Guy #2 for our novice MFM went badly - opinions on where to go from here?

[transplantsxm 15]

So we had one guy that joined us for one afternoon, but although he said he was available a lot, we found out his commitments to his wife (unknown to us) prevented him getting together much. The one encounter with him went well, but we were looking for a FWB that could be fairly frequent.

 

So the next weekend we went with guy #2. Chatted online and ended up meeting him at a bar, all was fine so we took him back to our house and he did a great job of pleasing the wife, was nice, kind of the very quiet type though which made things a little different, not bad, but different. Just saying the conversation didn’t flow like with the first guy that was a salesman by trade.

We invited the guy back the next Friday and basically said he could be with us as much as he wanted through Monday. Friday afternoon went great with him having sex with the wife on and off the whole afternoon and evening till midnight and me in between and he gave her a couple of orgasms (which is the whole idea). We invited him to stay the night in our guest room, which he did, and the next morning right after I got up he went into our bed and gave the wife a great morning round of hard sex. He left mid-morning and we set up to have dinner at a really nice steakhouse together that evening (trying to get the “Friends” part going as well as the “Benefits” part.)

 

We met for dinner and things got a little weird for me the hubby right away. Although we had explained that when we are out together, she is my wife a he is just a vanilla friend, the inappropriate conversation at dinner was opposite of that including him making a couple of references to him fucking her better than me (I thought wrong discussion at the wrong time in a very nice crowded restaurant). Later at a bar he was all over her and made me feel real uncomfortable.

He came out and fucked until about 4:00 am and spent the night again, overall fine with me except he barely talked to me at all and made it feel uncomfortable for me to join in. He left the next day mid-day (more fucking of course) and we were to email each other on plans for the following day. I had told the wife about some of my concerns and she was fine with me voicing them to him. I wrote a nice email, but did bring up in a really nice way about how he was supposed to be acting when we are out in public places together and some light rules on continuing down the FWB road and more inclusion of me. I got back this email basically telling me a barrage of stuff from him in a very pompous way including statements that included:

 

I'm good at sex and gave her an orgasm. As long as I gave her an orgasm (and allowed Oxytocin to be released) she was going to be attached to me. So surely she is going to continue to fuck me.

I understand your point but, with deference, I disagree. Its over. She is mine now. Going forward she's going to want to be fucked like I fucked her.

Your best bet would be for [wife] and I to continue to have sex. I am going to want a personal relationship with [wife]. It is going to happen.

I will take her out at times and we'll have fun and fuck. You won't be with us at all times. That's the nature of the beast.

Let's face it, you can no longer give her an orgasm at a whims notice.

We can't all have what we want. Let her be happy.

 

So after sharing the email with my wife that contained all this stuff, I was sure she would be offended if nothing else on my behalf for him acting so pompous. Instead she was defensive of him which, of course, really made me weird and upset. We didn’t meet him again, but I got the constant feeling that things were strained between my wife and I because of it and that she wanted to. As the two weeks that followed went on, we had some discussions about it and she basically says what he thinks or says doesn’t matter, she just likes the sex. So we have a disconnect for sure.

 

We talked some about trying to find a true FWB instead of some guy that excludes me and would say such things bluntly back claiming his territory, but she says she has spread for two guys so far and is not going to keep fucking guys to find one that is right in all ways.

 

Generally I found it very exciting and no jealous issues about the sex at all. The problem started when the guy developed an attitude and started claiming rights. Any advice on how to go from here? Do we approach this some different way or just give up on it?

[slevin 1,374]

If either you or your wife are uncomfortable with anything then both you and your wife should immediately cut off whatever is making you uncomfortable. His actions were unacceptable and his email was shockingly unacceptable. The fact that your wife didn't immediately agree to stop seeing him is concerning. Also, the fact that she didn't shut down conversation about the other guy fucking her better than you is concerning to me.

 

You need to cut things off with this guy. Never see him again, never fuck him again. Find a respectful guy who understands that respects your relationship and doesn't cross the line.

[Lionheart72 2,190]

Sounds to me like he's trying to live the cuckold fantasy... the one where the big studly guy bangs the wife while the wimp looks on mournfully. Unfortunately, he may be thinking he can act that out for real and your wife is going along with it. You can't do anything about him being an asshole, except not contact him again. Your wife, however, is a much more serious problem. She obviously isn't taking your feelings and thoughts into account.

 

IMO, you and she need to stop, at once. Not only should you two not see this guy again (and make sure she understands that if she sees him without your approval, that will be cheating and you will respond accordingly)... you two shouldn't see any other guy, at all, until you are on the same page.

[Alura 2,774]

Here's my opinion, and if it seems like a rant, I apologize in advance. This guy is a worst case example of what happens all too often in the lifestyle when a single is involved. My late wife was of the opinion that it is impossible for a single to fully understand swinging because he or she is not risking any thing near as emotional as a man or a wife who is risking the most important thing in their life: their marriage. I think she was right. Your FWB offers neither friendship nor benefits, only drama and hard feelings. Since I've been on this board, about ten years now, we've seen situations like this time and again. Such situations rarely have a positive ending.

 

That you were not jealous throughout the ordeal tells me that your attitude is correct for the lifestyle. That your wife failed to see the gravity of the situation tells me that y'all have a lot of work to do in order to enjoy the lifestyle without damaging your marriage. I think y'all can work it out together but it will take a lot of talking with a lot of caring.

 

If y'all must deal with a single man, find somebody who understands what y'all are putting on the line. That will probably be a widowed or divorced man who has experience swinging as a couple. Of course, that further limits your possibilities. Many widowers, like myself, have no interest in pursuing swinging without the one person who made it worthwhile in the first place.

 

We did our threesomes with our regular playcouple who were (both) already friends with benefits. Sometimes one of the four was out of town; sometimes one simply watched or joined in later. I'd strongly suggest y'all consider that answer.

 

I understand your wife's reluctance to continue to try to find the right person(s), but it is true, as a lovely member of this board once remarked, "One has to kiss a lot of frogs in order to find a prince." ...especially if you look in a pool of people which is overpopulated with frogs.

 

Alura

[angelkin 1,326]

Wow, what a rude response from someone you are so kindly sharing your wife with! Sounds like this guy is one of the single guys that give the rest of them a bad rap. I completely agree with what everyone else has said, you must not see him again and there should be absolutely no communication with him of any kind. I am sorry that your wife isn't seeing your point of view - it's clear that you and she are not on the same page. Swinging seems to be putting your relationship in peril, sounds like you are telling her openly how you feel and she is not hearing your true feelings - or at least not considering them. Communication is a two way street and part of that is hearing and understanding your partner and honoring their wishes above all else. She needs to truly understand how you feel and act accordingly, you're in this together and if there is a difference of opinion, that should be resolved before there is any more swinging.

 

If you were to look for a new guy to add as a third, maybe the boundaries need to be clearer before you get started. Rules like no one-on-one dinners or encounters, that you would be participating all the time, and at least initially limit the time spent together. Spending an entire weekend fucking a new guy seems excessive IMHO...slowing things down and assessing the next steps (if any) and renegotiating boundaries based on how things are going with any particular guy might be in order before just giving full access to your wife and your home right away.

[SW_PA_Couple 4,024]

Sounds like this guy is one of the single guys that give the rest of them a bad rap. .

That's what he is. Time to find a decent guy. They're out there. Can't say finding them is easy. But they do exist.

[bbarnsworth 2,644]

I strongly agree with what everyone else is saying about dumping this guy. There's absolutely no accepting his behavior. I don't care how good the sex is for your wife. It isn't worth it. Don't write him any further, don't respond to him, just drop him. Any further contact from either you or your wife to him will just make things worse. No goodbye fucks, no goodbye dinners, no goodbye e-mails, no goodbye texts. Run away. Fast.

 

I want to add on a few things here to the other great advice you've received above.

 

I think it a very bad idea to be inviting new playmates to your home right off. My wife and I would never do this. There are simply too many crazies in the world. After a few play times when you really start to have a feel for the person or couple, then maybe...but right off? Bad, bad, bad. In this case, you've got a real prick who most likely isn't going to be happy at being dropped and...he knows where you live. That's just bad all around.

 

Others have commented on you and your wife not being on the same page and what to do going forward. I echo that 1000% My wife and I are always on the same page, and that makes it all possible.

 

You said your wife said what this other guy thinks or says doesn't matter, that it's the sex she likes. This is wrong, absolutely wrong. If a person threatened to pepper spray you the next time you got close to them, would you go stand close to them because you liked being near them? Of course not. This male has acted highly inappropriately and has been exceedingly disrespectful of you and your wishes. Certainly to your wife he hasn't done anything that raises a red flag with regards to his behavior towards her, but his behavior towards you should most emphatically be equally important to her if not more so.

 

You also mentioned that your wife does not want to keep fucking guys to find the one that is right in all ways. I can understand that. But, it's not in any sense an excuse to settle for a prick. My wife and I have been trying for years to find a long term play partner for her. There have been some that have been very good, but none have worked out to be long term yet. There's been a lot more men than two. But, none of the experiences have ever been bad like this, nor even close. All of them have been at least good. My advice here is that if...if...you get back into trying to find a FWB, be highly selective. She doesn't have to bed every guy that comes along. There are couples on this board who have made it work, and made it work with some guys for years.

[Chicup 41]

I think I know how this story ends.

[transplantsxm 15]

Thanks for all the replies . . . . I think majority rules or actually it seems unanimous. We are now at our second home a couple thousand miles away from the dude, but things are still different. Right before we left up there, the wife said she at least still wanted to stay in touch and be friends, not okay with me. I love my wife so much and don't want to stop the quest, but want nothing to do with this guy. Her mind is probably in a different place on this. I understand a little, but think him being a douche bag should far exceed anything else. After all, our marriage should come first before anyone or anything. If something makes either of us unhappy, it is time to stop. Agree?

[slevin 1,374]

Agreed. Be very clear with your wife that this guy really bothers you and that you want both of you to cut off all communication with him and move on. If she says anything other than "Ok", you are probably going to have a big problem in the near future, as Chicup envisions.

[Alura 2,774]

Thanks for all the replies . . . . I think majority rules or actually it seems unanimous. We are now at our second home a couple thousand miles away from the dude, but things are still different. Right before we left up there, the wife said she at least still wanted to stay in touch and be friends, not okay with me. I love my wife so much and don't want to stop the quest, but want nothing to do with this guy. Her mind is probably in a different place on this. I understand a little, but think him being a douche bag should far exceed anything else. After all, our marriage should come first before anyone or anything. If something makes either of us unhappy, it is time to stop. Agree?

 

Absolutely! It's easy for the members of this board to display unanimity in such a clear cut case. These people have lots of experience and "know whereof they speak." There is no question this guy is a threat to your relationship with your wife. Since he has gone this far this early, I shudder to think what the future bodes. Will he next say that you and your wife can't make love because "she is now his"?

 

His egotism, by itself, would disqualify him from ever being a friend of mine, even if no sex were involved. Does he know where y'all are?

 

If her mind is in a different place, it is the wrong place; she needs to get it in the right place. Have you shown her this thread and made sure she's read it completely? I wonder if perhaps she doesn't see the gravity of the situation... How is that possible?

 

Caution: There is no limit to how far this situation could go. There is a potential for a protective order in your future. Keep in mind always that it would be better to be divorced than in prison or, conversely, dead. Solve this problem with the utmost caution and don't hesitate to call the police if they are needed.

 

Alura

[LFM2 1,482]

I know you haven't heard this enough today, but I echo everyone elses thoughts. Run far and fast from this man.

[tribbles 490]

Either fuck her senseless yourself or find someone else-and do NOT leave them alone. Even if he is in her, make it your face kissing her or whispering in her ear.

 

Your wife may be one of those who really 'bond' with the release of hormones and recreational sex is not safe for her.

[Alura 2,774]

Sounds to me like he's trying to live the cuckold fantasy... the one where the big studly guy bangs the wife while the wimp looks on mournfully. Unfortunately, he may be thinking he can act that out for real and your wife is going along with it.

 

I've been thinking about this part of your post, Lionheart... and have been wondering...

 

Is it possible that the wife is the one with the cuckold fantasy? Could she have coached this guy, when the O.P. wasn't involved, to act the way he did?

 

Alura

[TwoSexyMI 151]

I was wondering if wife knew this guy first or "found" him.

To me, the fact that she wants to remain friends with someone who would disrespect her husband like that is alarming. Her reaction to his email was, also. How much of a friendship could really have developed in two nights and a dinner that she is not willing to cut ties?

 

I hope you told her dispite her wanting to keep a friendship, the answer is a hard no.

 

Best of luck to you.

 

Mrs.

[Desdemona1980 297]

It's definitely a red flag that your wife doesn't think it's a big deal that this guy has disrespected you so boldly. I would back away from swinging until you know she understands and RESPECTS why it bothers you.

 

As a single female, I try to be very aware of the relationship of the couples when I am invited to play with them. Nothing that happens in a night of fucking is worth any stress on their relationship. It's also why I don't form friendships with the people I play with. If I become friends with couples at the club, then they are off-limits for playing.

 

I know what the lifestyle is about, but I also know that we are all human, so it's not a boundary I'm willing to cross for myself.

[cplnuswing 4,713]

To me, the fact that she wants to remain friends with someone who would disrespect her husband like that is alarming.

 

This is the part that bothers me the most too. I would have serious problems with this were I in your shoes.

 

We swing together, and by that I don't mean same room sex. We are in it together for US, and we have each others back. Someone mistreats or disrespects her, and I'm going to go off on their ass, and I have absolutely zero doubt she would do the same for me. Mistreat us as a couple, and we BOTH are going to go off. If we are in a situation she decides she wants out of, then no matter how swimmingly it's going for me, we're done, no hesitation. That has happened, and I didn't hesitate, didn't question it, didn't try to change it. One of us was uncomfortable, so end of story. If you are going to swing as a couple, it just can't be any other way or you are headed for disaster.

 

I think you need to put the brakes on everything until you get this worked out between yourselves. Also, as others have said, this can end in a lot of ways, many of them not good at all. You need to put together a smart exit plan, implement it immediately, and use this experience to not get yourself in this situation again.

[ZAY 67]

Have you asked your wife what kind of things she might have said to him to give him the confindence to disrespect her husband so thoroughly? Obviously without fear of alienating her. Given the fact that her instinct after reading his response to you was to defend him, his boldness seems to have been warranted. The question is how much of a part did she play in this.

[mauijanedoe 1,414]

So after sharing the email with my wife that contained all this stuff, I was sure she would be offended if nothing else on my behalf for him acting so pompous. Instead she was defensive of him which, of course, really made me weird and upset. We didn’t meet him again, but I got the constant feeling that things were strained between my wife and I because of it and that she wanted to. As the two weeks that followed went on, we had some discussions about it and she basically says what he thinks or says doesn’t matter, she just likes the sex. So we have a disconnect for sure.

 

We talked some about trying to find a true FWB instead of some guy that excludes me and would say such things bluntly back claiming his territory, but she says she has spread for two guys so far and is not going to keep fucking guys to find one that is right in all ways.

 

I think it's highly unlikely that anyone here would deviate too far from what everyone else has said: The problem isn't the guy. There are, after all, more than a few pompous swinging dicks in the world and it's not really a surprise that you met one. So that merits nothing but a shrug.

 

I've highlighted something I've wondered about since I saw your first post. Is that a quote or your paraphrase of something a lot less blunt? If it's a quote or even a fairly accurate retelling, I would wonder if the issue of MFMs is one that you introduced and pressed for, because it sounds resentful and angry.

 

In any case, it most certainly does matter what the guy thinks or says. Would she like it if you were having sex with a woman who pointed out that your wife could stand to lose a few pounds and, oh by the way, the two of you would be seeing each other on the side, because she was clearly a much better partner than your wife?

[WesternSwing 504]

You can move away from this guy, that is simple. This guy isn't the problem here, your wife is. Her disregard for you and your marriage and more concern for this other guy's feelings is a BIG RED FLAG. What she wants is more important to her than your relationship. She is either letting NRE, New Relationship Energy, get in the way of rational thinking, she is emotionally incapable of handling a non-monogamous relationship, or she has already left this marriage and she is just looking for a catalyst such as this guy to make the change.

 

This is why veto power almost never ends well. The person who got the veto used on them feels like they have not been treated like an adult, but rather a child that needs to be told what is right and what is wrong. Vetoing a partner's other partner is like telling them that they are naive and only you know what's best for them. You are taking away their shiny new toy. Veto is protecting yourself under the guise of protecting your partner or your relatioship. You have to realize that your partner, your wife, is a fully self-aware adult that can make decisions for herself. You making decisions for her just pisses her off (as you found-out when she became defensive).

 

I have seen use of veto power cause irreparable damage in relationships, even when it was used in situations where the outside person really was a bad person and was looking to cause harm the primary relationship.

 

Veto = resentment, plain and simple.

 

You can veto this guy, or any other, but it will not work. It will just drive a wedge further in between you two. You can't make her "come around". Only she can arrive at that point by herself. And she may not.

 

The best you can do in non-monogamous relationships is hope that your partner is emotionally mature enough to handle multiple sexual and/or romantic relationships. The fact is that opening-up your relationship CHANGES EVERYTHING, and sometimes those changes weren't what you wanted or expected.

[slevin 1,374]

I'm not really clear on what you're saying WesternSwing. Are you saying that even though the guy has disrespected him, been condescending, and displayed no regard for the couples marriage that he shouldn't try to veto them being with this guy?

 

The potential for a 'veto' to cause hurt feelings is definitely out there. This all comes back around to whether a couple is in this together, as a couple, or whether they were in this for personal gain. If you're in this as a couple, how could you ever want to move forward with someone your partner is uncomfortable with?

[Desdemona1980 297]

I've highlighted something I've wondered about since I saw your first post. Is that a quote or your paraphrase of something a lot less blunt? If it's a quote or even a fairly accurate retelling, I would wonder if the issue of MFMs is one that you introduced and pressed for, because it sounds resentful and angry.

 

Interesting. When I read that quote, I read it more as her having a tantrum and trying to force her way as far as continuing a relationship with the other man. I agree it sounds resentful and angry, but I wonder if the resentment and anger comes from her not getting her toy?

[ZAY 67]

I'm assuming the wife in this equation agreed to a veto system and did it as a "fully self-aware adult that can make decisions" Her resentment of the veto says more about her selfishness and immaturity than it does her husband's. Bottom line: She does not sound like someone who can have extra marital relations without bonding with the other person and destroying the marriage. Thats okay, most people can't. "Veto is protecting yourself under the guise of protecting your partner or your relationship" By the way Western Swing, are you saying that Veto power in a relationship is inherently selfish? What would you call being resentful of that veto? What remedy then when you see your partner doing something harmful to you? Divorce i guess.

[Alura 2,774]

I think veto power does work; at least it always worked for us the few times it arose. Mrs. Alura used it once when I was to be at a trade show when an old flame was there. I never questioned her decision. When I came face-to-face with the lady, I acted as if we'd never met. I used it once because of a certain act, which was immediately declared out of bounds. Mrs. Alura promised to never let it happen again and it didn't. Another time was about no longer playing with a certain couple but I'd have to say we talked about the situation and both cast the veto, so there wasn't a problem.

 

Divorce is a simple answer (and may be the only one in this case) but it's easy to suggest when one isn't deeply in love with the one who is potentially being divorced.

 

The O.P. has not responded for a couple of days. I hope that doesn't mean that things have deteriorated. I'd like very much to hear from both the Mr. and the Mrs.

 

Alura

[BeStylnIT 114]

Generally I found it very exciting and no jealous issues about the sex at all. The problem started when the guy developed an attitude and started claiming rights. Any advice on how to go from here? Do we approach this some different way or just give up on it?

Wow, I'm very sorry to read that you went through this. You Didn't deserve it for reasons in and outside of swinging. There were redflags along the way but I'm sure you now know how to spot them.

Single men have a lot of hurdles to jump to become involved with a couple. It really sucks when a jack ass like this guy comes along and makes it more difficult for the rest of us. Ugh!!! I hate people with no class and that's what this comes down to...knowing how to treat others and having respect! This guy also had other issues going on too.

[DigginIt 1,132]

Your wife may be one of those who really 'bond' with the release of hormones and recreational sex is not safe for her.

 

Ding, ding, ding! I think we have a winner.

 

I think everyone gave fantastic advice but I feel this is at the heart of the issue and if so, you are in for some rocky times my friend. I wish you the best but so many things you said really scare the shit out of me.

 

Is your wife texting this guy? Is he privy to some inside knowledge that you may not know? The fact that she wasn't offended for you when he made those comments...echoing Chicup...I think I know how this story ends.

[transplantsxm 15]

So as the Original Poster . . . . thanks so much for all your comments!! I still love my wife and she is my best buddy. I don't want our relationship to end, but this has introduced a lot of questions. I also don't want our entrance into the lifestyle to end, but I don't know if she and I are on the same page in that regard as far as the boundaries when it comes to extra cock. IMOA, she approached it like dating, not an extra cock, the guy fell for her (understandable, she is exotic and I did too), but hell, we have years together and our relationship should COME FIRST!! It didn't and guess that tells something, I don't know what yet, but something. She is trying hard now but my feelings are really hurting. I thought we were ONE, and when it separated to her versus me for him it sucked.

 

My hopes are that we can get this together and she can separate our life together versus an extra stud and make this work in the future. I want her to have the extra stud, but NEVER to defend him or his feelings above mine . . . . . . . . she likes a lot of sex, and hey, that is fine, like I said in my original post, not jealous of the pussy, but am totally of our relationship.

 

More comments are welcome and again, thanks so much, this has helped me "process" all this anonymously . . . . . . this board is great!

[Lionheart72 2,190]

Let me just say that I think your feelings are entirely correct and appropriate. Your relationship should absolutely come first. She should not defend him or his feelings above yours. It is right, in a swinging relationship, for you to feel "not jealous of the pussy" but total jealous of the relationship. In short, from what you have told us, I have to say: you are right.

[ZAY 67]

I think you know what it tells you. She simply is not the right partner to have for this lifelstyle. You gave it a shot and it didn't work out, It happens. Be monogamous for a while and work on strengthening your bond to eachother. But face the fact that if you attempt this again you'd be putting your marriage at a greater risk than most couples on this forum. I am rooting for a happy ending to this. Good luck to the both of you and please keep posting.

[transplantsxm 15]

Thanks again to everyone. I know what you are saying Zay, but she is also a hot woman that needs more sex, she tells me constantly. I am 11 years older, a lot of stress from businesses, having two homes to keep up (one in the US and one in the Caribbean) so I thought this was the time to make this better for her and keep her happy. Guess I was wrong or at least this was the totally wrong guy. The thing is, the sex between her and another is no probem for me at all, I just don't want attachment. I have a lot to get in order too personally! I am overweight (not horribly, but some (a fair amount since meeting her) for sure) and stressed out from meeting our $20K plus a month in expenses. I so appreciate a "rooting for a happy ending to this" and actually I think that possible cause I think she is still a GREAT woman, even though things are strained between us now and I feel weird around her in many ways. I so appreciate all your comments, they are from the heart and it is wonderful!!

[slevin 1,374]

If things aren't good between you and she's not happy with your sex life, adding other people probably isn't going to make it better. It's going to land you exactly where you are right now; worse.

[WesternSwing 504]

I'm not really clear on what you're saying WesternSwing. Are you saying that even though the guy has disrespected him, been condescending, and displayed no regard for the couples marriage that he shouldn't try to veto them being with this guy?

 

No, the husband can try to veto the other guy, but that doesn't mean it's going to work or not create resentment in his wife. She's being told she can't do what she wants. This situation with the wife goes beyond sex. She is giddy with NRE, she is emotionally involved with the man. From what she said about "already spread her legs for two men" I would believe she is the type of person who has a difficult time separating love from sex. Thus they are were they are at now. Does she love this guy? No. Is she infatuated? Hell yeah. And she feels that her husband is being the bad guy and taking away her shiny new toy.

 

When both husband and wife are on the same page and feel the same way about love and sex, and can separate the two (like the Alura's could), vetoing your partner's new partner doesn't sting as much because NRE isn't clouding one person's judgement of the bad-acting third. I don't think @transplansxm's wife see's this. She's wearing lust goggles and this guy is awesome, even though to everyone else he's a complete jerk.

 

It's a tricky rope to walk, balancing between hurting her feelings (even though she's acting irrational and emotionally immature) and keeping his relationship in tact. I've been there. I know.

[Chicup 41]

When your choice is veto or hope she gets over the NRE while hes being a total cock to you, I think veto still the best option.

 

Honestly there is so much wrong in this on many levels I don't think standard advice applies, or will be heeded anyways. As I said I think I know how this story ends.

[WesternSwing 504]

Thanks again to everyone. I know what you are saying Zay, but she is also a hot woman that needs more sex, she tells me constantly. I am 11 years older, a lot of stress from businesses, having two homes to keep up (one in the US and one in the Caribbean) so I thought this was the time to make this better for her and keep her happy. Guess I was wrong or at least this was the totally wrong guy. The thing is, the sex between her and another is no probem for me at all, I just don't want attachment. I have a lot to get in order too personally! I am overweight (not horribly, but some (a fair amount since meeting her) for sure) and stressed out from meeting our $20K plus a month in expenses. I so appreciate a "rooting for a happy ending to this" and actually I think that possible cause I think she is still a GREAT woman, even though things are strained between us now and I feel weird around her in many ways. I so appreciate all your comments, they are from the heart and it is wonderful!!

 

Now you are being her apologist. You are making excuses for her and justifying her bad behavior. Hey, it's okay, everyone who's been kicked in the teeth by a spouse does it. But stop it. It won't solve the problem at hand.

[funcoupledayton 2,708]

I would suggest counseling and sex therapy for the two of you. Another cock is not going to fix the sexual issues in your marriage. You're at a stressful time and the grass is going to look much greener elsewhere. She may be happy with him, but it won't make her happy with you.

[transplantsxm 15]

Appreciate the comments, Western Swing and funcoupledayton are probably both right. We both have agreed to try and work it through, but this messed with her head a lot. We can get our sex act together I think (used to be great) but when? I talked to her about this last night. First we have a 17 year old at home and due to the lifestyle on the island (we live part time in the states and part time on a caribbean island, have two homes) where the teenager is basically always home there can basically be no uninhibited sex except rarely at home. The kid goes to bed about 11:00 or 12:00 which is way too late for me to handle, we have a fulltime maid from 8:00 am to 4:00 pm, wife is not a morning person at all, so it becomes difficult. I think she is comparing her "fun" with the guy that could last uninterrupted for hours upon hours, no worries about loudness, or nudity around the house (kid was at volleyball camp for 3.5 days) to our sex life in the context of working, kid around constantly in the evenings, maid first thing every morning, etc.

 

We used to have time when the daughter (stepdaughter) went to visit her bio father for the weekend once or twice a month, but that stopped about a year ago. So I told the wife last night, we have two complete nice homes and I feel like I need to go rent yet another place just so we can have time alone. Yes I have thought of hotels once in a while, but the sex by appointment only, expense of the nice hotel (hotels on the island are about $300 a day), etc. just rubs me wrong.

 

So funcoupledayton, I really believe there is nothing wrong in our marriage but the sex. We get along great (prior to this of course) both wanted to spend all of our free time together, she thinks I am a super provider and stepfather and we generally just always had fun together and wanted to be together. On the sex front, the new guy didn't do anything we didn't have in the past, other than being new of course, younger, and in an atmoshpere free of time restraints, responsibility, limitations, etc.

 

So for instance last night, I was trying hard and took her into our bedroom (daughter was next door at the neighbors) and started some tender loving foreplay, she was actually getting into it, the second she started to peel off the panties guess what, yep the kid is knocking on the front door to be let in. No ones fault, but the wife was up and dressed in like two seconds and I am laying there going "what the fuck". She came back later for a basically a "mercy fuck" to take care of me, but no quality time, no chance for me to get her off, etc. If she is comparing her short round with the new guy to what options we have in our married situaiton, it isn't a level playing field at all.

 

When I mentioned maybe not having a full time maid, well she doesn't like that idea of course, what woman would? I don't have to work during the day everyday, make my own hours as the owner of multiple businesses, but can't say I want to make our sex life confined to the back of an SUV in a parking lot somewhere . . . . LOL . . . . . Keep in mind that if the sex is satisfying for the wife she is VERY loud so naturally, she doesn't really want it if the daughter is in the house. The daughter has sensed the tension and after all is old enought to have some understanding and her mother intimated to her somewhat about "sex issues" (no detail of course) and she says "If you guys need to bang more, then bang more". But in reality the wife is not going to let loose with the daughter being anywhere close.

 

Any ideas, how do all you married people with kids at home, inability to be together during the day, etc. handle it? I really want to know.

[Lionheart72 2,190]

I really believe there is nothing wrong in our marriage but the sex.

 

OK, ses is part of marriage. Something wrong with sex IS something wrong with the marriage... and it sounds like your sex life has some serious problems.

 

Any ideas, how do all you married people with kids at home, inability to be together during the day, etc. handle it? I really want to know.

 

Date night. Get a sitter or ship the kids off to a friends house. Go out, have dinner, see a movie, get a hotel room, fuck.

 

Regardless, your marriage has serious problems and the absolute last thing you need to be doing right now is adding a third human being into the mix.

[transplantsxm 15]

OK, ses is part of marriage. Something wrong with sex IS something wrong with the marriage... and it sounds like your sex life has some serious problems.

 

We never did quit fucking. Usually we always fucked 3 to 5 times a week, but only in the middle of the night, both of us exhausted and it was fucking, not love making and probably not that good for her (wasn't for me either, but the guy always gets off). I mean when you wake your wife up at 2 or 3 am for sex, at least in our case, she just wants it over and to get back to bed, understandable. But just wanted to make the point that we didn't cease having sex or add a guy cause we weren't having sex, just not good sex in my opinion for either of us because of the situation and not being able to be alone.

[mauijanedoe 1,414]

When I mentioned maybe not having a full time maid, well she doesn't like that idea of course, what woman would? .

 

Actually, I'd hate having someone in my house on a daily basis, precisely because it would be just another thing that cut down on the spontaneity of sex. Whether your wife loves the idea or not, that is a clear area where you can get a few days alone. Two days without a maid isn't going to drastically affect the running of your home, but it will defintely give you more opportunities for sex.

[funcoupledayton 2,708]

Your plight is not unusual, except for the full time maid. Most of us are busy with work, kids, daily stress and wish we could scream our heads off during sex anytime.

 

Your kids are old enough to go to a friend for a few hours when you ask for privacy. Your wife is old enough to tone down the decibels when the kids or maid are in the house. I would suggest in the future when you do have a full weekend of privacy, spend it re-connecting and having crazy sex you're missing, not bringing someone else in. You guys just need to talk and think creatively together. I'd take adding additional partners off the table for a long time until you are having the sex you want together.

 

Also, I don't think you work up to fmf by having mfm. Females are harder to find. I think often people hold that ideal out for the future to get what they want in the present (mfm). But, put all that out of your mind and focus on eachother.

[Lionheart72 2,190]

We never did quit fucking. Usually we always fucked 3 to 5 times a week, but only in the middle of the night, both of us exhausted and it was fucking, not love making and probably not that good for her (wasn't for me either, but the guy always gets off). I mean when you wake your wife up at 2 or 3 am for sex, at least in our case, she just wants it over and to get back to bed, understandable. But just wanted to make the point that we didn't cease having sex or add a guy cause we weren't having sex, just not good sex in my opinion for either of us because of the situation and not being able to be alone.

 

I never thought you had stopped and I stand by my statement. You have SERIOUS problems with your sex life. Everything that you just said scream to me "here a couple who are have major difficulties."

 

You NEED to fix this problem and I cannot stress enough that adding another person, for random other people, into the mix is not only NOT the solution, it will make your problems far, far worse.

[transplantsxm 15]

Thanks, I appreciate that. Really. Just wanted to clarify because this board has been so damned helpful in the case, it really has.

[transplantsxm 15]

Your plight is not unusual, except for the full time maid. Most of us are busy with work, kids, daily stress and wish we could scream our heads off during sex anytime.

 

Your kids are old enough to go to a friend for a few hours when you ask for privacy. Your wife is old enough to tone down the decibels when the kids or maid are in the house. I would suggest in the future when you do have a full weekend of privacy, spend it re-connecting and having crazy sex you're missing, not bringing someone else in. You guys just need to talk and think creatively together. I'd take adding additional partners off the table for a long time until you are having the sex you want together.

 

Also, I don't think you work up to fmf by having mfm. Females are harder to find. I think often people hold that ideal out for the future to get what they want in the present (mfm). But, put all that out of your mind and focus on eachother.

 

Different society on the island (age of consent just got raised from 12 to 15) so we have always been very protective of the daughter. We have made our house the home base for her and her friends to try and keep them safe (and virgins until they are old enough to make their own choices). In this environment, sending your daughter to some other houses is akin to sending the chickens straight to the foxes. We have a large Jamacian population where the fathers think they should "break in their daughters". A Dutch island which thinks sex at any age is appropriate, etc. My only reason for saying this is the environment is different here. Boy gangs in the only movie theater and I could go on and on.

 

So appreciate your comments and yes, I think another guy for the wife is a bad idea for a very, very long time. I handled it fine, she didn't. What a surprise.

 

We didn't start out with MFM in order to get to FMF or MFMF. In fact the 2nd guy that caused all the problems asked her about bringing a girl he knew for me and it was "No fucking way, I would never allow that", which surprised him and he said he found weird. That said, I don't really want another woman, had many in the past before my wife and done all the scenes including swing clubs. This wasn't trying to get a new gal for me, just more cock for her!

[JustAskJulie 2,595]

We talked some about trying to find a true FWB instead of some guy that excludes me and would say such things bluntly back claiming his territory, but she says she has spread for two guys so far and is not going to keep fucking guys to find one that is right in all ways.

 

Generally I found it very exciting and no jealous issues about the sex at all. The problem started when the guy developed an attitude and started claiming rights. Any advice on how to go from here? Do we approach this some different way or just give up on it?

 

Sounds to me like you find this whole idea more appealing than she does overall. At the very least I'd say it's time to take a break from seeking. Almost always finding a playmate (whether it be a single or a couple) is the hardest part. I would say that if you do make another effort in the future that you try to take things slower. Don't allow for this whole weekend take-over thing until you've already established the friends part. Also, if you want to ensure that you are included include yourself. It sounded like it was pretty much just him and her from the beginning and you were just in the house. Make your presence a priority (at least in the beginning) if you want to be included. Otherwise, you are opening the door for what just happened.

[transplantsxm 15]

Thanks so much, well it was very appealing to me and I think it ended up being TOO appealing to her . . . . . I wasn't probably forceful enough with the second guy when he kind of excluded me, cause she was enjoying it so. Good advice. Thanks even more for the link to Amazon, your book is on the way to the Caribbean for both of us to read and decide where we want to go. I think it will be helpful.

[JustAskJulie 2,595]

Thanks so much, well it was very appealing to me and I think it ended up being TOO appealing to her . . . . . I wasn't probably forceful enough with the second guy when he kind of excluded me, cause she was enjoying it so. Good advice. Thanks even more for the link to Amazon, your book is on the way to the Caribbean for both of us to read and decide where we want to go. I think it will be helpful.

 

Your welcome and at the very least you'll have some good discussions as you read it together.

[transplantsxm 15]

And actually bought Kindle for me and paperback for her so we can co-read . . . . she isn't into Kindle so much. Thanks again!