What sort of swinger are you?

[Chicup 42]

Having recently begun looking for couples again, and enjoying all the fun that is, it reinforced something I forgot about from the last time we were looking.

 

Most swingers tend to be looking for couples that are either 'equal' to them in attractiveness or better. Few are willing to go the other way.

 

And I have to admit we fit that category. We will settle 'downward' but only marginally.

 

It is not a conscious discrimination, its just if they are not at our level it just doesn't work for me.

 

Now some people get upset with the concept of 'level' in attractiveness, but its there. There are couples we see their profile and look and instantly know there will be no interest on their part. We are not in the same league as they are. I know it goes the other way as well.

 

I think this way of thinking though is why its such a problem finding couples and why so many couples complain they can't find anyone.

 

Now not everyone does this. Some are far more willing to work down so to speak, and I've seen others who only want couples far better than they are.

 

So where do you fall?

[SW_PA_Couple 4,026]

You are thinking too hard. Why all of this bother about image? JoAnn and I have both surprised ourselves by raising the bar and by going under it (can you say Limbo Stick). Three years ago, I showed her a profile of two well-sculptured, sun-tanned people and she told me I was out of my mind and that I would embarrass myself by sending a note. Well, they answered us and the rest is, as they say, history. On another occasion, she says, "You mean you would fuck that? Oh, go ahead and send a message. What do I care." They might not be built like Ferraris, but they get plenty good mileage.

[exploringRM 305]

We were at a meet and greet recently and a playmate of mine mentioned a couple they had just met; I think they may have known of the couple through mutual friends. I asked why they were not talking to them more and she said she thought they were out of their league. (Of course I later wondered what about us made us in their league, lol)

 

My wife is not thin, has some extra padding. When I show her profiles of people that are either interested in us or I would like to contact she immediately looks at the woman. If the woman is thinner and/or in shape she is reluctant to say yes as she wonders why the other man would be interested in her having the wife he has.

 

But I guess I do the same thing. I will look at a couple that I consider much more attractive than us and say why would they be interested.

 

From a purely online point of view, all you have to go on are the pictures. True there are the words in the profile but typically they will not overcome a lack of attraction in the pictures. I don't look at a couple and think, oh they are are not in our league (below us). It's more do we find them attractive. For us that can be a wide range.

 

I still have not figured out how to nail a picture of guy that my wife will definitely find attractive, but I can usually spot the ones that she will say NFW. So I'll speak for myself. I have to find the women's face attractive; I don't find XXL women attractive, but go for HWP in a general sense.

 

I feel we are an attractive couple, but that alone is meaningless as I see many profiles that say the same thing and I find no level of attractiveness (to the point of what the heck are they thinking?). I can say that it's rare that we are contacted by couples we find attractive or super attractive. Most contacts have been immediate no thanks based on the pictures alone.

 

So are those couples contacting us not thinking about levels of attractiveness at all? Do they think we are in their league? Above thier league? Are we not getting as many contacts from couples we find attractive due to us being below their league? Or do they consider us out of their league?

 

All of this sounds so shallow when summed up this way, but we are here to enjoy ourselves and involve others in that enjoyment.

 

Sorry for the litany above, lol. I had posted a similar question on a forum in a swing site was are on so already had alot of thoughts rumbling around. Some of the resposes I got there:

 

• What do you have to lose, contact those people you feel are out of your league. The worse they can do is say no.
   
  
• You should contact people +/- 2 levels of yourself on 1-10 hotness scale. (though the question was asked how to you rate yourself)
   
  
• In some discussion on the hotness scale they find that the women are hot, the men are not.
  

[Coupleerotic22 1,419]

Okay, I had to think about this one a bit, but I'll take a stab at it.

 

First, I had to think about, "above or below our level". I really don't think that way. Either I find them attractive or I don't. The same is true for the wife. I know I have looked at potential playmates and thought my wife would not be interested, and I was wrong. The Mrs. has done the same.

 

I will say I am not looking for a life long mate, I already have that. I am looking for a good time. And as bad as that may sound I have a different standard for the two.

 

I know I have looked a women and thought "WOW! Nice (fill in the blank and blank), I might be interested in playing with her", even though they may not be my ideal of the perfect women in every way. That is fine because I already found my ideal, and I am only looking to have a good time, not a life long relationship. If I held playmates to the same high standard, I would rarely get to play.

 

Now, that may sound like I am settling, but I am not. I am still selective, just not as selective as I would be if I were looking for someone to wake up with every morning.

 

As for not contacting someone that is "out of my league," I just don't think that way either. Call it over confidence, call it being naive or what ever, but I have never been afraid to approach the hottest girl around. Maybe it was because I used to be a jock and jocks, like rockers, often dated up, so maybe it is just old habit that I won't let die (because I am certainly not a jock anymore). Does it always pay off? Nope, sometimes I get shot down, sometimes it is not pretty either. Other times I might get no answer and still others times I get a yes. Does that stop me or shake my confidence? Nope, I just shrug it off, maintain a good attitude toward them and ask another hotty I am interested in.

 

Some interesting observations:

 

No does not always stay no.

 

I have passed on women I have met online only to meet them in person latter and change my mind. I am a sucker for a pretty face and a fun personality.

 

Women that have said no to me have changed their mind when they met me. I think it is part due to my personality (I have been told I am fun ), and in part that I did not change my demeanor towards them. I knew it was a "no" but I still treated them nicely and with respect, did not avoid them but also did not hit on them either.

 

Women have change their mind on me when they have seen me with another women. They have gone from no to yes when they see me with someone they feel is "in the same league" as they see themselves. On the flip side, I have had women cool off when they see me with a woman who they feel is "not in the same league" as they see themselves. Both annoy me, because it is shallow and they are too worried about appearances. I prefer to hang with women who like me for who I am, not who I fuck. In fact I would prefer to hand with the ones that turned me down than I would with the shallow ones.

[sexyrose582 15]

I am new to these boards, but not to swinging. I am over 50 and overweight and although I am not obese it is hard to not be intimidated by younger, thinner women. I am constantly amazed, though, by the men that hit on me. They are often much hotter than I would expect. I guess there are men who like curves and a little extra padding

[ALilOEverything 901]

I do find myself more excited about couples with similar degree of attractiveness than too far in either direction. When it comes to the men, some I've been with are more attractive than my husband and some were less attractive. No matter what they all still need to fall in that range of what I consider attractive. A great personality will definitely bump someone less attractive into that range. Most of the time I think it's a broad range until I look at the bulk of the SLS profiles and it's probably a lot more narrow than I may admit to.

[exploringRM 305]

as far as seemingly trading down....

 

There have been a few couples that we have met and my wife was not really hot on the guy based on the pictures. We met these people in a group situation, not a specific date for the nite so we were not as selective since it was easy to move on.

 

After meeting and getting the know the guy my wife was surprised that she was attracted. Personality does go a long way.

 

I can say as a guy that if for some reason the attraction is not way up there(for what ever reason) it can make it hard (well soft) to perform. I'm careful to avoid those situations.

[Learning 160]

Personality is amazing totally makes the person and the attractiveness is the cherry on top. I used to joke with our friends that we were middle class swingers (few extra pounds, but cute, and good personalities). I remember getting passed over by a couple on SLS after exchanging pics noting that we didn't fit their desire...I had a huge laugh six months later when at a party he was grinding all over me at a party and strongly enouraging us to hit their room later. I just giggled and thought "no way in hell" buddy.

[The Fuse 1,012]

I think many of us, if not most, tend to think we're more attractive than we really are. (Especially as we get older, because our self-image tends not to age as fast as our bodies.) Not only that, but we're used to our own flaws and those of our mate, so we tend to accommodate them in our minds and get used to thinking of our 'level' as it would be without those flaws. There are so many couples we know who seem to think they're more attractive than we think they are. We and others may wonder, "Doesn't he know he should get his teeth fixed?"... or "She really needs a new haircut, a makeover and to lose 30 pounds."... or "Damn, that body hair is just awful..." but I guarantee the people in question are oblivious. Likewise, I'm sure we have our own things we should address, but have turned a blind eye to over the years.

 

Sure we care if we find someone attractive. But do we care if they are "above" or "below" our level? We might be conscious of what our opinion is, and who knows, our opinion might not be the same as others. When it comes down to it, if we like someone and are attracted to them, we don't care if we think others may not find them attractive. It's hard enough to find compatible couples without worrying if their looks would impress our other friends. If we ever think we're "settling" (and there have been a few times when other couples have made comments that we have done so with them) then we're just happy they think we're bringing to the table whatever it is they think we have. I think our self-esteem is strong enough that even if we are playing with a couple whom others might consider ugly, we're fine with our own opinion.

 

There have definitely been other times when we're happily surprised at the attractiveness of people who have been interested in us. We've definitely experienced that. In those cases the other couples have just seemed thrilled to have found what they consider to be a good overall match.

 

I used to be a lot more picky. I found that once I loosened up more about looks, and just looked for something I found appealing, that I had a lot more fun. Still picky, but just more open-minded about what's attractive.

[Gordo 618]

First of all an interesting face. Sparkly eyes and a personality. Give me those and the rest I don't much care about.

 

I've never really thought of it as trading up or down. There are some chicks that are so impossibly hot that I just say "forget it". But I suspect if I ever did try I'd find them lacking. Lots of time girls like that are trading on their looks in life and never develop a personality.

[MN Tom 251]

Yeah, I believe that what people think their "level" is and what others perceive their "level" is can make for a big variance.

 

All of us do it to some degree. I can say Im actively trying to not judge based on looks alone, but that only goes so far. Personality is a big key , but I will admit that if someone is not appealing at all in their profile pics I have no desire to try to meet them.

 

One of our goals is to "widen" the attractiveness level spread of our potential playmates. One of the ways we do that is by talking and meeting a lot of people at parties. That way the personality can shine through, and usually overwhelm those with semi lame profile photos. One guy my wife is developing interest in is a prime case. His profile photos are dorky as hell, but in person he looks pretty decent. She would have never set up a 1v1 meeting with him by profile alone, but now it's an idea.

 

Single play though is much easier to do that with, since we have many nights a week for a short single meeting.

[PB&J 1,086]

There was one newbie couple last year that I chatted with the male half a lot without actually meeting. The first time we chatted, he made a point of asking if we worked out a lot. I didn't lie, I said not so much, and he was willing to still chat... but as time went on and several attempts to set up a drinks date fell through, it seemed obvious that we weren't what they were looking for, especially when they joined another site where they could post more pictures, and it was quite obvious that they were VERY fit, and their ad stated explicitly that they were looking for the same. At the same time from their participation in threads it was obvious that they were moving into the ultra-attractive group within the region's swinger circles (GOD, it is SO like high school around here!) So I saved them the trouble of turning us down, and just sort of drifted away into cyberspace. So imagine my surprise when a little while ago in a forum thread on that site, he made what was quite a pointed comment about how we had never actually tried to meet them (the comment was made in such a way that I would realize whom he was referring to, but no one else would. He actually referred back to something I'd posted in a booty call six months previously!!) Even if they had continued to be interested in us after meeting, which I truly thought was unlikely, I think that I would have been uncomfortable with the difference in body type.

 

We are really happiest with people around the same level as us, and more importantly, with people who perceive themselves to be around the same level. It concerns me when people describe themselves as "very good looks" or "model material" (and usually, to be honest, they are not!) These are actual categories on the Toronto site we're on; we describe ourselves as "average" and let people make up their own minds.

[SW_PA_Couple 4,026]

. . . We are really happiest with people around the same level as us, and more importantly, with people who perceive themselves to be around the same level. . .

There are planned events here in our area called Friction Parties. They pre-screen their party-goes and do not try to hide the fact that they are doing so. I am mildly curious about what goes on at one of their gatherings but I suspect it is not much different than what happens at more-ordinary gatherings of swingers; people dance around each other literally and figuratively, some of them manage to find a liking for each other and extra fun ensues. It's the extra fun part that might interest me more. I can easily imagine that few actually reach orgasm as they are too distracted by having to watch themselves in a mirror to be sure that they are looking good while they are doing the deed.

 

Now I will risk adding a corollary to Chicup's theory. Are you willing to go up or down the cerebral scale? It would be my contention that nearly everybody considers their IQ to be average (in Lake Wobegone, all the women are strong, all the men are good looking, and all the children are above average). Yet I see many S L S profiles within which people characterize themselves as "intellectual", no punctuation is used, no sentence is complete and few words are spelled correctly. Can a person who reads Caesar's Commentaries on the Gallic Wars in the original Latin for his own entertainment sit and listen to a two-hour analysis about last-week's professional football game?

[sexyrose582 15]

As far as the cerebral scale, if I am looking for a one on one meeting with someone an intelligent conversation strongly outweighs looks. I'm not going to have dinner or drinks much less sex with someone whose profile looks like it was written by someone with a third grade education. That said, if I am at a party and the sex is almost anonymous then intelligent conversation really doesn't matter. Then it is about looks and chemistry and nothing else.

[MN Tom 251]

As far as the cerebral scale, if I am looking for a one on one meeting with someone an intelligent conversation strongly outweighs looks. I'm not going to have dinner or drinks much less sex with someone whose profile looks like it was written by someone with a third grade education. That said, if I am at a party and the sex is almost anonymous then intelligent conversation really doesn't matter. Then it is about looks and chemistry and nothing else.

 

 

Yes, if we are talking about the intellectual scale, there are also guidelines we stay around. We are pretty similar to this post, if the situation is a party, it won't matter as much. Planning a meet ahead of time using a profile match sets the bar higher though.

 

At this point we just delete mails from people who type one liners with bad spelling. Such as "hay hotie, wana meet up and see wht hapenz?"

Mix that with a profile that is laden with more of the same and it's a quick delete.

 

Back to the appearance issue, another thing that will make us pause is when someone (always the guy it seems) has a sort of refusal to show his pictures until the last possible second. This happened with a couple early on for us. I was chatting with the guy online every few days or so, conversation was decent, with our wives mixed into the chat a few times. He mentioned that he doesn't have any pictures online because of his job, said that some of his coworkers were also in and didn't get along with him, and he feared reprisals. Ok fine, but it still kind of bothered us, if that was truly the case, why does his wife have 150000 full face/body pics in various states of undress, and he doesn't even have a headless body shot?

So we keep talking, and kind of forget about the picture thing, and a few weeks later the babysitters line up and they want to get together. We ask for a picture at that time, and he sends one. Well, just as you would imagine, he wasn't appealing to my wife. Not even close. And it wasn't his face so much as his body.

 

So, then we feel kinda bad for saying no at the time.

As time has gone by though, that feeling has been replaced by better ones. We don't blame ourselves any more for it, because honestly it was like pulling teeth getting a picture out of him, and that felt like deception to us.

[exploringRM 305]

If people can hold a conversation then we are happy with them. We don't check IQs. We have been with people from all education backgrounds up to and including phds.

 

Perhaps more so that IQ we prefer people that are within our value system, class, culture..however you describe it. If you show up (white, black, latino, whatever) talking like a rap star we will not be attracted. If your life totally revolves around the local football team or nascar I doubt we will have much to talk about. But I guess this is a bit off the original topic.

[Chicup 42]

 

Now I will risk adding a corollary to Chicup's theory. Are you willing to go up or down the cerebral scale? It would be my contention that nearly everybody considers their IQ to be average (in Lake Wobegone, all the women are strong, all the men are good looking, and all the children are above average).

 

Oh great tangent.

 

I don't consider my IQ to be average because I know its well above as is the Mrs's. I LOVE smart women. I'm less concerned about education. I was chatting with a female swinger a few weeks back (who sadly lives far away), who impressed me more with a cerebral response than nudity could.

 

I think though that many swingers are in fact above average in the intelligence category. There seems to a large segment who come to swinging from an intellectual stand point. Despite my penchant for intelligent women, its been far less of an issue than finding someone physically attractive.

[sweet_tna 680]

Okay, I'll bite.

 

We won't even bother with anyone who isn't at least an 8 on the hotness scale (as rated by a panel of attractiveness experts) and has an IQ lower than 125.

[sexology300 15]

Okay, I'll bite.

 

We won't even bother with anyone who isn't at least an 8 on the hotness scale (as rated by a panel of attractiveness experts) and has an IQ lower than 125.

 

 

We started swinging in our late thirties and are now both 48. Our scale of what an 8 looks like has had to be recalibrated a few times.

 

We have found that chemistry trumps all else...it is either there or not.

[JustAskJulie 2,595]

I don't think we compare another couple's level of attractiveness to our own, but we do have to be attracted to another couple. We won't settle for people we aren't attracted to. I can't say that I recall us ever having a conversation, though, that contained anything where we related another couples attractiveness level to our own. Maybe we just don't think high enough of ourselves to do that.

[Chicup 42]

I don't think its really a conscious, 'oh they are a 5 and we are a 7, this will not do!' type of thing.

 

I think its almost an automatic response. I've never looked at a couple said said 'well I am attracted to her but shes not nearly as attractive as my wife so I'll pass'. What I have done is just not been attracted to her, and the women I am are in my wifes ballpark or better.

[sweet_tna 680]

We have found that chemistry trumps all else...it is either there or not.

 

Precisely how we feel. I just couldn't resist a bit of smartassery.

 

=)

[Toys4T 15]

I'm not in a couple officially, but would like to encourage a male friend to join me for couples activities. I think he has his type he likes, there are certain types I like. Probably looking more at types for us than a certain level of attractive.

 

Of course we would be limited to couples that are looking for BBW/BHM as their idea of attractive.

[AskMeOk 148]

If "attractiveness" is the package, we don't compromise. If "attractiveness" is merely physical appearance (not counting cleanliness, etc.) then it is very negotiable.

 

I think both of you "taking one for the team" is a rather novel idea, though!

[Powerglide 235]

I guess I'm a slow learner: it took me 'til my 30s to realize that there is absolutely no correlation between how closely someone fits conventional standards of beauty and how great they are in the sack. That woman you think is too plain or too obese or whatever may very well be the one to engage in the most astonishing, brain-melting sex you've ever had. But please feel free to ignore her -- more for me!

[mrfixit 15]

If "attractiveness" is the package, we don't compromise. If "attractiveness" is merely physical appearance (not counting cleanliness, etc.) then it is very negotiable.

 

I think both of you "taking one for the team" is a rather novel idea, though!

 

In all our years, we never thought of doing that for sure!

 

I guess that would be a couple you like and want to help get started, but really have no sexual interest. That sounds like a faculity/instructor position, and I guess some might say, a real friendly thing to do!

 

mrfixit