in tune with each other as a couple and don't bring any other people into your sex lives untill you get your own relationship in order.

[Alura 2,774]

I'm glad your husband is coming home, Miss Confused. I'm sure that will help the situation.

 

Y'all need to talk out the whole confusing mess. I'd suggest that the two of you agree to answer any question as honestly as possible and to never get angry because a question is asked.

 

Then y'all need to decide which issues can be immediately discarded and forgotten and which need resolution. Make a list.

 

If y'all are determined, you will be able to work this out. Good Luck!

 

Alura

[MissConfused 67]

I think there's a lot more going on here than has been discussed.

 

His notions of swinging and yours are not on the same page. They should be before any attempts are made to swing again (if ever). It is very unfortunate and sad that he chose to lie to you and cheat on you. It never ceases to amaze me that a person would cheat on a spouse who has given them permission to play. Why do it? It just doesn't make sense to me.

 

I know, given the constraints of his work situation, that it is hard to find time to sit down and talk. But, that's precisely what you need to do. With each other, not at each other. It's going to take a long time to clear the air and get things sorted out. If/when you can, you'll feel a great sense of relief.

 

I wouldn't consider swinging, at least for now. You've got a relationship to work on with respect to some fundamentals.

 

 

 

I don't mind my wife playing solo, and she has. But, one time she came home and was quite tired. She went to bed shortly thereafter, without much in the way of discussion. I felt horribly left out. We talked a lot the next day, and all was fine, but the feeling of being left out is something I can empathize with. It does not feel good.

 

There's plenty of ways that two men can simultaneously please a woman. My wife enjoys MFMs for this reason. One of her favorite things is to give head and have sex at the same time. If you swing again with a single male, get him directly involved.

 

 

 

Your husband needs to respect your "no" when it is voiced. There's nothing wrong with no. There's times I'd love for my wife to play, and she's said no. It's disappointing, but far, far worse would be the idea of her playing when she doesn't want to. That's not acceptable. Your husband needs to respect that.

 

 

 

Oops. You can't get fire without the basic ingredients. It's a common mistake many people make; you assure yourself and maybe others that nothing will happen. You walk in with the best of intentions, and then things happen. If you never go, nothing can happen. But, that is a tough decision to make sometimes.

 

 

 

This is a fundamental breaking of trust and is intolerable. That he came clean about it only corrects it partially. There's damage here that must be mended. Trust is a very, very strong thing. But, it can also be brittle. Your husband shattered trust, disrespected it, and worse plotted to obscure permanently. This is completely unacceptable. I'm not suggesting you break up with him or anything like that, but this needs to be corrected and the trust must be rebuilt before swinging ever happens again.

 

 

 

Betrayed? Insulted? Treated with disrespect? Angry? Lots of possibilities come to mind. It seems obvious you want to stay with him (which is a fine choice), so the next steps are rebuilding the trust and other fundamentals of the relationship. This is not easy, and it will take a lot of time and patience.

 

 

"It never ceases to amaze me that a person would cheat on a spouse who has given them permission to play. Why do it? It just doesn't make sense to me. "

I think that comment is what I'm having the hardest time dealing with most. I do not understand at all why he would do this. Before swinging I was inexperienced and open to trying new things. But not like this.

We are 100% taking a break from swinging. As for being on the same page that's another thing I know we need to work on. I don't know what he wants out of the lifestyle exactly. I know what I want. I want good times and fun friends who I can talk open and honestly with. I also DO NOT want it to damage our realtionship. I want both of us to have fun and excell in the lifestyle together. But this has happened. I don't think we're done with the swinging scene but definitly not doing it for a while. The funny thing is when I played I felt closer and stronger with my hubby then ever. I didn't feel like he was upset about it, nor did he let on that he was. He gave me the impression he was loving it. Which I honestly believe he did in fact enjoy.

He admitted today he had a raging hard on when we talked on the phone about doing anything together as a couple whether it be with a man or a couple. I know he isn't done with swinging either.

And we will be talking face to face tomorrow about everything. I know right now I just need him. I need to know it was just a mistake on his part but I also need to know WHY. Thats my biggest question right now and he can't give me an answer. It's beginning to give me a headache thinking of all the reasons. I asked him about insecurities, jealousy issues, anything that would give him a reason to do what he did. And I get "I don't knows".

I've been glued to this site all day waiting for answers and suggestions, thoughts. I appreciate all the input thus far and still can't wait to hear more.

[MissConfused 67]

There are way too many issues here to address individually. To sum it all up in a nutshell, you two are way too unstable and have too many issues and too many communication and mutual respect issues to be swinging.

 

Focus on getting back in touch with each other and work on getting connected and in tune with each other as a couple and don't bring any other people into your sex lives untill you get your own relationship in order.

 

Maybe my post didn't make that much sense as I was rushing it and didn't want it to be a story. But we are not unstable until this last week. The biggest issue is to how to address his mistake. Before this we were happy and very solid. I am upset right now, not so much angry anymore but still confused on how to handle the situation.

 

Mutual respect? I have total respect from my husband, hence the reason I came here to find out if there is absolutly no respect for me from him. I guess I was hoping someone could relate with a similar experience.

 

But we are working at getting back on track via the phone right now. Can't do as much when its not face to face.

[MissConfused 67]

I'm glad your husband is coming home, Miss Confused. I'm sure that will help the situation.

 

Y'all need to talk out the whole confusing mess. I'd suggest that the two of you agree to answer any question as honestly as possible and to never get angry because a question is asked.

 

Then y'all need to decide which issues can be immediately discarded and forgotten and which need resolution. Make a list.

 

If y'all are determined, you will be able to work this out. Good Luck!

 

Alura

 

 

Great advice Alura and I will keep it with me when I talk to my husband tommorrow. We have both been very level headed although with heavy chests. Trying to resolve the situation over the phone is turning out to be daunting and next to impossible. But thank you none the less! It's greatly appreciated.

[two4youinswva 3,068]

There are way too many issues here to address individually. To sum it all up in a nutshell, you two are way too unstable and have too many issues and too many communication and mutual respect issues to be swinging.

 

Focus on getting back in touch with each other and work on getting connected and in tune with each other as a couple and don't bring any other people into your sex lives untill you get your own relationship in order.

 

While I agree that they shouldn't be swinging right now, the fact is she said she has cut off swinging in her very first post.

 

I am going to assume when you say they are both way too unstable you mean as a couple, because, as I see it, MissConfused has done nothing incorrectly, and has so far handled this pretty much like any experienced swinger would. She was honest, tried to involve her husband in their play, trusted him, and, when the shit hit the fan, she attempted to shut down all swinging activities. I'd say she, as an individual, is pretty damn stable, all things considered.

[MissConfused 67]

While I agree that they shouldn't be swinging right now, the fact is she said she has cut off swinging in her very first post.

 

I am going to assume when you say they are both way too unstable you mean as a couple, because, as I see it, MissConfused has done nothing incorrectly, and has so far handled this pretty much like any experienced swinger would. She was honest, tried to involve her husband in their play, trusted him, and, when the shit hit the fan, she attempted to shut down all swinging activities. I'd say she, as an individual, is pretty damn stable, all things considered.

 

Thanks for noticing.

 

 

Again, just here to hear other peoples opinions. I don't have many people to talk to about the situation. I debated on talking with a couple I have confided in before but decided I didn't want to at our own discretion. Not that this couple has a big mouth, just cause I'd rather the people we have become friends with not find out. I guess I am ashamed at my partners decision.

[realcplub2 513]

I have decided to use this reply to postings rather than hijack the whole thread with one super long post.. So here we go...

 

Our family is NOT aware of our situation. They know I decided to go healthier and have been making comments on my body and my expectations. All in all negative things. So these were personal things and I didn't feel comfortable with hubby playing. Which is why I made the choice to put off the lifestyle again until he was back home and we were back to normal.

 

Let me ask you an honest question.. Do these people decide anything else for you.. Do they tell you what to wear, what to eat, and where to work or shop?

 

Family can be a great asset, to be sure, but the same people can be the biggest roadblocks to happiness in our lives. Its often so much easier to pick you apart than to take an honest assessment of themselves.

 

You have every right to take what they said to heart, but, personally, anyone who wants to be critical of Me or Mine, had better be ready for sainthood themselves.

 

Never let someone else influence how you feel in your own skin

 

Update on the he wasn't comfortable part. We've been talking a lot over the phone and he said it turns him on to think of "US" playing together. He has always been there when I have done anything sexually but he feels as though he was left out which made him uncomfortable. He liked watching and hearing about it, its just the fact he didn't know how to be a part of it made him uncomfortable.

 

Lets be clear, he is right.. You started talking as a couple, and for your first event sent him to warm up the car as you played solo.. And when he came in, waited for the invite that never came.. This is the biggest issue that can arise when a couple decides to play without the other SOLO. Levels of jealousy occur at different times.. And watching from the door, listening from the living room, isn't the same as BEING THERE.

 

Because you played solo, sending him out/away.. it sets a screwed up dynamic in motion. He was telling you he wanted to be involved but was unsure IF you wanted him involved.. reaching out for him would have went along way, rolling over and flipping the covers back for him to get in bed is another

 

I called him out on the man he has been trying to get over for a playdate and he said because he wants to do it right and be fully involved this time around. I did state that I was not interested in that man again and I didn't want anyone else but him for now and maybe for the next long while.

 

This should have been done immediately, to put the fantasy back on track so to speak.

 

I am sure that during the discussions as well as the fantasy sharing, it was a 3 some not just watching you with another guy, or more importantly, Did you say you just wanted a new guy or to experience what it was like to be with him and another?

 

We talked more lengthy into the fact that some of the people we have met are indeed our friends. I told him outright that I would not begiving up a friendship to one of the women I met because she has introduced me into the healthy lifestyle and I want to keep getting her support and advice. He totally agrees but still thinks some people are just there to fuck which I know is true as well.

 

This is of course true, but then haven't you ever met/heard of someone who wanted to be friends simply because they WANTED something? And yes, they want to FUCK, after all they are swinging friends, the thing that amazes me on a daily basis is when you meet someone thru the lifestyle, maybe you play maybe you don’t, but then get shocked when they PLAY WITH SOMEONE ELSE!?!

 

If you met them sitting on a bridge fishing you wouldn't be shocked if they were trying to catch fish again would you?

 

The key is to know Who is who, and what YOU want your relationships to be.

 

We are definitely NOT swinging right now at all. I guess I'm having a really hard time dealing with the oral sex he received from this girl who supposed to be a mutual friend. But together they went behind my back and did what they did even though both of them fully knew that I had said no to any playing what so ever. I say KUDOS for coming clean but there is more to the story now. Here's how it goes... We had talked on the phone after he had sex with the one girl and I was already uncomfortable about everything so I told him no to anything. I said I needed to feel stronger with the relationship before any playing went down but since there was so much going on on the weekend he could still "visit" and socialize with our friends. I expressed to him that with the distance starting to take a toll and almost being over with (tomorrow he comes home actually) I didn't want him taking part in any other activities with anyone but me.

 

This is sensible, and no one can knock you for this, why go OUT to PLAY when you aren’t playing at home

 

 

So his story goes like this. He went there with no intentions of doing anything. He told me he honestly did not find her attractive (which I know is true) and that nothing would happen. Apparently he got drunk and could not drive home. So one thing led to another and he ended up getting oral but never did have sex with her. I asked him if he thought of me and if she did to which he responded yes and the two decided I would never have to know. Later, after spending the night there and sobering up he decided he had to come clean despite agreeing that I would never hear of it.

 

Now this is where I get confused. I don't know how I should feel. I thought when I had said NOTHING as far as playing he understood which he did. But went against my words anyways. I questioned whether or not he really loved me which he claims he does. He also claimed he never again wants to play separately as it does nothing for him. He enjoys me playing with other men and wants to play with a couple TOGETHER when the time is right. It's very confusing for me as I don't want to give up the lifestyle but I could if he absolutely wanted too.

 

Ok, here is the bottom line, Yes what happened between this other woman and him was WRONG, and can be called flat out cheating, But he did admit he was wrong.

 

As far as the girl goes she played me like a fool. She is bisexual and I am straight. she did express interest in both of us and I made it quite clear I was a friend only. Hubby on the other hand was free game UNTIL I decided that we were taking a break.

 

I don't know what I'm asking exactly but thoughts are definitely appreciated!

 

Ok, MissConfused, Please Do not interpret what is said above as a SLAM or FLAME, but an attempt as constructive criticism

 

In many threads here we advocate swinging as a COUPLES SPORT. You read threads and posts on here before making the decision to go for it. Many threads and blogs talk about keeping each other involved. as was pointed out and you wrote, he is trying to get that aspect back on track. The fact that you attract good looking guys and he hasn't been thrilled with those he has connected with can be a source or argument too. By choosing as a couple, to play as a couple, you both have a voice in Who what where and when..

 

In another post to this you wrote something to the effect that he wanted to do this together, be it a MFM threesome or anything else.. The visual aspect as well as Sharing the intimacy together can be a vital key to those just starting out in getting past the guilt as well as battling back the jealousy.

 

In your case it caused the problems we would expect it to, when you went in one direction and he went another.. And when you slowed down he kept his pace, trying to catch up..

[MissConfused 67]

"Let me ask you an honest question.. Do these people decide anything else for you.. Do they tell you what to wear, what to eat, and where to work or shop?"

 

No they don't and I understand that I shouldn't have taken what was said to heart. I can take critisism from a friend or stranger but find it harder to swallow and ignore when its from a family member. It was also harder to ignore because of my feelings on my hubby being away for long periods of time. I started doubting many things, my appearance only a small part of that.

 

"Lets be clear, he is right.. You started talking as a couple, and for your first event sent him to warm up the car as you played solo.. And when he came in, waited for the invite that never came.. This is the biggest issue that can arise when a couple decides to play without the other SOLO. Levels of jealousy occur at different times.. And watching from the door, listening from the living room, isn't the same as BEING THERE.

Because you played solo, sending him out/away.. it sets a screwed up dynamic in motion. He was telling you he wanted to be involved but was unsure IF you wanted him involved.. reaching out for him would have went along way, rolling over and flipping the covers back for him to get in bed is another"

 

I never specified we have a profile which states looking for men women and couples as we had decided on learning as we went thus played together and seperate. We have now both played seperate but never together. It's harder finding a common attraction when its 4 people instead of 2. Hence the reason we decided to learn as we went. But yes the whole situation was rather confusing and you nailed him feeling like he was sent away so I could play solo right on. I had told him before we went to this mans house I wasn't sure what to expect or how to go about anything. I never got any indication from anyone when anything was to start thus went the way I found easiest. Wrong yes, unfixable? No. I felt if he had vocalized about how he felt after the experiance today I might not be feeling how I feel.

 

"The key is to know Who is who, and what YOU want your relationships to be."

I did know thisand expected... or DEMANDED that we have rules and the other party listened. If one wanted to take a break WE both took the break, not when it was conveniant. He had conveniance and chose to ignore my request for playing to stop until I was secure in the relationship and my own skin again. Honestly, I don't find that a hard request to follow especially when the adult lifestyle is part of the relationship.

 

 

"k, here is the bottom line, Yes what happened between this other woman and him was WRONG, and can be called flat out cheating, But he did admit he was wrong."

I don't know if its because I'm a woman but I need to know why. WHY did it happen and ths far I have gotten feeble answers. I did get one I was half ass understanding but definitly not ok with which was he only went forth with everything because they decided I would not find out. After doing it and being back where he was supposed to be he decided that he needed to tell me because he loved me and really fucked up. I'm angry and completely devastated that he couldn't follow one little rule. It's not like I had said no swinging ever EVER again. I said I need a break to be with him and only him.

 

I appreciate the response and do take everything you said as an opinion. I know its harder to understand the full situation without every last detail being put forth as well. Thanks realcplub2.

[bbarnsworth 2,643]

I do not understand at all why he would do this.

 

I would encourage you to not base a sense of resolution to this upon the idea that you will understand it. Some things defy logic, reason, understanding. They happen anyway. Your husband may not be able to articulate why it happened even to himself. If he can't articulate it to you, don't presume he's holding back. It's a discussion with himself that may take a long time to resolve.

 

What I think is important to getting past this isn't understanding why it happened, but understanding how to avoid it in the future. The insistence on playing together when you get back into swinging I think is a step in that direction.

 

I don't know what he wants out of the lifestyle exactly. I know what I want.[/quote

 

Communicate, communicate, communicate. When you're done communicating, spend more time communicating. Be honest, open, non-judgmental, appreciative, and assume good faith.

 

I also DO NOT want it to damage our relationship.

 

It shouldn't, if you get your relationship feet back under you and put some time between these recent events and your next swinging encounter.

 

The funny thing is when I played I felt closer and stronger with my hubby then ever.

 

Many swingers experience this. My wife and I did too, even though we had an amazing relationship before we got into swinging. As often said, swinging is a magnifying glass for relationships. What it finds, it magnifies.

 

He admitted today he had a raging hard on when we talked on the phone about doing anything together as a couple whether it be with a man or a couple.

 

Another often said thing; fantasy and reality in swinging are two different things. It can be incredibly erotic to fantasize about playing with other people or watching your spouse playing with other people. The reality might not be the same. Even now, for my wife and I, the fantasy and reality aren't the same. They're both awesome, but different. Relishing the fantasy is good, but being comfortable and happy in swinging means relishing the reality too.

 

I know right now I just need him. I need to know it was just a mistake on his part but I also need to know WHY. Thats my biggest question right now and he can't give me an answer.

 

See above. Getting to the 'why' may be impossible. I wouldn't focus on it. If your house burned down, and you never learned why, it might bother you. It might make you wonder if your new house is a fire waiting to happen. It might make you uncomfortable. But, even so getting to the 'why' in that situation doesn't mean you eliminate the threat of fire.

 

It's far more important to get to the underpinnings of your relationship. Work on the fundamentals. Be open with each other, loving, intimate, spend sharing time with each other, try to move forward. If you're focused on the past, trying to put everything that is in the past in its place, you are going to find a very hard time moving forward.

 

Instead, learn from the mistakes. What mistakes were made? Don't ask why, ask what mistakes were made. How can you avoid those mistakes again in the future? What similar sorts of mistakes can be avoided with some common sense actions (or inaction)? Your husband mixed alcohol, a party, and a play partner together. All it needed was an ignition, and poof there's a problem. Don't allow that sort of situation to evolve again.

 

It's beginning to give me a headache thinking of all the reasons. I asked him about insecurities, jealousy issues, anything that would give him a reason to do what he did. And I get "I don't knows".

 

As I noted, there's a good chance HE doesn't know. He very well might not be obfuscating. Don't presume an "I don't know" means he's holding things back. That presumes more nefarious things happening, and gets you nowhere. Take it at face value that he doesn't know. "Ok, I understand you don't know. I accept that. Let's work on moving forward, and avoid a repeat"

 

I've been glued to this site all day waiting for answers and suggestions, thoughts. I appreciate all the input thus far and still can't wait to hear more.

 

Ever get the feeling your adrift in a barren sea, looking for something lurking far beneath the surface? Unattainable, but you're desperate to find it?

 

That's the uncertainty of finding the "why".

 

Change the matrix. Change the approach. Focus on positive, and learn from the negative.

 

Mutual respect? I have total respect from my husband, hence the reason I came here to find out if there is absolutly no respect for me from him. I guess I was hoping someone could relate with a similar experience.

 

A long time ago, I cheated on a girlfriend. I knew exactly what I was doing. It wasn't alcohol induced. I was very much in love with my girlfriend of the time. Yet, I cheated on her anyway. To this day, I don't know that I can firmly say exactly WHY it happened. I have ideas, but it's not as if I plugged the final answer into a computer and a big flashing light came on saying "CORRECT!". There's no feedback loop on answering "why" that gives you this.

 

The woman (let's call her "Ann") with whom I cheated on my girlfriend ("Beth") I was not particularly attracted to. I was initially very reluctant for things to progress. I even verbalized those concerns to Ann. There'd been some sexually charged jokes earlier in the evening, but nothing out of the ordinary that you would find at a typical college age party.

 

Beth was literally thousands of miles away. I hadn't seen here in months. Ann was in person, there, available. Can I attribute 'why' to opportunity? That's a cop out. No, I can't. It might have played a role, but it wasn't THE reason.

 

As the evening progressed, Ann was increasingly forthright with her intentions. Post mortem, I now know that Ann had been wanting to date me, get me in bed, what have you, for months before this particular evening. Even after I verbalized my reluctance to Ann, and that I wasn't going to cheat on Beth, Ann was still very aggressive in advancing things that evening. Can I attribute 'why' to Ann being sexually aggressive? Hell no. I have more self control than that. Her desires should have no effect on the decision I made, and it would be incredibly insulting to lay blame on her, both to her and myself.

 

In the aftermath, before I told Beth, I was kicking myself around every block on the planet. "Why the f*** did I do that????", "Holy crap what a collosal f***up I am!", and on and on and on.

 

When I saw Beth a few weeks later, I told her everything. As it turned out, while she was away she'd cheated on me too. That sure as hell didn't make things better. Could the fact we both cheated on each other point to some underlying problem in our relationship that set the stage for each of us cheating on the other? Another cop-out.

 

Beth's reaction was to get every detail of that evening from me. Every last memory I had of that evening was extracted from me in excruciating detail. The telling of it was devastating to me, very painful. It was like actively ripping the wounds open further. Beth had to have it out. There was no way she could move forward without it. Then she went and saw Ann and confronted her. Not to be angry at her, but to get every detail from her that she could. Beth needed corroboration of what I said as a means to begin trust again. But, it didn't work.

 

Two years later, Beth and I finally broke up. The rotting, dead carcass of our relationship was something both of us wanted to put behind us, never to be touched again. We're still in touch to this day, though she lives in another state. We've never talked about our relationship since.

 

What I derived from it is this; I still don't know why things happened the way they did that night. It's been years upon years since it happened, and I still can't answer why. I do know this; how we approached resolving the issue was absolutely wrong. We kept looking into the past, kept trying to shut pandora's box, kept trying to stitch up the rends in the relationship without understanding or even attempting to understand how the rends kept opening over and over again.

 

Obsessing about the 'why' here will NOT get you forward.

 

That's my opinion, and worth the hefty price of the electrons you paid for to display it on your computer. But the opinion is based on my anecdotal experience in a situation having some similarity to yours.

 

One thing that may help move forward is to make a conscious effort to be intimate with him when he returns. I'm not saying jump in the bed and have sex the moment he walks in the door. Holding hands can be intimate, hugging, kissing, cuddling, spending time together, listening, doing something for him you know he likes. There's a zillion ways to express intimacy that have nothing to do with sex. Saying you love him and showing it are different. Showing it has an emotional component that connects in ways that words can not.

[MissConfused 67]

I really enjoyed reading from you bbarnsworth. I want to say I came to this realization myself last night. I did plan on talking with him a little more about it but not dwelling on it so much. I am beginning to understand an answer can be I don't know. Usually I have an answer but there has been a few times times when I can't describe my actions either. Not so much to do with sexual mistakes but mistakes in general.

There will be new rules set forth when it comes to swinging. As for right now I don't know if its something I plan on doing for a very long while.

I know we do have a very strong relationship and this was just a speedbump. I know for a fact I am not so mad at the act itself but the fact that he knew I wasn't comfortable with anything going on at that time. And the thought did cross my mind to not let him go because the ingrediants were there for "fire" as some say. I did let him play with it, and instead of leaving he stayed. I guess we are learning as we go a long. I never had any intention of leaving him but I do have a few more questions for him. I tried to out myself in his situation and I like to think I could have said no and walked out but maybe I wouldn't have either. I can't say for sure and shouldn't act as though I "know for a fact" I wouldn't. And I do love my hubby with all my heart. IF I didn't I would have just left...

 

He will be home in a couple hours and all I want to do is hug him. He said he wouldn't be surprised if he was greeted to a slap in the face but I've never done that and I wouldn't start now.

 

I owe everyone here a big thanks, because if I hadn't had a soul to talk to I probably would have drove myself crazy. I think seeing it from other peoples perspectives has helped me be more level headed with the situation.

 

So again, all advice has been greatly appreciated.

[ClosetSwinger 112]

Thanks for noticing.

 

 

Again, just here to hear other peoples opinions. I don't have many people to talk to about the situation. I debated on talking with a couple I have confided in before but decided I didn't want to at our own discretion. Not that this couple has a big mouth, just cause I'd rather the people we have become friends with not find out. I guess I am ashamed at my partners decision.

 

I totally agree with everything stated above. You ARE handling this well, it's best NOT to involve others that know you if you can avoid it. Any sort of drama usually scares people off.

[bbarnsworth 2,643]

I totally agree with everything stated above. You ARE handling this well

 

Piggyback. I think you're handling it very well too. There's plenty of dynamite sticks lying around and you're actively choosing not to light the fuses. You're struggling with it, but you're not throwing knives. A lot of people in a similar situation would be throwing nuclear bombs. Not to say that wouldn't be justified, but the way you're handling this is more calm and rational. Bravo!

 

Giving him that huge hug when you seem him as opposed to a slap will make a big, big difference.

[bbarnsworth 2,643]

Any updates to this? Hoping for the best...

[realcplub2 513]

never specified we have a profile which states looking for men women and couples as we had decided on learning as we went thus played together and seperate. We have now both played seperate but never together. It's harder finding a common attraction when its 4 people instead of 2. Hence the reason we decided to learn as we went. But yes the whole situation was rather confusing and you nailed him feeling like he was sent away so I could play solo right on. I had told him before we went to this mans house I wasn't sure what to expect or how to go about anything. I never got any indication from anyone when anything was to start thus went the way I found easiest. Wrong yes, unfixable? No. I felt if he had vocalized about how he felt after the experiance today I might not be feeling how I feel.

 

Hi again, its been over 10 days since you added anything, and I apologise for not reading your reply to our post before this.

 

I wasnt being critical of you in anyway, when I was explaining the problems you have had are one of the first pitfalls of seperate play.

 

To be honest and I am sure plenty of people right here will agree, its NEVER easy finding a couple that ALL 4 are on the same page from the beginning. A lot of people start out with solo play or threesomes and over the course of time, expand thier sexploration to other couples. Sometimes though, the time taken to find another couple can be well worth it.

 

You are in a difficult spot, the advice offered by everyone else, is fantastic, and hopefully will help you work thru this. My point was that, between what happend, unspoken feelings HE was having, and the other factor.. Time and OPPORTUNITY, it happend. You do have every right to the feeling you have, But, the explainations he gives are every bit as credible as are your vadiation for your feelings.

 

Yes you have every right to be pissed with this other woman, she violated a trust, as well. But adding that into the equation isnt helpful.

 

I would ask you to be honest with yourself, which would you find more upsetting

 

He came clean with you about what happend

 

But suppose he had done what they had conspired to do, and kept quiet about it, and never told you.. You may have found out weeks, months, or years later.. Which is more upsetting?

 

Best course of action now, is to decide if working thru this is what you CAN do, or are you going to have a difficult time forgiving him.. I didnt say FORGETTING.. I said FORGIVING

 

Do that first and the rest should fall into place

[richdon03 31]

I'm glad your husband is coming home, Miss Confused. I'm sure that will help the situation.

 

Y'all need to talk out the whole confusing mess. I'd suggest that the two of you agree to answer any question as honestly as possible and to never get angry because a question is asked.

 

Then y'all need to decide which issues can be immediately discarded and forgotten and which need resolution. Make a list.

 

If y'all are determined, you will be able to work this out. Good Luck!

 

Alura

 

Before I respond, Miss Confused, I must confess I haven't read all of the responses.

 

Having walked in your husband's shoes (to an extent), I must agree with Alura's response.

 

When a couple begins swinging, they see and feel things for which they are often unprepared. Things are not always very clear, especially to a healthy male. Most of us secretly fantasize about seeing our spouse with another man, but are not quite prepared for the mixed emotions that that experience may cause. When I saw my wife penetrated for the first time, I hated it and loved it at the same time. I had zero interest in his wife, so I missed out on my own initiation. Part of me wanted to "even the score," while the other part of me wanted to get home as fast as possible and bang her brains out like you and your husband, that's exactly what we did.

 

While I never hooked up with anyone else because we refused to go to swing clubs alone, I can assure you that if I had, there were one or two women that we knew who could have talked me into anything. My advice is to forgive your husband. Both of you are learning. Swinging, no matter how close you think you may be, requires a major leap of faith, and sometimes things don't go as planned and someone screws up, often unintentionally. When your self-confidence level returns and you and your husband are ready to try again, you'll be a bit more prepared. Work on your relationship with each other first. Swinging will still be around.

 

Best of luck to you.

[lizandtom 512]

Not having read through the lengthy string but understanding the basics, MissConfused it really is very simple.

 

You get a lot of attention so have your pick of the litter so to speak. Guys are a dime a dozen so there is a LOT of competition. Your husband got a chance to explore with a live breathing willing participant twice, and jumped at the chance even though he probably knew it MAY cause some friction. But, it was justified in his mind since YOU had gotten some playtime with that single guy, although your husband felt uncomfortable because he didn't know where he fit in. IMHO THAT'S YOUR FAULT and partially what has caused him to get 'what he could, when he could' now.

 

Let me explain (if I've read the chain of events right): You sent your husband to start the car. While he was gone you started to get it on with the guy. Since you supposedly were in it together, you should have waited, after some preliminary petting for husband to get back BEFORE starting in on the heavy stuff to make sure HE was involved, AND comfortable; i.e. you go at the slowest persons pace. By getting into it heavy before your husband got back, as you said, made him uncomfortable. Therefore I think his two solo foray's were acceptable, in his mind, as a direct result of you role modeling that you can get it on without him being present.

 

Why has he said that he wants to be in the lifestyle ONLY as a couple? Simply because the women (in this case, YOU) are calling the shots, and it's two fold: 1. he stands a much better chance of getting some if you are involved, as swinging is mostly about couples, and 2. if you are present and calling shots and things are done 'your way,' there's much less friction that will occur, and you both can relax and enjoy the ride.

 

Conclusion: he's learned his lesson in all probability so cut him some slack and stop the self-pity facade. You got yours, he got his, it didn't work out solo probably because you both rely on each other for support, now go at it together and have some fun!

[richdon03 31]

Lizandtom, WELL SAID! MissConfused, lizandtom probably just gave you the answer that you were seeking from your husband. If he is a typical male, he probably couldn't find the words (or the heart) to put it so succinctly. Life is a learning process. Forgive him (and yourself) and move on.

[bi4me2 93]

Well we both feel for you and understand your pain and confusion.

 

We might be different than a lot of swingers out there but with us it is always 'us' ... no if ands or buts about it.

 

But you have brought up one word that is core to our relationship and has been since day one ... trust. Without that everything else is really nothing more than lip service now isn't it. Losing that trust is more than painful ... especially when you thought it was the core of your relationship.

 

But we also can't relate 100% to the topic because when we play it is 'us' .... we never quite understood the 'open' thing where each person could go out and do what they want (with or without permission) ... but that's us.

 

And pardon us for saying it but what part of no isn't be understood? Isn't that one of the core things in swinging? no means no?

 

We can't blame you one bit for backing away from the lifestyle because of this. When you give trust and that trust is taken for granted it really has to hurt.

 

Lastly we are really confused about why he isn't interested in swinging along with you ... to us at least that makes no sense because to us that is part of the excitement.

 

So we guess in a sense we are as confused as you.

[MissConfused 67]

Any updates to this? Hoping for the best...

 

I was going through my old posts and decided to do an update.

 

Everything was and still is worked out. It never takes us long to solve a problem, and this was no exception.

I disappeared from the boards from lack of feeling the need to be here(and a little bit of forgetting once the make up sex started). I'm back and I'm sure in time, my hubby will start asking questions and getting involved here too.

 

Anyways, to this particular thread all we did was sit down and discuss. I calmed right down (ok, mostly right down) and when he got home we TALKED(and yes I gave him that hug I so badly wanted).

I was angry he betrayed my trust and he knew he messed up. I'm sure he did it for the reasons LizandTom said but either way it still wasn't a justified or rationalized decision on his part.

He apologized and we decided to go with a break. It lasted about 5 months and we still haven't played yet since getting back into the swing of things. We just lived our lives without anything to do with the LS other than talking. We discussed what we liked and what we wanted from Swinging, and single play isn't involved in that anymore.

We are a couple and that's what we want to play as. He still wants me to play with men because he wants to be a part of that as well.

 

Anywho, I hope anyone reading this learns from it. TRY to decide what you want from the LS instead of "going with the flow". It doesn't always work best and it's not always fair to one or both peoples in the relationship.