What does "Open-Minded" mean?

[JustAskJulie 2,595]

I've been having this discussion with friends and I thought I'd bring it here. The discussion is regarding the meaning of the use "open-minded" in swinger ads. I've long seen it as a cliche term in swinger ads, with the thought that all swingers are "open minded", to a degree, when it comes to sex. Describing yourselves as open-minded is like saying you are "attractive" or that you don't want "drama". They are all subjective terms, that often get thrown around in ads simply because everyone else uses them. New couple sees terminology in 80% of other ads out there and comes to identify with it so they use it in their own ad, and so on without ever really stopping to think about what it actually means.

 

However, it was recently pointed out that for some "open minded" or at least "sexually open minded" is really just a euphemism for saying that they are into male-male bisexuality. I know Chicup has said that here in the past in a tongue-in-cheek way under thread of "what people mean when they really say...", but now I'm wondering if that is the underlying "meaning" for those "in the know" (ie. other couples who are open to male-male play but not willing to be straight-forward about it). And, if so, where does that leave all the poor innocent folks who are just using the term thinking it means they are open to new ideas....

 

Thoughts? What does it mean to you when you read "open minded? Or better yet, what are you trying to convey when you use the term in your ad?

[Coupleerotic22 1,419]

I have never considered it a code word with any specific meaning.

 

I pretty much have thought it to mean that the couple is willing to explore the possibilities, which could refer to bi play as you mention. In the context of swinging I have felt it could also mean many other things that may be in some range of personal tabus, such as hall passes, interracial, anal, pain, rain etc.

 

In the end it needs to be taken in context with the rest of the profile.

[slevin 1,374]

I think the context of the phrase in the profile is important. We've definitely seen a number of profiles where we got the exact impression that Chicup alludes to. We found out through the process of getting to know a couple of those couples that our initial impression was correct. I am sure many just use it as a tired old phrase like no drama etc., but I think you can get a sense of their intention of the use of the phrase by the context it's used in. Sometimes it's not so subtle.

[SwingerGirl 132]

Once you start analyzing all of it, all swinger lingo is a bit confusing, and I wish everyone would just come out and write a few more words and explain what they mean. I have not run into a situation yet where it has meant male bisexuality, but it wouldn't surprise me. I just found out a couple days ago that apparently if you use "MMF" instead of "MFM" that you mean you want the guys to have bi-time. HUH? So if I accidentally write MMF, does that mean it's ok for the guys to have bi-time without discussing it further first? I dunno..... again, it's all too confusing for words.

 

Want to know what my idea of open-minded is? A society where we don't need codes to describe male bisexuality. Or a swinging community that doesn't feel the need to put on their ads "no guys better touch my ass" or something equally ridiculous.

[ViSexual 1,008]

I like it when someone writes, or says, I'm open-minded..., but! LOL! When I refer to my being open-minded I mean that I try not to be judgemental of others regardless of their preferences.

[O.C. 15]

I just found out a couple days ago that apparently if you use "MMF" instead of "MFM" that you mean you want the guys to have bi-time. HUH? So if I accidentally write MMF, does that mean it's ok for the guys to have bi-time without discussing it further first?

 

 

It also applies to FFM versus FMF. Seems pretty obvious just looking at the arrangement of the letters.

 

Neither is new. It's been that way for decades. Maybe I spent too many years reading Penthouse Forum, Penthouse Variations and the Playboy Advisor. Surely Cosmo didn't have it different.

 

Advertising or stating in profiles that you're open to MMF or FFM, you might just get what you're asking for.

[SW_PA_Couple 4,023]

As Slevin said, context is important for understanding this two-word combination. I will go further. When somebody uses it in a personal profile as part of a simple statement such as we are looking for an open-minded couple and very little other contextual information exists, it is too open to interpretation to convey any specific meaning.

 

In support of Julie's point, we were contacted by a couple, arranged a meeting and subsequently received a question from across the table, "are you bisexual?" "No," was our casual reply. "But I thought you guys were open-minded," was the quick response. I guess we missed the point.

 

A couple of other meanings for open-minded that I can recall having being been used at this esteemed bulletin board: willing to meet a married person whose spouse is not a swinger; willing to meet a person of a different ethnic ancestry. It's not a trick word combination; it's just too vague to be useful.

 

I will add one final comment. We have met swingers who are decidedly closed-minded having extreme political views or definite racial prejudices. So I'm glad that nobody has suggestged that swingers are categorically open-minded.

[a_d_xxx 663]

To assume that open-minded is code word for something other than 'being open to new ideas' is dangerous. Maybe the author didn't get the memo, or is lazy and is just copying what they've read on other profiles, or is just trying to say: "we're not like those close-minded vanillas..." (Warning: Intentional straw-man alert).

 

Similarly, assuming the order of three letters means something beyond 2 Ms and an F is asking for trouble.

 

I'd recommend you always confirm your assumptions, by asking.

 

On a completely personal note, I don't understand the reason for the code. If 'open-minded' is generally accepted to mean looking for male-male play, why the code? If it is common knowledge then you're not hiding anything, and if it's not, then you risk getting it interpreted wrong.

 

D

[funcoupledayton 2,708]

We have open-minded in our profile. My husband is straight, but we are open to bi-guys who play straight. We are also open to some bdsm type play, playing separate at times, role play, etc. So it is a good fit for us, and brings interest from a variety of people.

[angelkin 1,326]

I'll agree that context is everything when interpreting profiles. However, it has been our experience that "open-minded" can and sometimes does mean open to male/male play. Of course we always ask just to be clear, but in my estimation, the single men we have asked if "open-minded" means an interest in bi-male play, the answer has been "yes" 90% of the time.

[divenaked 325]

In my experience, "Looking for open-minded people." has meant they were looking for people who thought like they did. If your views were different from theirs, you were closed minded.

[cplnuswing 4,712]

When I refer to my being open-minded I mean that I try not to be judgemental of others regardless of their preferences.

 

That's what it means to me, and not just on the subject of sex, but everything. In profiles, it does get tricky trying to deduce what they are really getting at, and all you really have to go on then is the context. If it seems important that we know exactly what they are trying to say, then we would just ask.

[JustAskJulie 2,595]

In my experience, "Looking for open-minded people." has meant they were looking for people who thought like they did. If your views were different from theirs, you were closed minded.

 

True in swinging, true in life

[shy_couple 458]

We tend to agree with Julie and Angelkin. It can be a little vague and may be left to interpretation. But we have found it to mean "bi or bi-curious" for male-male play. Typically we see it listed as he is straight but open minded. Think its for closet bi-curious guys. Of course they cant say they are bi-curious or they would have very few responses to their profile.

 

This has been the experience in our area. When someone with a profile with bi or bi-curious male contacts us, we send a polite no thank you and add that neither of us have interest in bi male play. We recently got a flirt from a couple so we looked at previuos emails. Sure enough, we had sent the no bi-men response, the profile was changed to straight and open minded. Then another time there was a profile that we liked so we dropped a hello and he said that she wasn't interested but he would "do us both" Sure enough he was listed as straight but "open minded" in the profile.

 

We are by no means homophobic. Neither of us have a problem being naked around same or opposite sex. We have been with couples and everyone was bumping touching and been in MFM situations. There was one time where teh couple we were with were having anal sex, Mr Shy was facinated and went in for a closer look. She insisted that he touch her ass and pussy with the other guy in there. It was a little weird but still hot and in the moment. So really no trouble here with incidental touching, bumping, and so on but it really holds no interest for either of us.

 

Really if bi is your thing, then say so. Don't be coy or deceptive.

[DaggersNRoses 271]

Now I will try to be more serious, lol.

 

I don't have a lot of time invested in communicating with other swingers yet but from trying to learn and getting us through the front door of life, I am getting the impression that the term "open-minded" can be used to mean anything that is outside the norm.

 

I have seen reference to how outside the norm swinging is but once we entered the gates of the lifestyle, we found that there are circles within that for different ways to approach swinging or things enjoyed. So you will end up with what is commonly found and things that aren't as well.

 

 

The Rose

[DaggersNRoses 271]

It also applies to FFM versus FMF. Seems pretty obvious just looking at the arrangement of the letters.

 

Neither is new. It's been that way for decades. Maybe I spent too many years reading Penthouse Forum, Penthouse Variations and the Playboy Advisor. Surely Cosmo didn't have it different.

 

Advertising or stating in profiles that you're open to MMF or FFM, you might just get what you're asking for.

 

 

As someone who only found out how those letters could be taken, no it wasn't obvious at all.

 

But since my magazine reading is Good Housekeeping, that could be why.

 

 

 

The Rose

[tribbles 490]

I think it's best to ask. It could mean looks and weight and age are unimportant. I could mean male/male or interracial or not caring about playmates real lives are-married and cheating, married but in an open 'don't ask, don't tell' situation.

 

It means what the person who wrote it wants it to mean. So I just ask.

[pna42 67]

I try not to define ''open minded'' to closely because it in itself is too restrictive. I'm more of a go with the flow person.

[Baron-n-kitty 104]

This here is a cool thread. I certainly agree that "open minded" can mean well, damn near anything. Too broad a term to really say anything. Its like asking the wife "where do you want to eat?" in which she says "anywhere you want". Then having to go through the whole list of places to eat in town before I finally get to the one she wants to eat at in the first place. Would be easier for everyone involved if they would just say what they wanted right off the bat instead of trying to feel it out or guess. Rawr.

[Guest screaminggood]

I agree with Chicup...I most often here it in conjunction with M-M bisexuality.

[Coupleerotic22 1,419]

 

I have seen reference to how outside the norm swinging is but once we entered the gates of the lifestyle, we found that there are circles within that for different ways to approach swinging or things enjoyed. So you will end up with what is commonly found and things that aren't as well.

 

Well swinging is outside the norm if you ask the vanilla world.

 

As we read it, and how we would mean it is we said or wrote it, here are the thing we will do and the things we will not do. Being open minded means we will consider things we may have not spelled out in our profile or, depending on the couple, we may consider straying from the guidelines listed in our profile. Like age limits, travel, separate rooms, etc. We don't take it to mean anything specific because that would simply be an assumption on our part.

 

As someone who only found out how those letters could be taken, no it wasn't obvious at all.

 

Initially I did not think there was any difference between FFM or FMF, but over time I have heard numerous people take those to mean two different things. Enough for us to at least think about it and ask specifically what someone means, if it is not clear enough elsewhere in the profile. I will say in my experience I have seen far more people think there is a difference between MMF and MFM than I have had people thing "Open Minded" means male bi-sexuality.

[Chicup 41]

"We are open minded." - Could mean anything.

"He is open minded." - Definitely bisexual/bi curious.

 

I am very close minded about this.

[JustAskJulie 2,595]

If you learn nothing else from this thread it is the importance of communication and of ALWAYS asking for clarification if there is any doubt as to what someone means.

 

 

 

"We are open minded." - Could mean anything.

"He is open minded." - Definitely bisexual/bi curious.

 

I am very close minded about this.

 

I see what you did there.

 

Now to play devils advocate. Couldn't it also mean that he wrote the profile and she has no interest in swinging - therefore HE is open-minded?

 

We are all open-minded....until we aren't

[Coupleerotic22 1,419]

We are all open-minded....until we aren't

 

Bingo! We have a winner

[Chicup 41]

We are all open-minded....until we aren't

 

Nope, he likes weiners.

 

While obviously "open minded" could mean a lot of things, we are talking about sex here on a swingers add. If you go out of your way to write about being open minded specifically to the male, to me it just screams bisexual. I'm not sure what else open minded would refer to unless they were more specific. With a new profile and someone who just read a few profiles and is basically playing copy cat yea there will be some mistakes, but I think its a pretty safe rule.

 

Usually the single/cheating male posing as a couple are pretty blatant in how the profile is written. First picture will be of the guy, often no pictures of the woman involved. The profile will say "I" instead of "we". There are other less obvious hints of course too, but I think my profilefoo is pretty strong by now.

[sweet_tna 680]

When we first posted our profile, we had the phrase "open minded" listed. What we meant by it was that we weren't vanillas, were open to MOST experiences, and not judgmental. After reading the threads on here, we realized it was a cliche' that could easily be interpreted, so we took it out and got a tad more specific.

 

As for how we interpret that phrase on others' profiles, it would really depend on the context in which it was written. Even then, it's probably best just to ask them what it means.

 

=)

[JustAskJulie 2,595]

Just ran across this and thought it was fairly appropriate.