Complicated start, aren't they usually?

[deecubed 16]

Sorry, going to be a long post, I am long winded in person as well. 38m wife is 40f *breathe in* So I come back from a weekend away, 3 weeks ago, to find my monogamous partner of 14 years completely open an honest with me about every thing she wants, feels, imagines, dreams, kinks, insecurities etc. It was extremely uplifting, I love the total breakdown of barriers, she is interested in other women especially, but men as well. Has a thing for the "open relationship" neighbors and being dominated (by me)all details included. I don't honestly know what got into her, but we have had the hottest sex in the last 12 years at least in 3 weeks. She wants to watch me with another woman and later join and, hopefully have me let her go with another man, etc. So last weekend we got together with the neighbors, rules included no male touching opposite female, and it was awesome. I was good when we came home, then she kept asking if the female could come home with us for the night. She wouldn't take no for an answer, but he doesn't want me with his wife if he can't have mine. I assume this jealousy is normal, and I am wanting more every day to say yes. I am ex-military, still in decent shape and she has been disabled for years and overweight though she has been loosing a bunch. I LOVE seeing her wanted by someone else (the husband and smoking hot wife) but I had an actual panic attack thinking about her with him. I asked for a few weeks to reflect and think about how I feel and why I am feeling it and she said she is ok with this, but she asks every other day where I am at on my thoughts. So yeah, I really really want to do this, but I am really jealous of him and would like to curb those thoughts. I have made some headway but not enough to be comfortable in saying "go for it". Any thoughts? If you need more information just ask.

 

 

*edit* I forgot, possibly the most important part. My ex wife and I used to do this, she burned me bad, started seeing others without knowledge or consent and eventually led to our divorce. I am positive this is my hang up. But I used to enjoy swapping/swinging so much.

[GoldCoCouple 4,066]

Read more threads in the Curious About Swinging forum, but the short answer is:

 

IMHO, all jealous is is a lack of love, trust and communication. To be successful at swinging you need an abundance of all three (and there is no such thing as too much of any). When you have this, it seems that jealous just disappears. However, it does take time for all three to build up enough to make the jealous go away. As for playing with friends, search is your friend on the board as there are multiple threads about this. Personally, I strongly warn you to stay away from it. If it goes wrong, are you prepared for EVERYONE to know what you have been doing? And with neighbors, it makes it hard to just avoid them in the future. Another thing, if they have an 'open relationship', then it would be okay to see the wife by herself. Open implies that both of them can 'date' whoever they want without the other being present or involved. That he can be with your wife implies that they are swingers. At the same time, we have a rule that says the two girls can spend time together (shopping, spa, whatever), the two guys can spend time together, or all four of us can spend time together. No other combinations allowed. This prevents any 'misunderstandings' or anyone feeling left out. Just look at your ex for the example.

 

One other rule is if one of us says no, then the answer for both of us is no, no questions, no pressure, no guilt. Talk about it later in private, but don't be confrontational about it. That she has opened up to you is a rare and valuable thing, treat it as such and don't allow the lines of communication close back down. Finally, never move faster than the slowest member is comfortable with (right now this would be you). There is no big rush, no trophy for finishing first, just take your time and enjoy the ride as much as the destination. Talk to her and make sure that you are both on board and understand what the rules and limits are. It sounds like she is already going 100mph...she needs to understand that it may take you some time to get up to speed as well. Swinging is a couples sport and should only be done together as a team. You two still have lots of talking to do and you need to make sure she can tap the breaks some at this point. Good luck and let us know how things progress...

[deecubed 16]

GoldCoCouple Thank you sincerely. She asked for me to read my message and any replies when I told her about this site. She understands what you are saying and asked my opinion on it as well. We keep an open dialogue and will continue to do so. She is good with putting the brakes on and continuing dialogue. Things will work out, they always do one way or another.

[deecubed 16]

Well, she pushed past my comfort zone for about the tenth time, I said I wasn't comfortable with more than the 2 couple's having sex and the women interacting for now. Kept telling her I need time, and the neighbors are moving in a month or so, so it would probably never happen with them. She got mad, saying that I said it would happen eventually. I said yes, eventually. She want's him specifically because she considers the neighbors "safe",I thought for hours and said maybe if you let me control your actions while we are there but she says she can't (or doesn't want to) control her own actions. So all the next day I trying to figure out what to say and how to keep her from shutting down again, the neighbors asked me to drop something by to them, and I spilled some of what was going on to them. Come to find out they weren't into it either, and they were mad she assumed they were. I tell her the next morning and she looses it, says she never said that (not being able to control herself with him), says she meant possible other men and (obviously) was pissed that I talked to them before her. Told me "fuck it, this is over, never again" Then she wouldn't talk to me for 6 hours, just cried. When she finally would talk to me, last night, it came out that she has been feeling this way a long time and was finally comfortable telling me about it and I broke her trust and lost all that open communication. I told her she was moving WAY too fast for me, all she will say now is that it is a moot point because she is done. I am going to give her a few weeks (months) and slowly bring it up again, if she is feeling better (I doubt it) But just because she comes out with all of this and is ready because she has been building up to it forever doesn't mean I am on the same page or wouldn't be eventually. Again, she doesn't see it that way. Funny enough, as of right now I don't want to have sex with other people, I think I would enjoy seeing her do it, and share her with another man/woman, but that would also take time to be completely comfortable with. Again, thanks for the advice.

[padoc 1,703]

You have way too much baggage to work through from your 1st marriage before you even think about bringing another couple into the mix.You and your current wife are fraught with drama and in this hobby, that is not a good thing. Swinging is about sharing, the pleasure, the erotic moments, the anticipation, the thrill of a new partner, the joy of watching your partner etc etc. Probably due to your baggage, you need to control your wife rather than share the joys of this hobby. As a result, your approach to the neighbors without first discussing it with your wife offended them and embarrassed her.Now I'd guess, they're quite done with you two. You're going to control yourself right back into divorce court.

[deecubed 16]

Sincerely, thank you padoc. The other couple is still good with us hanging out, but yeah, we may not be. Oh and the control thing, she asked for specifically.

[GoldCoCouple 4,066]

To be successful at swinging you need an abundance of all three (and there is no such thing as too much of any).

 

You don't have enough of any of the three and moving forward is just going to be a

 

Fix the relationship first (if it can be fixed since it sounds like she already has her mind made up) and THEN think about extra curricular activities. Otherwise, start taking actions to prepare for the worst. Her actions and words are saying anything close to her loving you, trusting you, respecting you. We're sorry, but we still wish you the best outcome possible.

[deecubed 16]

Thank you again ColdCoCouple. We talked it over and are out of this realm for now. She understands she was pushing me too hard too fast. We will stick to our "normal" kinks for now. She said she wasn't going to tell me her fantasies and thoughts anymore because it hurt me, and in the last couple days has gone back to talking openly. I told her, hurt me or not, talk openly. It's the only way I know how you feel. She was nothing but rush forward and understands that is what hurt me. The relationship feels good right now, time will tell. Again, thank you for the advice and kind words.

[GoldCoCouple 4,066]

Just talking about fantasies doesn't mean that you are going to actively try and make them come true. It does mean that you can pretend and play them out together in your bedroom. As our tag line reads: If you don’t have to lie about sex, you don’t have to lie about anything and that is SO VERY true. Not talking about anything is a bad thing. Talking and doing, however, are not the same thing. Talking more, however, MAY LEAD to doing in the future. Good luck and let us know how things are going.

[deecubed 16]

She has hit the brakes completely on pushing me, but now we are having active really good conversations. I am not, at all, out of the realm of a mfm or fmf mash up, but still a no go on a swap, I think a few experiences may help me with confidence in a swap, but time will tell. Her fantasy is being tied to a chair, naked with a blindfold on and having numerous men grope her. I can get on board with that and am actually looking forward to and into it. For me, it's the pushing that she was doing that was doing damage (again with the ex wife comparison). She understands that now and is not pushing, just discussing and listening to what I want, what I think and what I am reading about every aspect I can absorb on the subject from here and other sources. I am listening to everything she has to say on it as well and considering effects and so on. We discuss what is being said, how we feel about it and what we will do, what we are ok or not ok with. I explained that her being with the wife without me there and the husband there hurt and she agreed not to spend time with them (him specifically) without me as suggested by GoldCoCouple the first time. Communication is improving, trust is again improving. This woman means the world to me and isn't trying to leave me. It may be months or longer before anything happens, unfortunately (or possibly fortunately) the neighbors are out as playmates but still hanging out regularly as friends, the awkward is fading daily. About the control thing in earlier posts, my wife is my sub (light play) and it turns her and I on having me in control, but I do believe this needs (at least for us) to be an even ground thing all around, no control play, no permissions just understanding and agreement. I apologize, I don't mean to make this my journal, but who knows someone may get more insight working with a similar situation. Again thank you all for the advice.

[GoldCoCouple 4,066]

Don't apologize, we are here to try and help. Sometimes even just posting something can add clarity so just keep posting...like with her, just keep talking. As communication improves and continues, so does the trust and love and that;s never a bad thing.

 

It may be months or longer before anything happens

 

You have the rest of your lives. It's when people rush things that they are more likely to go wrong. Take you time and enjoy the talking and the closeness. Keep things going the way they are currently and see what happens...

[deecubed 16]

Ok, 2 weeks later. The neighbors and us are on good terms, the neighbors wife especially was mad at my wife for pushing so hard after telling her repeatedly not to, and this hurt my wife because she considers her a very good friend. The neighbors wife wants or at least wanted me before all of this shit show, and my wife really wanted that to happen (still does even though the neighbors are completely out of the realm of playing now). One of the things I have definitely learned from this is that my wife wants me to read into her statements (she is working on that with me) and I try to just say what I mean but fall short trying not to hurt her(also working on this). There are a lot of good things to have come from this, our communication has never been better, and both of us are trying to be candid about everything. She or I can masturbate openly and the other, when just walking in on it, may want to join in or just watch or go on about what they were doing. This small thing to me is very exciting. We are still talking expectations, rules, guidelines etc. and are ready to try again... But not anytime soon. We need to be in complete agreement, luckily we are in complete agreement about that. Something we are struggling with at the moment is that she can't research like I do because, for the last 2 years or so, reading gives her migraines. Yes I do read to her, but she gets bored quickly if the subject isn't in correlation to what we want. I am working through the fact she only has one hard limit and it is me kissing someone else (I'm fine with this). Everything else goes as far as she is concerned and I am not ok reciprocating these feelings yet, and may never be, but I can work towards them. As I have read many times before, it isn't a race. Again thanks for any input/critique/advice.

 

Always learning,

Dee

[Guest]

Just to clarify.....

 

Playing with friends / neighbours / people who live on the same street / work mates / hobby friends / people who know your family / people who know your work mates / ECT.

 

Is hardly ever a good idea.

 

Yes in a small number of circumstances it can work, but for everyone 1 couple who do make that work there are another 100 couples out there who wish they had never played with people they know. That playing with people you know / or people who know to much about your lives often backfires straight in your face and can cause your life a considerable amount of damage.

 

Some of the classic things would include:

 

You decide to play with a friend, or someone you know like a neighbour or workmate because you think its safe. You already know them, you already have some basic trust built with them, you assume they will treat you nicely and with respect, you assume this friend will keep your secrets, respect your rules, understand your desires, however.....

 

- You play with a friend, and they end up telling all of your other friends about your sex life and group sex desires.

 

- You play with a friend, and they end up telling your work or hobby friends that your into group sex and orgies.

 

- You play with a friend, and it turns out they are a bad lover, controlling, jealous, domineering, obsessive none of which you knew until sex was involved.

 

- You play with a friend, and they simply don't like it and end up breaking off the entire friendship and never talking to you again.

 

- You play with a friend, and they tell so many people about your group sex antics that your workplace finds out ad potentially fires you for been some sexual deviant.

 

- You play with a friend, and they tell so many people that your own family find out, your other neighbours find out, your children's or even grand children's school finds out.

 

 

Trust me people finding out about your secret desires can do massive amounts of damage to your life, it can alienate neighbours, it can turn life long friends against you, can make people suspicious and protective against you, can make easily make you the talk of the town, can easily brand you as been perverted sexual monsters.

 

I also think the way NEWS travels can also be very devastating, for example....

 

Your friend might tell someone that you had group sex with them.

The person they have told, then obviously tells two other people that you had group sex.

 

THEN by the time the 20th person has been told you didn't just have group sex, you actually had group sex wearing full leather gimp gear and all used strap on dildo sex toys to fuck each other. That you didn't just try group sex with a friend, your actually a full on swinging couple who fucks 20 people a week at swinging clubs and parties.

 

By the time the 20th person has been told you didn't just have group sex with a friend, no you had group sex because you have a limp dick that doesn't work and needed a proper man to do the job. Nope you didn't just have group sex, you had group sex whilst dressed in a red robe singing satanic songs.

 

It seems each person that gets told changes the story / adds things to the story / puts what they imagine into the story. There is a BIG difference between trying group sex with a friend, to what people imagine you did when they all get told. You simply wanted to try group sex with a trusted friend, people actually imagine your a sexual predator who dresses up in leather gimp suits and has piss and poo sex parties with anyone who comes along.

 

Once news of you swinging gets around then you can suddenly find yourself outcast, for example....

 

- Imaging walking into your local church and the priest saying that due to rumours of deviant sexual behaviour your band from the church.

 

- Imaging walking into your local shop and the staff saying they have had complaints that your a sexual predator and they ask you to leave and not return.

 

- Imaging walking into your gym or local sports club and the staff telling you that several women have complained and don't feel sexual safe around you.

 

 

There is also something I like to call....

 

 

TO CLOSE FOR COMFORT:

 

 

Imagine that you met a man who lives a 5 minute drive away from your house. You meet this man, you get to know him a little bit, you and your wife end up having sex with this man, your wife likes this man, your wife is actually very attracted to this man, your wife enjoys the sex with this man, this man also seems to like your wife.

 

Okay so a week later you head out to work for a 10 hour shift. If not work then maybe you head out on a fishing trip / hunting trip / to see a family member / to help friends, basically you leave the house for the next 10 hours. During this time a lot of men would be thinking:

 

- Hhhmmm is that other guy seeing my wife?

- Are they having sex without me knowing?

- He only lives 5 minutes away he could easily pop round to see my wife?

- How will I know my wife won't see him whilst I'm at work?

- How will I know this man won't sneak round to my house when he knows I'm out?

- How do I know my wife isn't going to his house when I'm at work?

- How do I know he is not watching my house?

 

That basically if the other person lives "To Close" then it can potentially cause problems.

 

How close is to close? Well personally I'd not want to play with anyone who could simply walk to my house in 5 or 10 minutes, I'd prefer it to be a 30 minute drive / the other side of the city for example, or even a neighbouring town.

 

There are also various things that I NEVER TELL ANOTHER MAN!!!!

 

If we meet another man for sex, either a single man, or a male that is part of a couple then I never tell that man:

 

- My girlfriends phone number.

- My girlfriends private email address.

- My girlfriends Face Book or online details.

- Where my girlfriend works.

- What hours I'm at work.

- What hours my girlfriend works.

- Where my girlfriend likes to hang out.

- Places my girlfriend often visits.

- What car I drive.

 

 

Years ago when I first began in this lifestyle we would meet a guy and I'd be open and honest with him and tell him my working patterns / my working hours. To me it seem totally innocent, I wanted this guy to know that on Tuesdays I finish work at 16:00 so maybe we can meet up on Tuesday night? I wanted this guy to know that on Thursdays I don't start work until 17:00 so maybe we could meet up in the day on Thurs?

 

Actually what happened instead was the guys would listen to my working hours and would then wait until I left the house for work and 30 minutes after I left would come knocking on my door. My girlfriend home alone would answer the door and be confronted by this sexually horny guy who made excuses about why he was knocking on the door.

 

"Oh yeah I was just in the area so thought I'd knock on your door and say hello, can I come in? Can we talk? Can we talk alone?"

 

"Oh yeah last time I was here I thought I left my hat so thought I'd drop by and see if it was here? Can I come in? Do you want sex alone? You fancy some fun?"

 

These guys would have been better saying.....

 

"Hey your dumb boyfriend told me he was at work today so I assumed you would be alone in the house, you know easy pray, so I thought I'd knock on the door to see if you fancied my cock alone? See if you fancied a little sneaky affair sex whilst your husband is at work? I knew he wasn't here because his car isn't parked outside, so can I come in a fuck you alone then?"

 

Again years ago when I first began exploring group sex I'd meet a guy and allow him to take my girlfriends phone number. I wanted my girlfriend and this new guy to get to know each other a little / to flirt a little / to build up some comfort. What I found was these guys would actually text message my girlfriend about 40 times a day. That I'd head off to work for 10 hours and might text message my girlfriend once or twice in that time, where these other guys would bombard my girlfriends phone and have entire sexual conversations with her, and about 90% of the time within 2 days of giving this guy my girlfriends number he would then ask her for sex alone / to meet him alone / to have dates with him alone.

 

I remember one guy even turned up at my girlfriends workplace looking for her.

 

Telling guys too much about your life / about your wife's life can be dangerous, now as it stands it a guy asks when I work? I reply by saying....

 

"Oh my shifts change all of the time, sometime I work mornings, sometimes I work afternoons, sometimes I work nights, sometimes I get to work and everything is done so I can come straight home, sometimes I do 4 hour shifts, sometimes 8 hour shifts, sometimes 10 hour shifts, really my working patterns are all over the place and my days off work change every week"

 

If a guy asks for my girlfriends phone number / email / online details / where she works then I kindly explain that we don't give such details out.

 

If a man asks what car I drive, then I'll say...

 

"Oh nothing special, but to be fair sometimes I work into work / sometimes I get a bus / sometimes I ride my bike / sometimes friends give me a lift / sometimes family drop me off at work"

 

 

I also make sure to explain to any guy we meet that he is NOT EVER to come to my house without been invited by me first. I often say something like....

 

"Hey this might sound a little heavy but please DO NOT come to my house ever unless you have been invited by me. The reason for that is because my brother and my uncle are both police officers and they often visit my house with their families and they get very suspicious if they walk in my house and there are people here that they don't know. If you are just in the area then please do not knock on our door. I fyou think you have left something in my house such as a coat / wallet / hat / bag then please call me or message me online and we will search our house to see if you have left this item. Please don't ever knock on our door unless you have been invited by me first because I don't want my silly policeman brother or uncle putting you on the spot and quizzing you for 30 minutes"

 

In all honesty none of my family are police officers, but sure I want any new guy we meet to think.... If I cause this couple any trouble at all his policeman brother and policeman uncle will be after me. If I cause this couple any trouble at all they can make one phone call and their policeman family will kick off the door with guns drawn. Shit I better keep this couples rules because they have police back up.

 

Honestly I want any new guy to think.... If I hurt this couple, if I mess this couple around, if I threaten this couple or put them in danger at all then they will not only have half the police force looking for me but half the cities CSI team will be dusting their house finger prints / will be swabbing their bedding for DNA / that they will have 15 people in white crime scene suits going over their entire house with a fine comb, that they will be hoovering the carpets to find my hairs / will be searching the garden for my footprints / will be checking local CCTV to see what car I'm driving. ECT.

 

 

I'd also point out that generally the way that AFFAIRS START is by communication.

 

For example if a person can just pop around your house whenever they want and speak with your wife.

 

If that person can just text message your wife whenever they want.

If that person can just email your wife whenever they want.

If they can invite your wife out for meals or drinks whenever they want.

 

Then basically your wife will become more comfy with that person / will begin speaking about more personal or intimate things with that person / will build up a rapport with that person / will start trusting that person / will be more likely to make mistakes or agree to meet them alone more / ECT.

 

You have to understand that if you meet a MAN for a threesome then a lot of the time that man would actually prefer to be fucking your wife alone. A lot of men only agree to a threesome because they want to fuck your wife, and a good percent of guys would prefer it if you (the husband) wasn't actually around.

 

Likewise if you meet a COUPLE for a foursome then a lot of the time the couple you do meet will end up liking your wife more / wanting your wife to have sex with them alone / that this other man would it prefer it if your wife came to their house alone. In fact some couples specifically meet other couples and then try to lure the other mans wife into affairs.

 

You can even see it on this forum, loads of couples make the same type of posts that basically say....

 

"We met a new couple / we fucked this new couple / we like the women and want to meet her alone for sex / we don't like her husband / we would prefer it if the husband just went away / we want his wife"

 

 

I guess this will sound paranoid but often if we meet a new guy for sex or even a couple then when the night is done I will often look out of my window and see what car they get into and make a note of the colour / make / model / number plate just in case they do return causing us any trouble. Years ago my girlfriend actually got stalked by a man we had sex with (it's a long story) but basically when I left for work I'd always make sure to look up and down my street / look for his car / look to see if he was standing anywhere / sometimes I'd drive up the road to work, other times I'd drive down the road to work, sometimes I'd turn left at the top of the street, sometimes I'd turn right and would keep an eye out for his car, ECT.

 

Don't get me wrong I'm not trying to put you off swinging, I'm not trying to put you off from fucking men or women, it can be great fun, I'm just saying swinging with people who know too much about your life can be dangerous. Swinging with friends / worm mates / neighbours / people who live to close / can all backfire in your face.

 

The best option would be to meet someone totally knew, someone who doesn't know where you work / doesn't know your working hours / doesn't know your other friends or family members / someone who isn't connected to your life / someone who lives in a different area on the other side of town / and them to limited what information you do tell that person about your life.

 

Then if you like that person / if you get along with that person / if you know them for a number of years and they don't cause you any problems at all / then obviously you can start to be a little more open about your life with them. For example I have known one male swinging partner for over 15 years, he has never caused me a single problem, never stalked my girlfriend, never tried to begin any affairs with my partner, so sure he knows more about my life than a random person we meet would.

 

 

OVERALL:

 

 

My advice would be to speak with your wife more, find out WHAT she likes in a women / what she likes in a man / find out what type of person she would like to meet, for example....

 

Would she like to meet a short person / tall person / thin person / larger person / younger person / older person / would she like to meet a guy with tattoos / no tattoos / would be be okay meeting someone who smoked / would she prefer to meet the type of person who was a working professional / the type of person who was a general worker / the type of person who likes drinking / what are her views about meeting people who use drugs such as smoking weed / would she prefer to meet a single person or a couple / would she prefer to meet a women who matched her body type or something totally different / would she prefer to meet someone who really liked animals / would she prefer to meet someone who had long hair or even short hair / would she like to meet a man who has a big dick, medium dick, smaller dick.

 

On the flip side who doesn't she want to meet? For example she might not want to meet someone who drinks a lot / someone who does drugs / someone who dresses in a messy way / a guy who's dick is too big.

 

Basically find out what she does want and what she does not want. Find out a lot more about the type of person she would like to meet, but also find out a lot more about the type of experience she wants?

 

I mean does she want to meet someone / get to know them / meet them for coffee or drinks / take things slowly / build a small amount of friendship and trust / then slowly try things with them.

 

Alternatively does she want to simply meet someone she likes the look of / meet someone she likes the sound of / then to just fuck them and see how it goes.

 

If you did fuck someone else what it her perfect setting? Would she prefer it to be slow and romantic / hard and sexual / would she prefer it to be in a hotel / at your house / in their house / would she be okay with the lights on, or would she prefer the lights dimmed / would she prefer to be fully naked or to keep on a nightgown or loose fitting shirt / how does she feel about condom use / would she prefer you to use a condom with another women / would she prefer to use a condom with another man / or would she be okay not using condoms.

 

Would she want music playing in the background / would she want a nice new set of bedding / would she prefer to fuck other people in the day, afternoon, evening, night / you mentioned your partner is disabled so does she have a certain time of the day that is better for her, for example some people who have health issues feel the pain more when they have just woke up or when it gets late at night so when would it be best for her to play.

 

Would she want to have a few drinks first / would she prefer to be fully sober / if you have pets then what would you do with the pets whilst you played / does she have an age limit on the people she would like to meet / is there any specific traits in people that she wouldn't like to meet / how many times would she like to meet someone / would she be happy seeing this other person once a week / two, three, even four times a week / once a month. If you did meet someone then would she want this person to stay over for the night, or simply pop round for a few hours to fuck.

 

Basically find out as much as you can about what she would and wouldn't want then do your best to offer her the best option, look on swinging meet up sites and find the person or couple who best matches what your wife desires. Keep in mind you are NEVER going to meet someone who is perfect, but you can get someone who at least matches 50% or even 80% of what your looking for.

[JandKinBoise 858]

Until you absolutely KNOW that your wife loves only you, you won't have the kind of trust needed to swap. MFM seems easier but the same feelings will come up. Your previous marriage could prevent this from ever happening. We are a sum of our experiences and divorce was a biggie for you, very influential in overall feelings about relationships.

[dazanconfsd 84]

This is the OP on our mutual account. I just copy pasted (below) from another post I typed a few days ago. Everything everyone is saying is true.

 

"We tried after just 2 weeks of talking about it. Did just about everything wrong you could do. Our very stable and loving relationship took a hit, this is something she has wanted for a long time and just brought it to my attention. She said it was done, never again, etc. I told her I wanted to try it with her and talked it over. After 6 or 8 weeks of full discussions, what went wrong, how we feel, what we want and expect, what to do, not to do, safe touch, safe words, and so on, we tried again. We now have 2 couples we play with regularly, one of them we hang out with as friends now, without playing as well(not everyone's cup of tea, but we enjoy it and the friendship) Everything has gone smooth, and with the help of others here, our communication is excellent (thank you GoldCoCouple for the advice) so when there is a "bump" we bring it up after the experience and adjust our rules and boundaries. Make sure you both know what you are getting into and the first time, at least for us, is not what you expect. Hell, sometimes with our regulars it isn't what we expected, we just make a point to have fun and keep to our rules."

 

So overall bad experience turned good with communication and time.