Professional career and ethics??

[alwayscurious34 32]

Has anyone ever ran into any issues with their career and patronizing a lifestyle club or event in regards to a ethical clause or anything like that.

 

Reason for asking the wife and I were discussing visiting a local swing bar which she seemed pretty open to just going and checking it out, but is concerned if something happened (I dont know what exactly) that she could get in trouble with her job (nurse).

 

I do know they are pretty strict with everything from the Ohio revised code Nurses:

 

(6) Conviction of, a plea of guilty to, a judicial finding of guilt of, a judicial finding of guilt resulting from a plea of no contest to, or a judicial finding of eligibility for intervention in lieu of conviction for, an act in another jurisdiction that would constitute a felony or a crime of moral turpitude in Ohio;

 

(7) Conviction of, a plea of guilty to, a judicial finding of guilt of, a judicial finding of guilt resulting from a plea of no contest to, or a judicial finding of eligibility for intervention in lieu of conviction for, an act in the course of practice in another jurisdiction that would constitute a misdemeanor in Ohio;

 

Its the Moral turpitude thing that they can hang you on if they want to, it pretty much covers everything.

 

Also just about everything is a misdemeanor from public indecency to selling drugs.

 

I dont think she is just making a excuse not to go.......so I guess my question has anyone ever had any issues with something like this?

 

Is it really illegal to patronize a club like this I see where clubs get busted or whatever but it never really says what happens to the patrons.

 

Any thoughts would be appreciated.

 

Thanks

[funcoupledayton 2,708]

You will need to make up your own decision, but here's what I've experienced in Ohio. There are many medical professionals and nurses at swing clubs and parties here. None of my friends worry about it too much. They blur their photos on swinging websites.

 

Before going to a club you may want to check to see how long they've been in business and whether they are licensed to operate in the manner they do; and what their policies are on drugs, alcohol use and prostitution.

 

Nurses (men and women) are hot and ready to party!

[alwayscurious34 32]

When you say "licensed to operate in the manner they do"....so it is legal to have a swing/lifestyle club in Ohio with the propper license???

 

What I have been looking for and not finding is would we be technically breaking a law by going to a club that is advertised as a swing or lifestyle club?

 

I dont want to mention any names but the club I am referring to seems legit. It is a bring your own alcohol type club listed in the links above among others.

 

Thanks for the response,that kinda what I was guessing, I could not believe no one at these establishments are the medical industry or any other field where a moral turpitude issue could be raised.

[noobwithboobs 22]

I can chime in a little bit here. I work for a local govt. agency (in Ohio) that licenses a place to sell food. In order to sell liquor in Ohio, you must also obtain a valid food license. You can not sell food for a set price unless you have a food license as well. Many of the clubs I've heard of are BYOB (I haven't been to a club yet) because of the nudity, you can't get a liquor license in a place people are fully naked. There is an exemption in Ohio food code for something called a "private club" which most of the clubs I know of fit into, so they do not need a food license either. I haven't been in the lifestyle long, or had much experience, but what I've had has been with a firefighter, a teacher, and an EMT, so I don't think people get too worked up over the issue.

[Chicup 42]

Nursing is one of the top swinger 'professions'.

 

Unless your wife has a specific morals clause don't sweat it.

[T-Rex 148]

We've met nurses, doctors, teachers, firemen. However, the number one public service occupation we have come across in the lifestyle is law enforcement. At one point it seemed like most couples we met had at least one spouse in LE, or retired from LE. Maybe all of the above folks should be worried about morals clauses (except if they are retired), but no one seems too concerned...well, except for the mid-western state politician we met about ten years ago...but that's a different story.

[alwayscurious34 32]

Okay cool, thats good to know.

Maybe we will get a shot at checking our local club after all.

 

Thanks.

[VegasLee 1,486]

I am not in Ohio but I can tell you we have enough nurses on any Saturday night to start our own hospital at the club!

 

Some of them are even Management in big hospitals. None of them seem to concerned about it.

[lotsoffun201 175]

I am a physician and know of many other physicians who frequent our clubs and partys. Not to mention, Lawyers, Judges, Nurses, Teachers, Law enforcement, Fire Department, Paramedics, Military, etc....

 

Just keep it on the down low and enjoy. I would suggest you be very discreet in your online profiles though.

[DigginIt 1,132]

So my wife wanted to chime in here. While we do not live in Ohio (god knows we have lived almost everywhere else) the moral statute exists in some form in almost every state.

 

Anything that is legal, operating within the limits of the law, they will have a very hard time trying to hang you on any kind of moral basis. That doesn't mean that they couldn't run you out of the organization through other pressures but I wouldn't worry about it.

 

We personally know a medical director, an anesthesiologist, several nurses, couple school teachers, lots of military (they have it really hard), lots of DOD employees, fire fighters and police officers to name a few. I'm sure there are a lot more in higher offices that we don't know but the point is everyone has skin (pun intended) in the game and wants to maintain their privacy.

[Coupleerotic22 1,419]

Another "not in Ohio" reply, but I have worked there a good bit and have seen plenty of things that would fall under that clause.

 

First, we too have met many Nurses, a few Docs, lawyers, teachers and even a judge or two.

 

Second, from a moral turpitude basis there is the law and then there is your employer.

**I am not a lawyer and this is NOT legal advice, just a layman's opinion**

 

From a legal standpoint I doubt anyone would come after you for swinging based on two reasons. Homosexuality as moral turpitude has basically been shot down by the court system, so from a legal standpoint I don't think there would be much difference. And when it has been used it is usually in conjunction with other crimes, like running an illegal swing club, prostitution, indecent exposure etc.

 

As for employers, they can use it, particularly as a pressure tactic. If they decide, for any reason including those unrelated to swinging, they want to get rid of your wife, then they could drop this down on her and tell her she has the option to resign and if she does not they would use the moral turpitude clause. In my opinion they would be on shaky ground, particularly if they are a religious based hospital. If they are a religious based organization then they would likely also have to deal with things like adultery under the same clause. And adultery is often made public record in court filings, so it would be a can of worms for them.

 

If they tried that then you could fight them and likely win. But they would be banking on the fact that you would give in and resign in order to keep it private.

 

The bottom line is if you think they are looking for reasons to get rid of people in general, or your wife specifically, then take extra caution. But, if Ohio is like the rest of the country there is a shortage of nurses so they are likely trying to hold on the ones they have.

 

In total I would not be overly concerned about it. IN a large hospital there are likely to be dozens even hundreds of swingers. And as long as you are discrete then it is highly unlikely your employer would ever find out and less likely they would do something about it.

[Alura 2,775]

If you're seriously concerned about losing your job, I'd suggest not putting yourself into a position that might result in it. Either don't swing or restrict your play to private times with another couple in your home or theirs, where you aren't likely to have the cops break down your door.

 

Alura

[alwayscurious34 32]

My wife is in good standing at her current place of employment. She is just a very causious person when it comes to things effecting her career, and I dont blame her.

 

I think it was just something a little different and had never come up before with anyone she had known or ever heard of. (which makes the posts above make all the more sense)

 

After reading the posts it reassures what I thought and I dont think she will have a problem going to check it out now.

 

Thanks again.

[two4youinswva 3,068]

Every year my employer has us review the company code of ethics and sign off our understanding. Every year I go over it line by line to make sure there's nothing that would cause me an issue. Thankfully they don't include a catchall phrase within the statements, so we're good to go.

 

I think for most folks, if you keep your nose clean at work, give an honest day's effort, and leave your personal life outside the company door, you're going to be OK. That being said, it's better to take a little time and so some research, if only to make you feel a little better about what your actual risk exposure is.

[sweetandspicy 15]

I'm from NY and they do not allow nudity and sex in clubs. The only one I knew of no longer exists. But any club I go to is always far from home, at least far enough where I won't run into anyone I know, I hope, as I work in a very public place.

As far as religion goes, somewhere in the new testament a woman asked Jesus if it was ok to have sex not in the missionary position and Jesus replied that whatever was good for both spouses was Ok with him. A little paraphrasing but you get the message. So, as far as I am concerned, If both spouses are present and willing, there is no adultary, no moral turpitude.

Just my opinion

[JustAskJulie 2,595]

When you say "licensed to operate in the manner they do"....so it is legal to have a swing/lifestyle club in Ohio with the propper license???

 

What I have been looking for and not finding is would we be technically breaking a law by going to a club that is advertised as a swing or lifestyle club?

 

I dont want to mention any names but the club I am referring to seems legit. It is a bring your own alcohol type club listed in the links above among others.

 

Thanks for the response,that kinda what I was guessing, I could not believe no one at these establishments are the medical industry or any other field where a moral turpitude issue could be raised.

 

That's where the licensed and legally operating part comes into play. Most anytime you see a story about a club or party getting busted it's because they failed to get the right licensing permits (basic business license 101). Typically a swinger club can operate as a private club (which means they will need you to sign a membership agreement at the door, they will give you a membership card, and charge you a membership fee - as well as party/door fees). They will need to have a copy of your DL (or at least your DL#) on file. And they need to have proper business licenses to operate as the type of business they are operating (private club). Too often clubs don't even bother to get a basic business license let alone operate under the basics of private membership club rules. If they don't operate as a strict private membership club (as per state requirements) anyone can walk in at any time. A cop can come in and no one can stop them.

 

That said, unfortunately, you can ask all day long and they can tell you anything they want regarding whether or not they are operating legally. However, in Ohio there are a number of very well-known reputable swinger clubs that have been around for years if not decades. I'd say stick to those and you should be ok. Avoid fly-by-night operations or clubs that just appeared last week because someone got pissed off at some other local club and decided they could do it better, and you should be ok. Ohio is like the Swinger Capitol of the US.

[alwayscurious34 32]

Thanks for the replies. I showed my wife this thread and we discussed it some more about my intentions and why I wanted to go and she is now totally up for it.

It didnt take much convincing at all really I think she was honestly just worried about doing something illegal.

 

So anyway we are just waiting for a good weekend to go and check it out. I was trying to wait for a weekend where there is no specific event or party as I dont want to be misleading to any of the other guests. Not sure if there is such a night but I read on their website calender that they do have occasional casual nights so that may be a good time to go and check it out.

 

On a side note I also just wanted to say that finding this site and everyones responses to questions has helped our relationship tremendiously.....I should say helped me tremendiously. Not that we were by any means in a bad spot or anything but it made me understand the importance of better and open communication, and so many awesome things have developed in just the last few months because of it.

So again just wanting to say thanks and I am sure as things develop I will be back for more questions.

[funcoupledayton 2,708]

At the club we attend, theme or party nights have much better attendance and are a lot more fun. You don't have to worry about leading anyone on by going on a particular night (unless it's "everyone must swing night", just kidding, I don't think there is any such thing.) Just tell them early in the conversation that you don't swing.

 

Our club's casual Friday nights are not very well attended and there are a lot of single guys. Maybe your club is different, but that's how it is here.

 

To get the real experience I'd recommend you go on a theme night. Depending on the theme about 50-75% of ladies dress for the theme, the men usually just dress nicely. So you don't have to participate in the theme if you don't want to. It is more fun though, I think.

[two4youinswva 3,068]

So you don't have to participate in the theme if you don't want to. It is more fun though, I think.

 

The thing about dressing to the theme is you give someone that may not be good at starting a conversation an easy opening to approach you and start a conversation. As in "Oh, love your outfit! Did you make it?"

 

And no, just because you dress to the theme doesn't mean you're expected to play.

[junglecouple 128]

a common question with newcomers was: I'm afraid we'll see someone we know from work..I used to joke with them.. Well if it's a superior, and they see you.. you also SAW THEM.. sounds like time for a raise and/or a vacation... if it's a subordinate...sounds like time for a raise and/or a vacation.. how would they say something without exposing how they know.

It takes a bit of training, experience and skill to keep work at work and fun away from that venue.

about 30 years ago, I had a boss that, after finding out I was a very valuable employee, took me out for drinks (we're both male) after work and we got shitfaced. I was stunned he was that open with me.. The next morning, at the sales meeting, I saw him in the hall and said.... "good morning Jack".. He turned and glowered at me, then said.. "never, ever, make the mistake of bringing out off time friendship to work, I AM YOUR BOSS!! I am MR. POTTER". We worked together for years before he had a fatal traffic accident.. Miss that man. I learned a lot from him.

I never forgot that lesson.

[funcoupledayton 2,708]

One of my husband's employees and his wife goes to the same club as us. It works out fine for all of us. We are friendly, laugh and hang out, but don't play with them. We're confident that we're all adults and can trust each other to be discreet. It does make my husband nervous at times because he is the boss, but he is not in charge of the whole company, so theoretically it could become a bad situation.

 

Another friend's boss also attends the same club as all of us. My friend is very nervous about it, and tries to avoid the boss at all costs, but so far it hasn't been a problem.

 

I think it's worse for the superior than the employee. It would be really awful if someone did try to blackmail a superior to get a raise.

 

So there are two situations of work and pleasure mixing at the same, relatively small club!

[alwayscurious34 32]

The wife did say it would be weird if she saw somene she knew there as it is local to where she grew up. But that was not as much a issue as the legality apsect of it.

I dont think there will be any issue with us going now.....except for finding a good weekend to go. Thanks for the pointers Fun and Two4 I guess I never thought about it that way.....why go on a lame night. It probably would be more fun and exciting if it was a event night with better attendance. Guess I was just being a little shy....imagine that! LOL!!

[celtic239 297]

There are two similar but somewhat different issues that Alwayscurious raised concerning employment. In the case of a registered nurse there are licensing rules that if broken could lead to suspension or forfiture. The prohibition concerning "crimes involving moral turpitude" are basically acts that are criminal. As Julie correctly pointed out going to an established club, in and of itself, is not illegal.

However there are many jobs that have a "moral clause" as part of the employment contract. The best example of this would be a position of employment associated with a religious or community organization. A person working for a Jewish organization speaking at a rally in support of the KKK or a head nurse (no pun intended) at a Catholic hospital going to a swingers club could be in violation of their employment contracts even though these activities are not illegal and Constutionally protected.

[JB 140]

Understand, you cannot be convicted of something called Moral Turpitude. You can only be convicted of a crime. Moral Turpitude is a label that is applied to a crime. You must commit and be found guilty of the crime before any question of Moral Turpitude can be applied.

 

For example, you are a famous artist, and I paint a painting and sign your name to it, and then hang it on the wall. Am I guilty of forgery?

 

No. Forgery is a “label” that can only be applied when a crime is committed, in this case, if I tried to sell the painting and let the buyer believe that you painted it. Then in attempting to defraud the buyer, I would be guilty of theft, and thereby guilty of forgery.

 

What if I told him that I painted it and signed your name to it, and he bought it anyhow. Forgery? Nope. Not even a criminal offense.

 

You have to commit a crime first before Moral Turpitude can come into play.

 

The Moral (sorry couldn’t help it) of the story is; don’t commit any crimes…