I saw them playing alone. Should I ask what happened?

[f1fanatic 15]

Need some advice what I should do.

 

My wife Claire and I, have played with another couple, who I will call Tony and Tanya over a year now. During that time we have gotten together probably close to ten times. We all enjoy each others company and get along remarkably well. The sex is fantastic and we always play together, same room. No jealousies, just good clean fun. We decided to take a little trip together, and that's were my dilemma comes in.

 

We stayed together at a timeshare. It was a good time until the second last morning. It was real early in the morning around 5am, and I unexpectedly woke up. Claire was not beside me or in the room, but she was usually an early riser. I thought I heard some noises out in the living room so I thought I might go out and say morning to her. I walked into the hallway to see Claire giving a blowjob to Tony on the living room couch. I was a bit surprised to say the least. I have seen her blow and fuck him many times, and enjoyed watching it, but their encounters was always with me there. Watching this with me not knowing beforehand gave me mixed emotions. A bit of me felt this was like cheating. They were not aware I was there as I was still mostly looking around the corner.

 

What made me even more unsettled was seeing some of Claire's actions. I could hear her do some dirty talk, saying to him how much she loved his cock, having it in her pussy, etc. In all the times together, I have not heard her do dirty talk to him. I guess she must have felt less inhibited with the spouses not around. Not sure. The final thing that has gotten me thinking was his climax. I could hear him say to Claire he was going to cum. Usually that would be her cue to take it out of her mouth and let him finish on her tits. She has never liked the taste or texture of cum in her mouth. In all the years we have been married ( over 10 years), I have finished in her mouth probably less than 5 times. Those times if I recall was on special occasions and took lots of pleading, lol. Well, after he told her he was going to blow, she just kept sucking. He blew his load in her mouth and she squeezed and swallowed every last drop. I have to to admit to some jealousy seeing this.

 

I went back to the room and waited for her to come back. I wasn't sure how I would react when she came back. She came back about 5 minutes later. She was a little surprised I was awake, but I asked her where she went. She said she was out doing some stretching when Tony came out. They started chatting and then she admitted one thing led to another and then they had oral sex. I guess I missed the part when he ate her out. She asked if I was upset since I wasn't there, but she said she didn't mean for it to happen and that she thought I was asleep at the time. I told her it was ok, as long as she enjoyed it. But that's not entirely true, i am still trying to process everything.

 

The four of us played again that night. The sex with Tanya was great, but the whole incident that morning was still in the back of my mind.

 

So the question is whether I should confront Claire with what I saw and heard or just let it be? On one hand, I want to know she has to say, but I don't what this to blowup over something that might be insignificant and ruin our relationship with our playmates. We have had a great time so far, and it is hard finding a couple so compatible. Tanya is hot as hell, and I will be disappointed if wont be able to play with her again. Tony is a good guy too, and we have hung out together over beers.

[wetpanties 5]

"Confront" Claire is probably the wrong word. I think you and Claire need to discuss this issue privately before this dilemma become a major problem. In your words, the sex was fantastic and there were no jealousies, just good clean fun. The four of you were all together at a timeshare and for the first time your were in separate rooms. Comfort levels were relaxed for all four of you. It's easy to see how this situation could happen. It could easily have been you getting a blow job while Claire and Tony were sleeping. You and Claire should be able to discuss this privately and possibly set some new ground rules that would fit into everyone's comfort levels. The four of you have obviously been having a good time exploring new things together or you all wouldn't have been staying at the timeshare together. You need to explain your feelings to Claire - privately and calmly.

[asncpl 728]

I completely agree with wetpanties. It's something you need to discuss with your wife and lay out some boundaries. Not everyone is comfortable with separate room play. It's also an issue of trust, and it sounds like you and your wife are not quite there yet. It took me a while to like the idea and try it. And we actually engage in some "cheating" fantasy with our playmates. It's important for you to sound this out with her without being accusatory.

[Lionheart72 2,189]

But thats not entirely true, i am still trying to process everything.

 

That. Tell her that.

 

The key to successful swinging, to success in relationships in general IMO, is open, honest communication. Be honest. Tell her what you just told us. Don't be confrontational, or aggressive or angry because it doesn't sound like you are. Just be honest about what you think and what you feel.

[JandKinBoise 856]

I think it will be fairly easy to process the sex behind your back. As mentioned, it could have easily happened to you. I think the bigger issue is the swallowing cum and to a lesser extent the dirty talk. As for dirty talk, it's probably difficult to voice this stuff during group sex, and may be difficult for her to do it with you for some reason. She may also really love his cock. J isn't very vocal when fucking but a couple weeks ago she moaned to the guy she was fucking how much she loves his cock. I had never heard her say this to anyone but me. I have to admit, this guy has a beautiful cock. As soon as I saw it I thought, "J is going to love that".

 

As for swallowing, well I have an unfortunately large sample plan to use for advise here. Concerning taste, I barely taste it. I do feel it. There is a huge variance in the level of, how does one put it...viscosity? You may have a consistency she finds unappealing. His may be thinner, sweeter, smaller load, whatever. It has nothing to do with her drifting toward him and away from you. These were just circumstances that came together to form an issue that really isn't anywhere but in your head. I hope you can get over it. It seems like you have something that so many strive for. It would be terrible to throw it away.

 

If there was a problem forming, she probably wouldn't have told you about the oral sex incident at all.

[GoldCoCouple 4,063]

I agree with JandK above. If she wouldn't have told you about the incident, then I would be much more concerned. Still, it sounds like you two need to talk and reset some ground rules. The three most important things in swinging (IMHO) have always been: Communication, communication, and bacon (just seeing if you were paying attention). I think everything will be okay and that there's nothing to worry about, but do talk...

[Gordo 618]

Although you didn't mention whether the dirty talk goes on when you two are having sex I'm assuming that you're singling it out because it is unusual behaviour. That along with the swallowing of cum act that she doesn't do for you gives me the feeling that she is trying to impress him somehow.

 

I would definitely want to talk about it and wouldn't let her blow it off. It's fundamentally disturbing at some lever when your spouse starts doing new things with a lover they don't do with you. Especially if they have rejected it multiple times in the past.

 

She may be wanting to or is connecting with him on a deeper level and that can be a real problem.

[81lizard69 470]

Your ego bot bruised.. Its happened to me. One time we were with a couple at a house party and we usaully only ever play together but that time she went to a room with out me and I walked in on her.. she was on her back folded in half with a huge man pounding away on her. She was talking dirty and getting the ride of her life.

 

She would never let me fold her in half.. but she let this guy do it and she was saying things to him she usually only said to me.. I was hurt. We do have permission to play separate at a party but had never really done it till then. I talked to her about it. I never ever comfort her on this stuff we communicate by saying what we want to and ask to hear what the other heard and then we clarify what we were trying to communicate.. I said to her that She never lets me lake love to her like that and why did she let him.. she said that after we started playing with men that had larger cocks she was stretched out and could now take it like that. After the kids I had become rather gentile in our love making and never really turned up the energy level after wards. The swinging was awakening her sexuality and she was free to explore what she liked with out me deciding on what she liked. She is giving you a gift. Most women would never swing.. much less like what your wife and my wife does. There will come times when your tolerance level will be stretched thin. Communication is key..and actually knowing what you are feeling is important.

 

Like my dad always said to me. Dont turn gold into shit. Think twice and ask before you say something you might regret. Sounding off here before you make a judgement is a good thing. Judgement always seem to have something to do with my ego.. But thats just me.. I am sure you will be ok with this in the long run. if your wife is like mine she will turn that new found sexual confidence to good use.

[pballer 15]

This sort of thing happened to my wife and I, and a swinger friend. She never wanted sex during her period. Ever. Any kind, even giving oral to me.

 

We can play apart, and we are both OK with it. I was out of town one weekend while she was menstruating. After I got off work I called her on the phone. No answer. I tried several times over an hour or so. No answer. I got worried, but waited for her to get my messages.

 

When she did call she apologized and said she didn't hear the phone ring. She had it turned down because she was giving this man head, and it lasted almost an hour. Then they say and talked for a few more. I was livid. She never does that with me during that time of the month, why would she with him?

 

She explained that her FWBs are like boyfriends to her. They are special. She treats them like they are dating and everything is new to her with them. We've been married 35 years, and as much as we love each other, it's just different with them.

 

That was a lesson I had to learn. So I learned it. She may do stuff with other guys that she won't do with you. And you may find yourself doing things with your friends that you don't normally do with her. But isn't that why we swing? To enhance, add to, and to improve our sex lives? There was/is nothing wrong with our sex, but swinging does enhance it tremendously. Let it.

 

And just to add, if you are sharing a room/cabin/whatever with another couple, isn't it normal to expect sex to happen at any given time? Between any given partner? I know it is for us.

[f1fanatic 15]

[

I think it will be fairly easy to process the sex behind your back. As mentioned, it could have easily happened to you. I think the bigger issue is the swallowing cum and to a lesser extent the dirty talk.

 

After more thinking, I think this is exactly what is bothering me. I could let slide her not telling me beforehand since she thought I was asleep and she didnt want to wake me up to ask me or possibly even join in. What is bothering me most was seeing her take his load in her mouth and looking pretty eager doing it. What confuses me is I don't think it is an issue that its me that she doesnt want to do it with me. Ever since the beginning of our relationship she has said its not something she likes to do and has mentioned she didnt like her past partners before me to do it either. Even now, one of our ground rules for potential play mates is no cumming in mouth. So seeing her sucking it up like a freezie on a hot summer day is confusing.

 

The dirty talk was a bit surprising. We do dirty talk ourselves, just I have never heard her do the talk with other guys. I chalk this one up to her feeling bolder since she is alone with Tony, something that has never happened before. I still would like to hear what she has to say about it though.

 

Thanks everybody for the advice. Going to remember to do this calmly. I am going to sit down with her when we get a chance and let her know what I saw. We will talk and hopefully she will have a logical explanation for everything.

[funcoupledayton 2,708]

Thanks everybody for the advice. Going to remember to do this calmly. I am going to sit down with her when we get a chance and let her know what I saw. We will talk and hopefully she will have a logical explanation for everything.

 

I think you've gotten great advice so far. I was just going through and liking what I agreed with and didn't plan to post until I was this last line.

 

Not everything has a logical explanation, so I wouldn't expect one. Sometimes things happen in the moment and you get carried away. There's no logic to it. Things were particularly hot, he says, "I'm going to come," she just goes with it.

 

I've swallowed many other guys' come, but not my husband's. I don't have a good or logical explanation for why I did that first time. It was a hot situation and it happened. If he told me it was really important to him to come in my mouth, I would try. If he told me it really bothered him that I did with others, I would reassure him and if he was still uncomfortable I would stop.

 

I think it's important to tell your wife your feelings, but don't expect her to justify herself or give an explanation. Just expect her to hear you and reassure you.

[Lionheart72 2,189]

I am going to sit down with her when we get a chance and let her know what I saw. We will talk and hopefully she will have a logical explanation for everything.

 

Define "logical explanation?" What exactly is it you are looking for? I ask, because I think figuring that out might help get you to the emotional core of your issue.

[f1fanatic 15]

Define "logical explanation?" What exactly is it you are looking for? I ask, because I think figuring that out might help get you to the emotional core of your issue.

 

Maybe I shouldn't have called it logical, but more along the lines of the answer fitting of what I know about her. She is a pleaser and hates letting people down. She gets along well with Tony and I can see her doing it and trying not to disappoint him if he had wanted to do it bad enough. Whereas it would be less believable if she said she just wanted to swallow it, knowing how she has felt about swallowing in the past.

[SoFlaCouple 188]

The dirty talk was a bit surprising. We do dirty talk ourselves, just I have never heard her do the talk with other guys. I chalk this one up to her feeling bolder since she is alone with Tony, something that has never happened before.

 

As long as it's something she does with you and you don't have a rule against it, I think you may have hit this one on the head. With time this one will probably bother you less.

 

I felt for you when I read your story, because I can see how easy something like that could happen, and I would probably feel exactly the way you do. I too would be bothered by her swallowing (although some good points on why are made by other posters).

 

Lots of good advice in this thread. Figure out the real root of your feelings, then communicate them in a very non-judgmental way. But don't expect a great, good, or even ok response. Things sometimes just happen in the lifestyle. You may not be thrilled with the answer. But talk it through, maybe refine some rules one way or the other, chalk it up to experience, then give your wife a huge hug, a kiss, and if time allows some great sex. ;-)

 

I also agree that her readily telling you what happened is a REALLY good sign.

[ViSexual 1,008]

She may be having to process it too. If it were me, I'd let my wife have time to process it unless she wanted to discuss it. Now I might bring up the idea of 'separate room' with her to get her feelings. And, if she seems to want to add this to the activity list, I'd try to consider it without thinking about what I'd seen.

[f1fanatic 15]

Well, I had a talk with Claire yesterday about me seeing the incident. She was surprised when I told her, but she was happy that I wasn't angry. All in all, i think it went rather well. I felt much better after the talk and it helped clear out some things. What she said:

 

Playing with Tony separately- As she had already mentioned briefly already, she said things happened quickly and got caught up in the moment. She thought I was still asleep and stopping everything to come wake me up was not the first thing on her mind. She apologized and said she will always tell me beforehand if there was next time. Told her I understood and that would be end of story.

 

Dirty talk with him- It turns out they had a bit of a chat before they started getting busy. One of the things Tony mentioned was he liked it when Claire acted flirty/slutty. Usually, Claire is usually fairly conservative dressing, minimal make-up lady. He mentioned there was this one night we went out that drove him crazy with how she acted. Kinda like the wild librarian lady. When Claire mentioned this, I remembered exactly which night he was referring to. The four of us went to a party together. Claire wore this tight cleavage showing short black dress. I remembered she was flirty with him after a few drinks. When we got back to the hotel room after the party, he couldn't get enough of her. I remember them fucking several times the whole night. So Claire said she was doing the dirty talk because of what he had just said and wanting to drive him crazy. She had also mentioned she was less self conscious doing it when he was alone. She was not sure if she could do it if Tanya was there listening. That made sense to me. I told her I was just surprised since I never heard her say it to other guys before.

 

And to the one that bugged me the most- Her swallowing his cum- Turns out this was a result of their chat too. She had asked him how he felt about seeing Tanya sometimes letting me finish in her mouth but Tony not being able to do it in Claire's. He admitted that sometimes he thought about asking her not to do it, but ultimately he decided that if that was something she wanted to do with me, then she should not have to stop just because he couldnt do it with Claire. He told her he is fine now, since her blowjobs were fantastic anyways. Well, Claire said she felt a bit bad for him and decided to do it at least once for him. I asked her how it was. She said it was ok, but probably not something she wants to do all the time and she told him that. He laughed and said once was more than he ever thought was gonna happen. I understood what she was saying in that she was just trying to make it 'fair' for everybody and it made me feel better hearing it.

 

I was glad we had this talk but it also brought up a few questions too. She had mentioned she felt more at ease playing with him alone than when we were all together and Tony mentioned the same thing to her. Claire asked me what I thought of playing in separate rooms. I have mixed feelings. On one hand, I like watching Claire fuck but the thought of some private playing time with Tanya is appealing too. But then I might be wondering what Claire is doing at the same time. What are your experiences playing together vs separate?

 

Another thing they talked about ( seems like they talked a lot in their chat) was going bareback. Tony asked Claire what she thought about it. I'm kinda sitting on the fence with this one. Sometimes I do have trouble finishing with one on so it would be nice without the condom. They are the only couple we play with now, however, they do play with another couple bareback. Seems with this one, we decide yes we want to go without and then 2 seconds later have second thoughts again. Do couples usually play bareback once they get to know them well?

[Lionheart72 2,189]

Sounds to me like both you and Claire, and Claire and Tony, had some great conversations. Bravo. Well done you and, especially, well done Claire. I think she definitely deserves a nod. Let's remember to include Tanya in the great conversation loop (not that you necessarily haven't, but I haven't seen you mention her in that context). Keep up the good communication.

 

What are your experiences playing together vs separate?

 

I have played separately with another lady on a couple of occasions, because my wife is very comfortable with the idea. I find it to be a good sexual experience... it's nice to be able to devote my full attention to my partner. I enjoy an audience from time to time, but sometimes it can be distracting. Playing along allows for more personal contact, more focus on the partner and, as I think Claire and Tony's experience illustrates, better communication with that one partner.

 

I haven't really quite worked up the nerve to let my wife play separately with another guy. I acknowledge it's an insecurity on my part. However, it's an idea I'm warming up to.

 

Do couples usually play bareback once they get to know them well?

 

Speaking strictly for myself and my wife, it's not something we would ever be comfortable with. Disease and pregnancy are always concerns no matter how careful you are or how close you are with your play partners. The extra layer of protection is just good sense, IMO.

[asncpl 728]

Good for you and Claire! Great to hear you were able to work it out. As for bareback play, my husband and i do play bareback with couples once we know them, but we are in the minority. It's something we decided to do after a lot of discussion and we fully understand the risks, as well as the rewards. I am on the pill, and we have been very selective with our bareback partners that we do not have any issues with STDs (knock on wood). You and Claire need to run through the risks. It's not an easy decision, because it can have long-term consequences. In addition to STDs, cumming inside someone is also a lot more intimate, so is this something you or Claire are ready to try? On the reward side, it's really hot for me to have someone cum inside me, and my husband also has trouble reaching orgasm with a condom.

 

Is Claire on birth control? Do you know if Tony and Tanya get tested for std regularly? It's a cliche, but if you are going bareback even with just Tony and Tanya, you are going bareback with all their partners and their partners.

[f1fanatic 15]

It's not an easy decision, because it can have long-term consequences. In addition to STDs, cumming inside someone is also a lot more intimate, so is this something you or Claire are ready to try? On the reward side, it's really hot for me to have someone cum inside me, and my husband also has trouble reaching orgasm with a condom.

 

Is Claire on birth control? Do you know if Tony and Tanya get tested for std regularly? It's a cliche, but if you are going bareback even with just Tony and Tanya, you are going bareback with all their partners and their partners.

 

This is something that we both want. Claire also likes the feeling of the guy cumming inside her, and of course feels much nicer for me without the rubber. Its also a buzz killer putting and taking a condom off off when we switch partners during our sessions. We like to switch around with our partners, but having to put on/take off certainly reduces the amount of partner swapping we would otherwise do now.

 

Claire decided to still stay on the pill now even though I had a vasectomy a few months ago. We didnt think a condom by itself is good enough protection from pregnancy when we do go swapping. Pregnancy is not really our concern, just the risk of STD if we go bareback. Tony and Tanya get tested every 6 months now, and I suppose everybody can get tested more frequently if we decide to go bareback, but still, a lot can happen in between tests. I suppose the best case scenario is we decide to be exclusive and get tested, but they have another couple they play with regularly too and we are not about to tell them to stop with that.

[Guest]

Maybe she is reaching a point where she is crossing over, leaving some old inhibitions behind, becoming more sexual. In reality, isn't that what you want. Wouldn't you like her to get to the place where swallowing and more verbalization is the norm, not the exception. I would encourage it. Bring up the idea of more separate room sex or other scenarios where she is exploring her own personal boundaries with your support but without your presence. Once she is confident that it is ok with people who don't really matter to her, she will be more comfortable in showing you her new level of sexual enjoyment.

[Gordo 618]

Well I'm going to go against the flow here. I have a gut feeling about this that says problem. There is an underlying pattern in your posts. Simply:Tony asks...Tony gets

 

Tony asks and gets sex while no one is around, Tony asks for dirty talk and gets, Tony asks for blowjob and not only gets it but something you've never gotten, Tony asks for separate rooms and she's going along, Tony asks for bareback and she's going along. Frankly I'm not buying the swallowing excuse from a woman who has been so dead set against it. Just going along doesn't begin to cover it.

 

My wife had a partner she really liked. What I started to notice was a whole lot of little things that I didn't like. There was nothing specific to begin with it was just a small series of acts that would make you go hmmmm at the time and get forgotten. But once the weight of them started to gather I realized she had gotten far too close to him and a problem was developing. To her credit once I sat down with her and pointed it out she realized herself she was getting too close emotionally and immediately broke it off.

 

I hope that you are not blinded by your lust for T.O.W so much you're missing clues but frankly I would stop and give this situation & people some serious thought before continuing.

 

At the very least I would start by re-uniting with your wife shortly after the sex and do the cuddling and talking with her yourself. Let Tony have his chats with his own wife.

[Gordo 618]

One further thought I must have missed the part in your post where you finished the conversation with wifey and she immediately took you by the hand and dragged you to the bedroom and gave you the blowjob of your life including squeezing out every last drop and swallowing....no? I thought not! Hmmmmm

 

gives me the feeling that she is trying to impress him somehow.

 

Secondly obviously Tony gets to finish in his own wife's mouth so why would this be so important he has to have it. More to the point if he gets that as a normal experience then I see your wife upping the ante by swallowing it and trying to outperform his wife. That is competition and why would she feel she needs to out compete his wife? Hmmmm

[SoFlaCouple 188]

My wife Claire and I, have played with another couple, who I will call Tony and Tanya over a year now. During that time we have gotten together probably close to ten times. ... We decided to take a little trip together, and thats were my dilemma comes in. ...We stayed together at a timeshare.

 

Following up on Gordo's thoughts...

 

My wife and I toyed with the idea of vacationing with some friends, and after reading your post, decided against it. In short, we are in this for us, to enhance our relationship with each other. We are not looking for a poly relationship. Staying together on a trip is just begging for something to happen, especially with a couple with whom you are very comfortable.

 

Never forget that we are all playing with fire, and as humans we can't always control our emotions. I applaud Gordo's wife for recognizing this and taking a step back.

 

Not saying Gordo is right, bit it is certainly a conversation you both should have with eyes and hearts wide open.

[f1fanatic 15]

Well I'm going to go against the flow here. I have a gut feeling about this that says problem. There is an underlying pattern in your posts. Simply:Tony asks...Tony gets

 

Tony asks and gets sex while no one is around, Tony asks for dirty talk and gets, Tony asks for blowjob and not only gets it but something you've never gotten, Tony asks for separate rooms and she's going along, Tony asks for bareback and she's going along. Frankly I'm not buying the swallowing excuse from a woman who has been so dead set against it. Just going along doesn't begin to cover it.

 

At the very least I would start by re-uniting with your wife shortly after the sex and do the cuddling and talking with her yourself. Let Tony have his chats with his own wife.

 

I wouldnt say what Tony wants, Tony gets. He never asked Claire to swallow as far as I know. Claire asked him how he felt seeing me cum in Tanya's mouth and he responded with his feelings about it. Unless his plan all along was using reverse psychology, I wouldn't say he asked for it. Also I know he and Tanya are very much into anal sex. In our initial conversations, we said Claire was not into anal sex. He has never once asked about it again with Claire.

 

Having said that, I understand your point. Maybe the trip together was not the best idea, although that was something mostly Tanya and I planned out. I will keep in my mind if there are any more warning signs and maybe limit all the social time, but frankly so far I don't see much that raises concern.

[f1fanatic 15]

Just got an email from Tanya. We were planning are next playdate together but she also mentioned that Tony had told her something from our trip that she wishes to discuss with me. My suspicion is that he told her about his session with Claire. I am not sure whether they have played separately before, so this might be an issue for her. Will find out when I call her tomorrow

[R & K 18]

I'm very new but I'm wondering about why all this communication is happening only two on two? Sounds like Tony and Claire just happened on vacation but if Tanya now has something to say about Claire and Tony's play, then I wonder why it would be you she wanted to talk to, not Claire? Or at the very least you and Claire? In my opinion, couples communication should be kept to the actual couple but rules and other such topics should be discussed by all four together.

[LaceySterling 19]

I have found over the years that if you let the uncomfortable feelings you are experiencing will build be feeding into the jealousy beast. I have seen my partner talk and enjoy some things that he doesn't necessarily do to me but does to other play partners, but I realize that sometimes she brings out some passionate emotions that I reap the rewards for later. We have also had to stop playing with one girl because she became to possessive of him and I got a bit jealous (another whole story for another time)

 

Two specific things you mention I would like to address:

 

1. Swallowing cum. I am not a HUGE fan of it myself and can count on one hand how many times I have swallowed my partners...but there is one particular play pal that I thrive and get excited to swallow...part of it is the taste, the other is the delivery. Since it was your wife's first time swallowing with this guy it may be she was curious and you know when your all worked up things happen.

 

2. Confrontation. I would not use such a harsh word, perhaps "discuss" things and surely you need to! You do not have to get into all the details...but let her know that you did happen to see the two of them and together and then address the boundaries that you have had in the past with the same room practice. Let her know you do love her and trust her but you are confused and want to make sure you both stay on the same page.

 

A few thoughts you will want to get straight before talking with her: Did you get jealous? Did you get turned on? Are you willing to adjust the "same room rules"?

 

The two of you truly just need to sit down and hash this out before it festers and leaks into other area's within your lives.

 

Best of luck.

[f1fanatic 15]

Long post, but here goes.

 

Well, I called them yesterday. Tony answered and said he needed to say something. He told me one morning, him and Claire played. He was very apologetic. He was really sorry that he might have gone behind my back and felt bad about it. He admitted hormones got the better of him. We were planning to play the night before, but Tanya was not feeling well so everybody just retired early. He said came out of the bedroom that morning, and saw Claire doing yoga. She was braless, in a tank top and yoga pants. He said he was already horny but as soon as he saw her, it went ballistic. He admitted to flirting with her and some sex talk to see if she might be in the mood. So it turned out she was. He also said he told Tanya about this after and she told him he has to tell me about it. Good gal, that Tanya. He was very sorry that he might have ruined a good thing with us.

 

I told him that I already knew since I saw some of it. He was surprised and ask if I was angry. Told him I was surprised but have talked to Claire and accepted it. Also told him I was actually more upset about what happened during their play. He wasnt sure what I meant. I said I saw that he finished in Claire's mouth and she swallowed. He said he wasnt sure why I was angry since Tanya usually swallows when she gives me a BJ. He understood when I told him, Claire almost never finiishes me in her mouth and to see her do it so enthusiatically with him was upsetting. He agreed and said he was surprised too and he gave her notice and asked again if she was sure before he came. I heard him tell her, although I didnt hear him ask if she was sure, although I might have missed it. Anyway, I told him I talked to Claire about it already, and things are OK. Told him I really appreciated him telling me directly. He thanked me and hoped this doesnt change things. He left since he had to take his son to baseball and so I talked to Tanya.

 

Turns out she was OK with him playing with Claire since they have played separately before. She then asked me what I thought of playing separately. I told her Claire thought it was a positive experience and apparently Tony did also. She asked me if I want to try it. I told her, Claire and I have discussed it and she left it up to me. I told her I think I would enjoy the private time with her, just not sure how I would feel when I hear Claire's moans from the other room. I asked how she felt about it. She just said she wanted it for awhile now, just havent asked. That kinda made me happy. I told her we can try next time and see what happens. But I also told her I still want lots of time together since I love watching her and Claire play together. She just laughed and said dont worry, there is no way she is going to give up playing with Claire.

 

She also said Tony brought up the subject of playing bareback and asked what we thought of it. Told her we are a bit unsure, mostly because they also play bareback with another couple. Truth is, I want to go bareback but Claire is hesitant because of the other couple but I wanted to have an united front. She said she understood, but the other couple is moving away by the end of the year and may not be a play couple with them after that. So I told her we will think about this again later.

 

We chatted some more. Interestingly, playing separately was more Tanya's idea and bareback was more Tony's idea.

[cplnuswing 4,712]

The lifestyle has taught me many things, but one thing I have learned is there are very few problems in life that can't be worked through if there is just good communication between all parties involved. That doesn't always happen for lots of reasons, and I won't lie and say my track record is perfect either, but when you have that communication, things just seem to fall into place organically and everyone goes away satisfied that an answer was found. May have not been the exact same answer they went into it thinking was the answer, but it's one they see as a good one, and so does everyone else.

 

Thanks for the followup, and good for all of you for approaching things in an adult and open manner to get them back on the right track.

[sleepy1951 18]

She may be having to process it too. If it were me, I'd let my wife have time to process it unless she wanted to discuss it. Now I might bring up the idea of 'separate room' with her to get her feelings. And, if she seems to want to add this to the activity list, I'd try to consider it without thinking about what I'd seen.

 

I have to agree with all the above advice.I think the big picture here is you have been hurt. I don't think your wife did anything wrong, it was just the moment. Talk to her calmly and things should be ok. After all the shoe could be on the other foot.

[couplers 4,568]

Thank you for sharing all of this; I am impressed with your thoughtfulness and your communication skills. My two cents worth - both hubby and I do things with other member of the poly group and the other married couple we swing with that we don't do with each other, or do in a different way. Whether it's dirty talk or swallowing, (or in my case doing anal) or preferring one position over another, is the reason that we have sex with others - for variety. As to the other issues: we don't swing casually in order that we can go bareback; we play alone sometimes because, although it is fun watching, alone can be liberating. Best of luck and keep us posted.

 

 

P.S. As I think about it, I wish hubby or Red would do something with our Clair or Lora that would get me a little jealous... I miss that burn that used to come.

[FlirtyGirl 20]

I really like and appreciate this thread because it has tackled and been able to create some interesting thoughts as to what I should and expect from the lifestyle. I can understand and side with all points and observations made within this post and can see and understand how all this and all the facets of the experience are involved. I believe that in open honesty and the ability for couples to communicate and put their own emotions and needs aside to completely understand the viewpoint of the other parties involved is essential to a successful swinging relationship. Please keep us updated as to where and what is going on with this situation. My goal is to find a couple like this to play with on a regular basis and how to navigate the in's and out's of the whole process. On a secondary note I guess all individual situations are just that...individualized. It is all in what you are comfortable and finding where your personal boundaries lie....you never know they might be further out than you thought.....It is all in finding comfort in an otherwise socially uncomfortable situation with the people you love closest to you at your side.

[f1fanatic 15]

Just an update. We played in separate rooms for the first time this past weekend. All in all, a great experience. I felt more focused on Tanya and enjoying the time with less distractions. There were moments where I thought what Claire would be doing as I could hear she was having a good time, but I have to admit it was fleeting moments and my mind drifted to other things....

 

Interestingly, it seemed to me Tanya was also a bit more aggressive and talkative, similar to how Claire was when she was alone with Tony. Maybe everybody is less restrained when the other spouses aren't around. I asked Claire afterwards how she liked it, and she said she likes it equally, so we will probably make playing separately a regular thing.

 

Claire did mention that her and Tony did more snuggling and kissing than they normally do. Would this be a concern? We don't have a no kissing rule, so this isnt a new thing. Just that when we played together, they didnt spend that much time kissing. But Claire mentioned they made out for a while this time before they had sex.

[couplers 4,568]

... We played in separate rooms for the first time this past weekend. All in all, a great experience. ...Claire did mention that her and Tony did more snuggling and kissing than they normally do. Would this be a concern? ... Claire mentioned they made out for a while this time before they had sex.

 

Thanks for the update, it good to know all went well. Same room, separate room, alone play - they all have their own dynamics and we enjoy them all, even mix it up. We may start by playing alone then play together when another arrives. The major reason we will have sex separately is because of scheduling. If two people want to play and their schedules allow it, then seize the opportunity.

 

You're worried that the snuggling and kissing may be signs of emotional attachment; hubby explained it well to me early on why he isn't jealous of my boyfriend. He said that it was healthy and respectful that another man I chose to have sex with treated me well, and was there to take care of me. Think of it if it were the opposite situation - it wouldn't make you feel good if another man your wife was having sex with treated her like dirt and didn't care what happened to her. Besides, we have emotional attachments to parents, siblings, vanilla friends, children, and they don't diminish our love for our spouse. So to me, there is nothing wrong with cuddling and kissing to go along with the copulating.

 

One final thought. My husband has always been good about letting me decide whether to discuss any particular sexual encounter, whether he was there or not. If I want to talk, fine; if I don't want to talk about it, that's fine as well. Not because there is anything to hide, and it doesn't matter whether any specific escapade was wonderful or not so great, just sometimes I want to talk and sometimes not. Hubby's just sensitive to my moods that way and it's another reason I love him madly, madly.

[Lionheart72 2,189]

Claire did mention that her and Tony did more snuggling and kissing than they normally do. Would this be a concern? We don't have a no kissing rule, so this isnt a new thing. Just that when we played together, they didnt spend that much time kissing. But Claire mentioned they made out for a while this time before they had sex.

 

I don't have a lot of experience with separate room play. It's a relatively new thing for me as well, but in this my experience is similar. When it's me and a lady, alone in a room, we do tend toward more making out before and snuggling after. I think, for me at least, it's a matter of not having an "audience" and not having the impulse to rush back to your primary partner.

[10thBadger 25]

On 6/9/2014 at 9:18 PM, pballer said:

This sort of thing happened to my wife and I, and a swinger friend. She never wanted sex during her period. Ever. Any kind, even giving oral to me.

 

We can play apart, and we are both OK with it. I was out of town one weekend while she was menstruating. After I got off work I called her on the phone. No answer. I tried several times over an hour or so. No answer. I got worried, but waited for her to get my messages.

 

When she did call she apologized and said she didn't hear the phone ring. She had it turned down because she was giving this man head, and it lasted almost an hour. Then they say and talked for a few more. I was livid. She never does that with me during that time of the month, why would she with him?

 

She explained that her FWBs are like boyfriends to her. They are special. She treats them like they are dating and everything is new to her with them. We've been married 35 years, and as much as we love each other, it's just different with them.

 

That was a lesson I had to learn. So I learned it. She may do stuff with other guys that she won't do with you. And you may find yourself doing things with your friends that you don't normally do with her. But isn't that why we swing? To enhance, add to, and to improve our sex lives? There was/is nothing wrong with our sex, but swinging does enhance it tremendously. Let it.

 

And just to add, if you are sharing a room/cabin/whatever with another couple, isn't it normal to expect sex to happen at any given time? Between any given partner? I know it is for us.

I am sorry brother, if my wife would’ve said that her boyfriends are more special than you are being her husband. We wouldn’t had a discussion, they would have been a serious argument and probably telling her to pack her bags and go live with that fool. There would be no way I could except that. Absolutely positively never could have excepted her saying that to me. Even my wife right now is shaking her head while we are reading your post and she is saying what the hell!!

[10thBadger 25]

On 6/11/2014 at 11:05 PM, f1fanatic said:

Well, I had a talk with Claire yesterday about me seeing the incident. She was surprised when I told her, but she was happy that I wasn't angry. All in all, i think it went rather well. I felt much better after the talk and it helped clear out some things. What she said:

 

Playing with Tony separately- As she had already mentioned briefly already, she said things happened quickly and got caught up in the moment. She thought I was still asleep and stopping everything to come wake me up was not the first thing on her mind. She apologized and said she will always tell me beforehand if there was next time. Told her I understood and that would be end of story.

 

Dirty talk with him- It turns out they had a bit of a chat before they started getting busy. One of the things Tony mentioned was he liked it when Claire acted flirty/slutty. Usually, Claire is usually fairly conservative dressing, minimal make-up lady. He mentioned there was this one night we went out that drove him crazy with how she acted. Kinda like the wild librarian lady. When Claire mentioned this, I remembered exactly which night he was referring to. The four of us went to a party together. Claire wore this tight cleavage showing short black dress. I remembered she was flirty with him after a few drinks. When we got back to the hotel room after the party, he couldn't get enough of her. I remember them fucking several times the whole night. So Claire said she was doing the dirty talk because of what he had just said and wanting to drive him crazy. She had also mentioned she was less self conscious doing it when he was alone. She was not sure if she could do it if Tanya was there listening. That made sense to me. I told her I was just surprised since I never heard her say it to other guys before.

 

And to the one that bugged me the most- Her swallowing his cum- Turns out this was a result of their chat too. She had asked him how he felt about seeing Tanya sometimes letting me finish in her mouth but Tony not being able to do it in Claire's. He admitted that sometimes he thought about asking her not to do it, but ultimately he decided that if that was something she wanted to do with me, then she should not have to stop just because he couldnt do it with Claire. He told her he is fine now, since her blowjobs were fantastic anyways. Well, Claire said she felt a bit bad for him and decided to do it at least once for him. I asked her how it was. She said it was ok, but probably not something she wants to do all the time and she told him that. He laughed and said once was more than he ever thought was gonna happen. I understood what she was saying in that she was just trying to make it 'fair' for everybody and it made me feel better hearing it.

 

I was glad we had this talk but it also brought up a few questions too. She had mentioned she felt more at ease playing with him alone than when we were all together and Tony mentioned the same thing to her. Claire asked me what I thought of playing in separate rooms. I have mixed feelings. On one hand, I like watching Claire fuck but the thought of some private playing time with Tanya is appealing too. But then I might be wondering what Claire is doing at the same time. What are your experiences playing together vs separate?

 

Another thing they talked about ( seems like they talked a lot in their chat) was going bareback. Tony asked Claire what she thought about it. I'm kinda sitting on the fence with this one. Sometimes I do have trouble finishing with one on so it would be nice without the condom. They are the only couple we play with now, however, they do play with another couple bareback. Seems with this one, we decide yes we want to go without and then 2 seconds later have second thoughts again. Do couples usually play bareback once they get to know them well?

Dude, if you haven’t figured it out yet. Your wife is catering to all of his needs. But she’s not catering to any of your needs. She’s willing to bend over backwards and twist herself into a pretzel to make sure that her FWB is satisfied. I don’t even know what to say to that other than you need to put your foot down and try to figure out why she is so focused on making this dude happy but not making you happy by doing the same damn things that she is doing for him. 

 

I was so shocked reading your post, he told her what to wear, he told her to talk dirty, and he told her to swallow his cum. And she went out of her way to make sure that happened to please him. But when you asked her to do the same things, she did not want to do it. You are a very patient man, because I would never be that patient because she would be out the door right now. If she can figure it out later, why she was so hesitant with you and more excited with the FWB. If you can get the same respect that the FWB is getting, you are being cheated out of something that you should get before everybody else should even be considered.

[Billygoat 443]

It appears that most everyone agrees and applauds the great amount of communication this couple used to talk out the concerns at hand.

 

well except for one.

 

growth and expansion in the lifestyle is highly normal.  The more you play with the same person or couple the more exploring, new doors open.  It all works as long as there is open and honest communication.  Not denial and trickle truth.  Nothing was hidden here.  All have come to a mutual agreement and new horizons are being explored.

 

everyone has preferences, likes dislikes, skills and talents.  The lifestyle is not a game of tit for tat.  For those that try to enforce that….or look for tight controls….be controlling…restrictive usually do not have good experiences…..nor last long in the lifestyle.

 

for the two couples in question they addressed and handled this very well.  Discussing amongst themselves and then with each other.

 

awesome.

 

 

[10thBadger 25]

On 6/9/2014 at 9:18 PM, pballer said:

This sort of thing happened to my wife and I, and a swinger friend. She never wanted sex during her period. Ever. Any kind, even giving oral to me.

 

We can play apart, and we are both OK with it. I was out of town one weekend while she was menstruating. After I got off work I called her on the phone. No answer. I tried several times over an hour or so. No answer. I got worried, but waited for her to get my messages.

 

When she did call she apologized and said she didn't hear the phone ring. She had it turned down because she was giving this man head, and it lasted almost an hour. Then they say and talked for a few more. I was livid. She never does that with me during that time of the month, why would she with him?

 

She explained that her FWBs are like boyfriends to her. They are special. She treats them like they are dating and everything is new to her with them. We've been married 35 years, and as much as we love each other, it's just different with them.

 

That was a lesson I had to learn. So I learned it. She may do stuff with other guys that she won't do with you. And you may find yourself doing things with your friends that you don't normally do with her. But isn't that why we swing? To enhance, add to, and to improve our sex lives? There was/is nothing wrong with our sex, but swinging does enhance it tremendously. Let it.

 

And just to add, if you are sharing a room/cabin/whatever with another couple, isn't it normal to expect sex to happen at any given time? Between any given partner? I know it is for us.

I would tell her to pack her bags and go with these special boyfriend lovers. If I cannot get the same treatment or more or better from a woman that says she loves me and is married to me, then she has no business being with me and can get another sucker. 
 

Brother I’m just sorry I just don’t see it the same way you do. Not saying that you are wrong, I’m just saying that I would not been able to except that comment that FWB gets better treatment than being a husband and the one that she is supposed to love. I totally understand what you’re saying but I just wouldn’t be able to except that. Now if you were getting everything that you said she denied you and then she did that with the FWB, I might be able to except it but being denied and then told they are special and you aren’t as special In her eyes because you have been married for over 30 years, or over 20 years, or over 10 years. Just in my mind, she’s telling you FWB is filet mignon AND You being the husband are nothing but convenient.

 

You just have very good patients and a totally different mindset. Not saying that your mindset is bad, you are very excepting but I just don’t think I could ever except that answer.

[MidwestHoneys 355]

1 hour ago, 10thBadger said:

You just have very good patients and a totally different mindset. Not saying that your mindset is bad, you are very excepting but I just don’t think I could ever except that answer.

Dude, brutha or any other fuckin word you use. You have so much to say but you can’t fuckin put a sentence together. 
Are you a fuckin doctor? Are you Excepting Patients? Duh. Get a fuckin life! 

[10thBadger 25]

5 hours ago, MidwestHoneys said:

Dude, brutha or any other fuckin word you use. You have so much to say but you can’t fuckin put a sentence together. 
Are you a fuckin doctor? Are you Excepting Patients? Duh. Get a fuckin life! 

Great response tough guy response

[NoAngels 330]

2 hours ago, 10thBadger said:

Great response tough guy response

Is that the Wife who writes with the same grammar, syntax and spelling as her athletic army hero who married a gorgeous model from Russia You Both know everything about life and how every couple should live. Or the tough guy who would own a wife and demand she do everything he wants her to do or he would throw her out and kick the ass of the man she spoke to. Sounds if you pay for it you should demand obedience. 
Have you noticed all the Likes you get on your posts? 

[10thBadger 25]

2 minutes ago, NoAngels said:

Is that the Wife who writes with the same grammar, syntax and spelling as her athletic army hero who married a gorgeous model from Russia You Both know everything about life and how every couple should live. Or the tough guy who would own a wife and demand she do everything he wants her to do or he would throw her out and kick the ass of the man she spoke to. Sounds if you pay for it you should demand obedience. 
Have you noticed all the Likes you get on your posts? 

Badgers wife,

 

Thank you for the compliment, yes I was a gorgeous model when I was younger. Seven kids later change that lol. Just like everyone else here we have life experiences. And yes many times I asked for a translation make sure I understand what some people are saying. And yes sometimes we see things as black-and-white and not much gray area. My husband never says that he owns me, but I know there are certain things that he would not tolerate and I know I would not tolerate certain things. Cheating would be one of them. Massive amounts of disrespect would be another. 

 

My husband and I have only had one experience in a club with swingers and it was not good. But because of this website even though it was something that I would never think about looking at, it has brought much conversation between my husband and Me. I am sure I could communicate better what I am trying to say. But this is my fourth language. Lol Russian be in my first language, Latvian a second language, German will be my third language, and English or shall I say American English.

 

 I’m sorry that some of you do not appreciate us commenting in tandem at times. But that is what the board is about correct. We all have life experiences and some more mean than others. I myself have never personally attacked anyone but between my husband and Me speaking And discussing things that we read together. We have had great debates with questions and with comments given on subjects. 

 

I’m not sure where you got the thought that my husband owned me, or maybe that was just something sarcastic. Because my husband respects me and my respect is earned and appreciated. I have proved being a military wife with over 20 years, that I am strong, loyal, and a really good wife and mother. And yes my husband was in US Army Airborne ranger And SF.  He served for 26 years. So yes I am proud of him. So forgive me for being proud of my husband if that hurts your feelings.

 

I really don’t understand your second to last sentence. I will ask my husband to read and translate for me. .

 

But I still want you to have a great day and I hope that you had a great Christmas.