Do you recall your feelings after your first few experiences? Did you feel any pain?

[openingthedoor 21]

Hi. Thanks to everyone for answering my many questions about STDs. So now I have another question more directly related to our first and only experience.

 

The short version is that we had a FFM, which is both of our long-time fantasies. I'm the wife. I know that this normally is not recommended as a starting point but really this is my huge fantasy and I'm not so aroused by the thought of being with another man. For the most part, I can't have an orgasm unless I'm very comfortable with the person, so the swing scene doesn't seem like it would do much for me in terms of being with another man. *However, on the continuum, I'm pretty close to straight, so my opinion about being with other men certainly could change. Also, my husband does not want me to be with another man, although his view changed somewhat after seeing me with this other woman (he thought I was enjoying it bc I was acting like I was enjoying it--which turned him on--and which made him think that *maybe* seeing me with another man wouldn't bother him as much as he had always believed).

 

So we had a bad experience overall. The woman was an alcoholic and a smoker and she smoked in the hotel room. I do not smoke and do not like smoke at all. So she was not a good match for me regardless. But I so much wanted to see this fantasy become reality, and with females being so hard to find, I was willing to endure much more than normal to make it happen.

 

We met for dinner and hubby was flirting with her, which didn't bother me at all (I actually thought it was pretty cool and more likely to make my fantasy reality). Then we went to the hotel room and pretty quickly everyone was involved in heavy foreplay in all directions, although the woman was mostly focused on me--which I didn't like bc my fantasy involved the woman wanting my husband more than me. But, hey, you take what you can get with a unicorn, so again we continued. I tried to move the focus back to my husband several times. He has a great body and is very well-endowed, although he was 14 years older than her, so that might have been an issue for her. She was very experienced in this lifestyle so I'm guessing age wasn't a huge issue. I kind of think she was more of a lesbian but willing to be with guys--again not really my fantasy but we continued. She did give him a BJ and complimented his dick, plus kissed him some, and he went down on her (actually we both did). She had a LOT to drink before we landed in bed. Hubby and I were both sober. She was speaking coherently so not ridiculously drunk but she had enough to drink that she wasn't responding like I think she would or should have in a sober state. My husband is *great* at foreplay and I think I'm pretty good too. But she was almost lifeless during oral and just very strange. She seemed to be overly focused on making me have this great first bi experience--which again was a mismatch because my fantasy wasn't about MY being the center of attention.

 

So anyway. Finally she looked at him and said "get a condom and we can fuck a little." Not exactly romantic but whatever. I got off the bed and grabbed a condom, put it on his very hard dick, and she just jumped on. Very fast. And all of a sudden I'm watching the man who has been VERY loyal and committed for 13 years, and who had only had sex with one other woman in his life besides me (and with her, only a couple of times). So he's getting a very big thrill and I'm watching. I wasn't upset, just kind of like indifferent feeling. I'm sure I was shocked. I stayed very close and had a very close up view, from behind (with her sitting on him and my watching their hips start to move slowly, then more vigorously--he was pulling her onto him and pushing himself into her--so getting into it--then they decided to switch to a modified missionary and I was lying right beside them, with a very close up view from the front (even pushing him into her a couple of times). This part of reality was very consistent with my fantasy (although fantasy maybe involved more of a threesome idea--still this is a very hot fantasy for me).

 

Okay, so long story short, after the whole event, I felt weird, numb, kind of sad. I mean the next day, shocked somewhat. Then following day I had several crying "bouts," which lasted maybe 15-20 minutes each. Then I had a huge HIV scare that changed my attention for a couple of weeks (honestly I had several symptoms but turned out to be a cold). I was sad during this time because I thought I had HIV. But I was alternating between sad, indifferent/not caring, thinking that he shoudl get lots of women but not really wanting to be one of them anymore (because he hurt me--this feeling doesn't really last but I have this feeling sometimes), but then *always* getting very aroused about DOING IT AGAIN!! I mean, seriously, during sex, I can't think about anything else. I must have this fantasy to have an orgasm, and the thought of doing it again just gets me so crazy horny that I can't explain it.

 

Fast forward to today, I guess about 2.5 weeks later. Mostly, I feel that I don't really care that he had sex with another woman (and/or feel happy that he did--good for him). Sometimes I also feel sad, although the sadness seems to be fading a little (not going away completely). During sex, I continue to want that fantasy and want it to happen again--like SOON! I have even noticed that my married friend seems to want him (long story) and wanting to have her with him, although I do not want her hubby (at ALL) so that probably will not happen.

 

I am so confused that I don't know what is happening.

 

I should also say that, truly, I am so lucky to have married world's nicest guy. Not kidding. He is a dream man. I have no doubts whatsoever about his total devotion to me and love for me. He is completely willing to stop or continue--whatever I want. And, actually, once he started realizing that I had some pain, he absolutely wants to stop. But then I get horny again and drag him back into the fantasy. We talked heavily about this fantasy for at least two years, led by me, before we took action. So he is not some jerk guy forcing his wife into this situation.

 

I'm pretty confused right now. Obviously my emotions and feeligns are all over the map.

 

So I'm just wondering, if you can remember when you first started swinging: did you feel any pain? Did you have to adjust to some pain? I mean, part of me thinks that I *might* adjust to this new reality and the pain will lessen with each new experience. And the other part worries that if I continue to have pain after each experience and really continue obsessing over my feelings, then swinging will be exciting when it is happening and during sex, but otherwise will screw with the rest of my life. So not be worth it.

 

So did your feelings evolve about swinging? Or were your feelings about seeing your spouse with another person 100% positive from the beginning?

 

Thank you all for any answers/thoughts!

 

p.s. I have read that this is basically a "cuckqueen" (female cuckold) and one theory of why this arouses some women is kind of like emotional S&M, like a pain / pleasure thing. I think that is what is happening for me, though not sure that is a healthy or normal response. I kind of would prefer the pain to go away and just have the pleasure. I'm not sure if that would gradually happen in the lifestyle, or if I'm always going to have some pain. I love my husband very much and his excitement very much excites me. And this definitely excites him although my pain *does not* excite him. So again just wondering if anyone has anything other than complete bliss after swinging experiences, particularly your first few.

[Lionheart72 2,190]

Thinking back to our first couples swap, I remember feeling a bit numb, shocked, a little emotional pain while my wife was with the other guy. Mostly, as it turned out afterward, my wife and I were both "taking one for the team." Neither of us was really interested in hooking up with this couple. It was just a "we're new, we're at a swingers club, they offered" kind of thing. I will say, however, that I got over all of those feelings within a few days. It would have been sooner, I think, if we had had a better handle on what we needed to do to "reconnect" afterward.

 

In our early swinging experiences, my wife and I really didn't have a good grasp on how to say "no." We each spent a lot of time assuming what the other thought, felt and wanted. We've gotten better about that, better about communicating our desires and better about being willing to say "no, this isn't working for me, we need to stop." I think that communication and that willingness is very important. After all, swinging is supposed to be fun. If it isn't, you need to stop and figure out why it isn't.

[mauijanedoe 1,414]

So I'm just wondering, if you can remember when you first started swinging: did you feel any pain? Did you have to adjust to some pain? I mean, part of me thinks that I *might* adjust to this new reality and the pain will lessen with each new experience. And the other part worries that if I continue to have pain after each experience and really continue obsessing over my feelings, then swinging will be exciting when it is happening and during sex, but otherwise will screw with the rest of my life. So not be worth it.

 

So did your feelings evolve about swinging? Or were your feelings about seeing your spouse with another person 100% positive from the beginning?

 

Thank you all for any answers/thoughts!

 

p.s. I have read that this is basically a "cuckqueen" (female cuckold) and one theory of why this arouses some women is kind of like emotional S&M, like a pain / pleasure thing. I think that is what is happening for me, though not sure that is a healthy or normal response. I kind of would prefer the pain to go away and just have the pleasure. I'm not sure if that would gradually happen in the lifestyle, or if I'm always going to have some pain. I love my husband very much and his excitement very much excites me. And this definitely excites him although my pain *does not* excite him. So again just wondering if anyone has anything other than complete bliss after swinging experiences, particularly your first few.

 

I'm not big on fantasies, but I knew before we ever did any sort of swinging that I'd be turned on by seeing M. with another woman and I was. It's still my favorite thing and, no, I've never experienced any emotional pain before, during or after, just excitement and arousal that lasts for days. He isn't turned on at all, but he is comforted by my presence and likes watching the geometry of sex. He's also never experienced any pain.

 

Swinging is a high risk activity on an emotional level and has enormous power to bring things to the surface. That can be an opportunity to work on your stuff or maybe the feelings just go away and don't return after the first time. Alternatively, they remain so painful that they outweigh any pleasure that might be derived. We're all different and there's no right answer here.

[losAmantes 318]

Swinging is a high risk activity on an emotional level and has enormous power to bring things to the surface. That can be an opportunity to work on your stuff or maybe the feelings just go away and don't return after the first time. Alternatively, they remain so painful that they outweigh any pleasure that might be derived. We're all different and there's no right answer here.

I can't agree more! If there are any chinks in your relationship, swinging will bring them to the fore. Most couples aren't strong enough to deal with the first few swaps so they drop out of the lifestyle before they figure it out.

[angelkin 1,326]

I had mixed feelings on how I would process seeing my hubby with another woman and if I were to say there was not a twinge of jealousy our first time, I would be a liar. Matter of fact, it still happens from time to time - but that's my problem to deal with and we often discuss it ad nausem the next day until I (or he) work through it. Those times are fewer and fewer as we refine swinging I am happy to report.

 

Only once was I in pain and it took me a few weeks to get past it. It was not something he did that was intentional, but it hurt all the same. We took a little break after that and did a lot of talking.

[openingthedoor 21]

I can't agree more! If there are any chinks in your relationship, swinging will bring them to the fore. Most couples aren't strong enough to deal with the first few swaps so they drop out of the lifestyle before they figure it out.

 

Honestly this type of statement made regularly on this board is just inaccurate. I can't imagine any couples are stronger frankly. Now, me as a person, I certainly have my weaknesses. But as a couple we couldn't be stronger. Whether we swing or not -- will not change the strength of our marriage. As an individual, I have pain that may or may not lessen over time, but our marriage is strong and making judgments about marriages other than your own...not really possible.

 

Swinging and non-swinging couples can be strong from what I have read on this board and learned in my own marriage.

 

Also I wouldn't call my feelings jealousy. Definitely not jealousy. Not that I would care if I was feeling jealousy--just not what I'm feeling. It's more of a sadness that he was gone feeling...I worked through years of abandonment issues in therapy...kind of like that feeling, which isn't jealousy. My husband has helped me tremendously with those feelings so seeing him so intimately with someone else was difficult (or rather the memory is sometimes difficult, sometimes not) but also again very arousing. I also love him and want him to have the ultimate pleasures in life. So it's a conundrum.

[angelkin 1,326]

It is a completely true statement that swinging magnifies the good and bad in a relationship and I think that is the truth that LosAmantes was trying to express. If you disagree with that statement, come back after a year in the lifestyle - I'd be interested to know if you changed your mind.

[Fundamental Law 2,887]

Worth teasing apart a couple of ideas that seem co-mingled.

 

1. Certainly couples can be strong for many reasons, inside and outside the LS. Strength comes from what they face together. Entering the LS is a choice, quite different from the curveballs that life throws and simply have to be addressed. Couples who choose to explore--and continue on in--the LS have a foundational strength that might be less common in the vanilla world.

 

2. No one quite knows how they will react when their partner is intimate with someone else. No one quite knows how their partner will react either. There is a moment of reckoning, and at least some debriefing: are you okay with this? did you enjoy it? and so on. Introspection is hard, sharing those thoughts can also be hard. Different from cheating, the LS is based in honesty and transparency. That can--and likely will-- mean one or the other saying, "I hurt"; "I'm not sure what this means for us"; " I was jealous"; and so on. Certainly we had some of those sensations after the first time. But it felt playful and it felt good and we quickly reconnected with an intensity of intimacy and passion that we liked--a lot.

[Chicup 41]

After our first full swap, I was pretty messed up with jealousy. Mistakes were made etc. It lasted a couple of weeks. It passed. Beating down that green eyed monster and making it listen to you rather than you it, is one of the great benefits of swinging.

[XploreFun 26]

Hi,

 

My wife has the exact same fantasy. I wonder if she might feel the same. We are only looking into this lifestyle at the moment so I am afraid we can offer little advice. I actually think the way you want to do this for each other is healthy. I also wonder however if you need to also directly enjoy pleasure rather than get it indirectly through your spouse. That is something my wife and I are discussing. We don't know to be honest. I guess the question is: can observing someone else's pleasure suffice or do you need to both feel and observe?

[Sensualbicouple 122]

I too would like to see hubby with another woman (one of my many fantasies) and who is to say how I would feel about it afterwards. But I do think if it ever happens, I think I would have to both observe and participate because why would I say no to consensual fun...however I have observed only and not participated in a play session and it was still smoking hot!!!

[Lionheart72 2,190]

Honestly this type of statement made regularly on this board is just inaccurate. I can't imagine any couples are stronger frankly. Now, me as a person, I certainly have my weaknesses. But as a couple we couldn't be stronger. Whether we swing or not -- will not change the strength of our marriage. As an individual, I have pain that may or may not lessen over time, but our marriage is strong and making judgments about marriages other than your own...not really possible.

 

Respectfully, I think you need to take a deep calming breath and look at your response here. losAmantes made a generic statement that a lot of very experienced swingers on these boards agree with. You immediately personalized it, taking the generic statement that some couples aren't strong enough to deal with swinging and turning it into a criticism of your relationship. To me, your reply sounds extremely defensive. I know that when I take a generic statement, turn it into a personal criticism and respond defensively it's because I'm afraid that it does apply to me and I don't want it to. Therefore, I would encourage you to take a serious look at what you really feel and what made you respond in this manner. You might find that there are fears there which need to be addressed.

[openingthedoor 21]

Respectfully, I think you need to take a deep calming breath and look at your response here. losAmantes made a generic statement that a lot of very experienced swingers on these boards agree with. You immediately personalized it, taking the generic statement that some couples aren't strong enough to deal with swinging and turning it into a criticism of your relationship. To me, your reply sounds extremely defensive. I know that when I take a generic statement, turn it into a personal criticism and respond defensively it's because I'm afraid that it does apply to me and I don't want it to. Therefore, I would encourage you to take a serious look at what you really feel and what made you respond in this manner. You might find that there are fears there which need to be addressed.

 

Thank you. I think what you are saying would possibly be true except that there was a background of my having read many other posts on this forum before this thread. I always think it is inappropriate for anyone to make suggestions about the strength (or lack thereof) of another's marriage. And that sometimes happens on this board (lots of other great conversation also happens on this board so not a criticism--I like this board). She said "most couples aren't strong enough to deal with the first few swaps." That is a superiority type statement, maybe generically made without any real intention related to my marriage, but suggesting in general that swinging couples are stronger than those who start but stop. I just don't agree and don't even think that level of knowledge about human relations is possible, particularly without a PhD in psychology, and even then, probably not. I have done plenty of research. If you Google "swinging effect on marriage," you can find articles written by therapists saying that couples who choose to swing are avoiding the really difficult work of keeping their marriage interesting and exciting and at the highest possible level of intimacy together. You can also find articles reaching an opposite conclusion (though not many by PhDs in human psychology).

 

I personally cannot decide which is best and true for us. That is what I continue pondering. We both want what is best for our marriage first and foremost. And I really wish I knew the answer. Unfortunately, I don't think anyone really knows or can know the truest answer. We just live and die together, and hopefully make the best choices we can to enhance our marriages. But to say that only "strong" couples can continue in swinging...sorry but that is offensive to anyone who might choose not to get involved. And I've been on plenty of boards so I do not mean to say "that is offensive" to offend the person who posted. S/he surely meant nothing offensive by the statement--but still it is offensive to those of us on the fence so I wanted to point out my feelings. I am interested in learning about the experiences of swingers; I do not want an evaluation of my marriage, directly or indirectly. I've seen that happen on this board and the subject of the evaluation almost invariably is offended. So I think that type of statement (or any statement evaluating the marriage of another) really should be avoided unless requested.

 

Let's put it this way. I am very into fitness. What if I said "only really strong people stick with workout regimens?" Might that offend those who do not regularly go to the gym, but work hard, take care of their families, and do the best that they can in life?? It's not a huge point because that was just a minor statement but overall I would just greatly appreciate no evaluations of my marriage. I don't want to end up in a conversation justifying my marriage. We are incredibly happy, happier than I ever thought possible with another human being, and I am just incredibly blessed beyond my wildest imaginations to have met the man who I am so happy to call my husband. He's such a wonderful blessing that sex (or not) is secondary although also very VERY hot between us. Whether we swing or not (which will be determined solely based on whether we think this enhances our lives)--not going to impact that reality.

 

For those who posted who are considering a FFM, I would just say that I think we handled the situation better than most (even including my crying) because we talked, and talked, and talked for literally 2 YEARS, in and out of the bedroom. We role played down the most exquisite details (or rather I should say we "fantasy talked.") We experimented by getting a mutual lap dance at a strip club (which went fine but also took some adjustment afterward--a few weeks then I was fine and could easily do it again--no problem). Then we went online and exchanged numerous emails and then had great sex looking at photos of potential playmates. Honestly we talked about this probably thousands of times overall. The talk was sexy as HELL and also helped our sex life tremendously. I became much more open about explaining and requesting exactly what I wanted in bed--and my husband is so kind and generous that he always obliged. I also made his pleasure my ongoing and undying mission. We have phenomenal sex and actually not even sure that we need any spicing up beyond these fantasies, although the possibility of reality, and maybe some reality, helps keep things at the utmost/ultra sexiest and hottest. We also read a few books, watched numerous videos, watched plenty of threesome porn, and ... kind of made this our little mini-hobby without adding others for a long time.

 

IF we had not done all of those things, to the point where the actual event almost seemed like we had done it before, then I think it would have been FAR more difficult. Even the experienced swingers on this board, if you read other threads, suggest that a threesome is more difficult emotionally. I just felt that a threesome was still what WE should do because I don't want to be with another guy (see above paragraph about great sex with hubby). My fantasy is hubby with another woman. That's still my fantasy. Until I start WANTING another guy, we felt this was the best path for us. (And also my hubby is not comfortable with the idea, although he has said that he would try if I had that craving...I just do not). And actually we are still considering regular swinging because I'm not really sure how I would feel about another guy. I am also concerned about my husband's feelings because we haven't had 2 years of him facing the reality (in fantasy). I just could not bear hurting him. And my vision of guys having "recreational sex"--yeah, not so much fun for me anyway. We are considering going to a club just to see the reality for ourselves, but with the rule that we will not swing in the club.

 

I do apologize if I have offended anyone by asking for no comments on the strength of my marriage (other than well-deserved compliments!) Again, I am just trying to ask politely because I don't want to feel like I'm defending something that doesn't need defending. Kind of a frustrating waste of time, at the very least, and I'm trying to learn more about whether swinging becomes easier emotionally.

 

My feelings overall, let's say yesterday and today, are generally neutral outside the bedroom, and very hot inside the bedroom. It's bothering me less and less. Even writing this has helped. And of course hubby and I have talked about every conceivable permutation of how we both felt. Of course, that helps, and has brought us closer. I'm just really still not sure if having sex with others truly enhances your marriage overall. I have no idea. No judgments. I just don't know if that would be the case for us--or not. I love that he had a great thrill and so does he. But he absolutely is "the type" who could live without and also be very content as long as I was happy. So I'm very lucky to have a great guy and also thank everyone for the thoughts and ideas. Seems like some people say that they had some minor difficulties at first, and others did not. So I guess there is no easy answer--just like everything else in this crazy swinging experiment.

 

Another weird aspect of swinging, for me anyway, is that if you take the fantasies further and further, or if you get into the lifestyle, I would guess, and take the experiences further and further, ultimately it seems to me that you have to land at some variation of polyamory. I know most swingers are NOT polyamorous, but I'm not sure why. It seems to me that would be the natural evolution (that has even been the natural evolution of our fantasies). You start together, then it gets more exciting to think about being apart (more risk/adrenaline/excitement/pleasure for those who are having sex), then it naturally sort of evolves into...they fall in love. I mean, sex, great relationship = love. I know swingers just have "recreational" sex, but IMHO they just have not fully evolved, or taken the experience further. But I am the type to go "all in" with something. So I can see myself pushing toward that line. And THAT seems risky as hell, even for a couple who is totally and completely in love. I actually have no doubt that we will be together forever (far too much history and love). But still having another true lover would complicate things and I'm not sure that would INCREASE our intimacy (and despite that being on the outskirts of my fantasies--I have no doubt that would be BAD for me emotionally). It's just very confusing although I'm hesitant to include this last thought bc not trying to get into a full blown polyamory vs swinging discussion. I've read several of those on this board already. I understand the distinction. I just think some emotional feelings are inevitable when you have sex with another (and this was the conclusion of that psychologist who wrote the article I mentioned--that feelings naturally develop whenever sex is involved) and possibly not the greatest for your marital bond. But I know there are swingers on this board who have been doing it for years and very sincerely seem extremely happy. I guess my question is whether we would be happiest with swinging. Happy versus the happiest you could make each other--not sure whether that includes swinging for us or not.

 

The sucky thing is that I thought I would know the answer with certainty after our first experience. That folks doesn't happen. You just have more questions about how this might evolve in your marriage--could be good or bad--and you really can't know without doing it--and I can see this would be a never ending cycle of unknowns.

[sunbuckus 3,567]

There’s a lot that you wrote and a lot that is swirling in my head so I’ll do my best to make sense of everything and hope I don’t forget anything that I wanted to say.

 

So I'm just wondering, if you can remember when you first started swinging: did you feel any pain? Did you have to adjust to some pain? So did your feelings evolve about swinging? Or were your feelings about seeing your spouse with another person 100% positive from the beginning?

 

Physical pain? No. Emotional pain? Yes. I think there are a lot of couples that go through some “growing pains” from their first time to possibly their nth time swapping. You’re not alone in having non-blissful feelings the first time. For me, I had to realize that my jealous was really insecurity and possessiveness. I was afraid that I would lose Mr. Sun but I had to remind myself that he comes home with me after every swing event and he comes home to me every night. I had to remind myself that we’re together not because I own him but because he chooses to be with me. The one thing that I am continuing in working on is my own insecurity in my self-worth which happens to wreak havoc on various areas of my life, not just swinging.

 

In my opinion, I think swinging definitely opened my mind and feelings to other possibilities, other thought patterns, and a general questioning of what society deems to be appropriate or wrong. In terms of specifically swinging and non-monogamy in marriage, I wasn’t keen on the idea 5 years ago. I didn’t even know that swinging existed and I equated all non-monogamy in marriage to be cheating. Shows you how much I knew about the world!

 

From one of your other postings:

 

During our one and only encounter (FFM), we met the woman online and decided to meet the same day, which included a 4 hour drive to her city. We had no time to get ready....

 

And from this post:

 

The woman was an alcoholic and a smoker and she smoked in the hotel room. I do not smoke and do not like smoke at all. So she was not a good match for me regardless.

 

). She had a LOT to drink before we landed in bed. Hubby and I were both sober. She was speaking coherently so not ridiculously drunk but she had enough to drink that she wasn't responding like I think she would or should have in a sober state.

 

I included these quotes because there’s a combination of red flags and non-attraction to the female you two decided to have your first experience with which makes me wonder if this has a big impact on your current state of feelings about swinging and all that it entails.

 

Meeting a woman online and driving 4 hours in the same day just sounds like a recipe for disaster. Online attraction/chemistry is one thing, face-to-face attraction is another. And the meeting and driving sounds like the entire situation was rushed instead of taking the time to think it through. Yes, single females are hard to find but if you really want to continue exploring the FMF (which is what I think you really want) taking the time to meet others in the LS is a good route. Perhaps you will meet a more suitable single female or perhaps get to know another couple that enjoys playing separately. But on a whole, I think the good solid singles (female and male) who are successful in the LS are ones that don’t rush a couple and are desiring to be seen as a person not as a sex toy.

 

Many of the experienced posters here also advise against swinging with anyone who is drunk. Personally, I prefer to swing with others who are sober or those who have had just enough drink to slightly loosen up, if they need to be. Not only do you want to know that everyone is on the same page cogitatively, but consciously willing and wanting to swing. If someone has to be drunk to swing, then to me, it usually signals that they aren’t completely comfortable swinging.

 

Even the experienced swingers on this board, if you read other threads, suggest that a threesome is more difficult emotionally. I just felt that a threesome was still what WE should do because I don't want to be with another guy (see above paragraph about great sex with hubby). My fantasy is hubby with another woman. That's still my fantasy. Until I start WANTING another guy, we felt this was the best path for us. (And also my hubby is not comfortable with the idea, although he has said that he would try if I had that craving...I just do not).

 

The reason why a swap with another couple is easier is because for newbies, it can be a tit-for-tat situation that puts both halves of the couple at ease. Everyone got something. When it’s a threesome, there might be moments when someone is on the side watching. If you’re a newbie and you aren’t sure about swinging/swapping then it’s easier to get trapped into the “What about me?” frame of mind. Or you might focus more on what you’re not getting versus the pleasure and fun that your partner is having. But most of all, I think it can become a division of who gets pleasure (turning the threesome into a him/her) instead of a “we” team pleasure. It’s easier to fall into the pitfall of swinging being a separate fun activity instead of a shared fun activity. I’m not saying that separate swinging fun is bad but I think it takes a lot of experience and different strength in a relationship to achieve success in that sort of play which brings me to…

 

I can't imagine any couples are stronger frankly. Now, me as a person, I certainly have my weaknesses. But as a couple we couldn't be stronger. Whether we swing or not -- will not change the strength of our marriage. As an individual, I have pain that may or may not lessen over time, but our marriage is strong and making judgments about marriages other than your own...not really possible.

 

I’m not sure I understand why you took offense to losAmantes post…all relationships have varying degrees of strength and that level of strength is never the same at all points during the relationship. The strength of a relationship depends on a lot of factors but mainly the parts that make up the relationship—one partner and the other. How they interact with each other, how they behave, think, react, etc. to each other plays a part. If one partner has an internal problem, perhaps an addiction or an illness, it affects the relationship. From that point, how each partner reacts to the situation and the other partner determines whether that specific situation will continue to strengthen or diminish the relationship. Lots of life’s situations affect the relationship, a death in the family, an affair, the purchase of a new home, the marriage of a grown up child, etc. tests that relationship. Not only do the parts make up the relationship but they also have to work together to make it continue to work. This great forum has seen thousands and thousands of couples come through…some of them in great shape and others not as much. We have seen some where it’s clear that both halves of a couple are working hard to maintain their relationship and we have seen others where only one half cares and the other does not.

 

It’s not about whether you swing or not that determines the strength of a relationship, it’s how the couple responds to the stresses that swinging to bring upon it. Will the couple work through the emotions that it can conjure or will the couple bury those feelings and move on without getting to the root of the problem?

 

It takes dedication and commitment to keep a relationship together (as well as maintain a daily workout regimen). Being in a relationship and exercising day in and day out isn’t always happy and pain-free. It’s the rough tides of life as well as the same daily in-and-outs that really determine the strength and resiliency of a relationship.

 

I end my post with two things that I’m sure you’ve come across in the forum:

 

1. Not everyone can or should swing.

2. Sometimes fantasies are best left as fantasies.

[openingthedoor 21]

 

Physical pain? No. Emotional pain? Yes. I think there are a lot of couples that go through some “growing pains” from their first time to possibly their nth time swapping. You’re not alone in having non-blissful feelings the first time. For me, I had to realize that my jealous was really insecurity and possessiveness. I was afraid that I would lose Mr. Sun but I had to remind myself that he comes home with me after every swing event and he comes home to me every night. I had to remind myself that we’re together not because I own him but because he chooses to be with me. The one thing that I am continuing in working on is my own insecurity in my self-worth which happens to wreak havoc on various areas of my life, not just swinging.

 

This was wonderful to hear and exactly what I have been wondering. So THANK YOU for clearing this up for me. I really was wondering whether the pain was normal for swingers and (important) whether that pain was likely to lessen over time, meaning after every new experience I would have less and less pain. We are on the verge of a possible meet tonight or tomorrow night with a couple that claims lady is willing/able to play as long as hubby can watch, so we shall see if that meet happens and then how I feel afterward. I am both terrified (more terrified than before first meet) and totally excited again. So who knows. But I want to have another experience to see whether the pain lessens at all. We have been on a roller coaster of feelings and emotions since our first meet. I have felt closer to him, then further from him, sad at times, closer and more in love at times, etc. But nothing has been too extreme. I just feel like maybe this is a little bit traumatic, which I know isn't a good word, but it is the right word sometimes. Why I would be compelled to repeat something that was somewhat traumatic in some ways is anyone's guess...

 

I am not sure how to quote various excerpts from your post. But thank you for the entire very thoughtful post. You provided so much insight (and your intelligence was sexy! You should like you would be a great match for me.

 

If I feel the same level of pain, or if the pain worsens, then we will probably stop. I have been through a lot of abuse in my life (NOT from current hubby, who has been a Godsend to me). But I may not have what it takes to take this experience beyond fantasy. Problem with leaving it at fantasy is that the fantasy lacks much power for either of us without at least occasionally having reality. So the whole point is that I want us both to have those excited lustful feelings so I hope that I can overcome the part that feels painful to me. I don't think it's even possessiveness or insecurity. Maybe possessiveness, but that's not necessarily a bad thing. It is what it is. I'm not insecure or worried that I will lose him (at all). I know that he loves me and will be with me forever. It's just the pain of losing him for those moments really. Such intimate moments, too. So, you know, I don't know how our sex story will evolve. But I do think that I should have less pain so that is a concern. And I also wasn't terribly afraid before the last meet. But this time, now that I know what I might feel, I am more afraid than excited (last time the other way around). So that's not a good sign. But hopefully it will work out and good will far outweigh bad.

 

And, yes, the whole thing with this woman was a recipe for disaster. LOTS of red flags from the beginning but no one is perfect, or at least that's what we figured. Had I known she was a smoker, I'm sure we would not have went (that was over the top for me). And ditto with the heavy drinking. I rarely drink and not more than 1 or 2 when I do. So just bad...her life was very clearly messed up. Next time we will at least be more selective. And I was also too nervous to really feel much of anything. So I don't know about my tendencies toward bi-sexuality. This is sort of a side issue but I assume that I would have felt something more if I were truly bi-sexual. But then again if I had been attracted to her (which I was not) and more comfortable (which I was not), then maybe I would have experienced more pleasure.

 

Thanks for the explanation on the strengths of a marriage. That makes sense and I agree. I will just say that we have an exceptionally strong marriage in my opinion. I have no fears whatsoever that this will end our marriage either way. My only concern is that my feelings about my husband might change somehow--some for the better (admiring his sexuality in a way that I couldn't before) and some for the worse (although he's a very nice guy, he's also still a guy and I am not the only one he wants sexually).

 

So anyway thanks again for your thoughts. And I will conclude my post by saying:

 

1. Your intelligence is sexy. If we swing, I hope we can meet intelligent thoughtful people like yourself.

[openingthedoor 21]

Well update our swing plans for tonight fell through bc hubby in other couple wasn't interested in just watching (although he said initially that he was; my guess is he thought things would change mid-swing but I kept repeating that was no likely; finally he cancelled bc he wanted to be involved). Actually getting rejected for whatever reason (though with lots of compliments about my pics) just didn't feel good so that created more bad swinging vibes, although of course I understand his feelings. He actually said he was more attracted to me than his GF was to my husband (also a concern that this isn't a married couple; something I didn't know before). But that made me feel badly for my husband. I feel really badly for my husband. I love him. I don't want him to feel rejection, hurt, pain, etc. That sucks. Totally. Almost like I was being rejected. And I don't even want to tell him what she said. So this whole thing has created more bad feelings overall. :(

 

So I guess back to the drawing board for us. Maybe I prefer monogamy anyway. Too many non-positive feelings seem to come from this for me.

[sunbuckus 3,567]

openingthedoor, thank you for the kind words, they are always appreciated but I think I'm the same intelligence of the average bear. (Hey, Boo Boo!)

 

Many couples who are new to swinging will have a lot of learning experiences...and even those who have been in it for years might find themselves in a situation where they learn something new! Even though it sound simple enough, lessons like saying no thank you face-to-face to a couple/single or being selective in playmates can be difficult to master for some couples. It's super easy to see these lessons on the forum but it's another thing to actually experience them and learn from them. Another hard lesson to learn is rejection. Hopefully, a couple would be tactful enough to just say no thank you and not give any specific reasons that might end up hurtful but there will be times when a couple is either rejecting you as a team because there is less of an attraction to either you or the husband. The 4-way attraction between two couples can sometimes be hard to attain for some couples depending on their level of selectivity.

 

As I wrote earlier, some couples can't/shouldn't swing. But I think there have also been some examples throughout the forum where there have been couples that weren't ready to swing, took a long extended period to focus on life and their relationship and then later returned to the swinging lifestyle and realized that they had gained more maturity or life experience to deal with the complexities that swinging can bring upon the relationship. Or, in layman's terms, they acquired more tools in their toolbox to fix the problem. Maybe you two are in the former group or perhaps in the latter. Only you two can determine that.

 

One last thing that I wanted to add...life isn't just about beautiful flowers because those flowers are also accompanied by bothersome insects, rainstorms, sunshine, dirt, worms, thorns, etc. There will always be good feelings along with bad feelings (as well as mediocre feelings). I find that we learn more about ourselves, have an opportunity to grow and expand our mind, and have the chance to strengthen our reserves during trying times that bring on stress, sadness, anger, or any other negative emotion. Try not to be afraid of negative emotions...use them to your advantage and see if you can find a "silver lining" to it.

[36tncouple 19]

Sunbuckus I just wanted to say thank you. You always have such heartfelt advice.

[sunbuckus 3,567]

Sunbuckus I just wanted to say thank you. You always have such heartfelt advice.

 

36tncouple, no...thank you. That's one of the best compliments one can receive on a forum such as this!

[SW_PA_Couple 4,024]

...and even those who have been in it for years might find themselves in a situation where they learn something new!

 

You can say that again.