Bareback Swingers

[bear_n_bunny 43]

Bear and I went to meet a couple last night that he had corresponding with. The lounge we met in was a little loud since it was full of cowboys from the Rodeo, so the guys ended up talking with each other, and the ladies chatted. In the course of conversation she reveals that they were not going to swing with some couple they met and liked because the woman insisted on condoms and her husband didn't do condoms.

 

What! I was shocked. I couldn't think of anything to say as it was so casually offered. Needless to say I handled it badly by not saying anything and calling the evening early. It was something to speak with Bear about, and not in a lounge full of cowboys from the Rodeo.

 

Here's my query, are bareback swingers common? As much as I trust and enjoy our long time playmates, I think I'd still insist on a condom. Not just to prevent me getting pregnant, but avoid those tricky and deadly STDs. No matter how honest someone was about being clean, the fact of the matter is STDs nowadays can hide out for years.

 

As an example, after being celibate for six years once, my yearly PAP came up funny. Turns out it was chlamydia. Who knows how long that little nasty had been lurking around in my system. I would hate to think I'd in all honesty told a partner I was clean and then given them something.

 

The point of this rambling is, how can swingers justify ever being OK with going bareback? If you are OK with it, can you share why? If you do insist on bareback, shouldn't that be something in your profile or shared up front?I know I don't everything on the subject and enjoy the different opinions on the board.

 

I'll be the first to admit I enjoy sex without condoms far more than with, but I don't think I could justify it. As well, it is something separates mine and Bear's love making from our playing.

 

-- A Shocked and Confused Bunny

[Spoomonkey 420]

We only play with condoms, but the idea of finding people we knew well enough and were comfortable enough to play totally naked is appealing. Not sure we'll get to that point - but who knows.

 

I don't think bare back players are common - but who knows. I think we'd have to get to a point where we were a part of a rather exclusive circle before we considered it.

 

It is weird that the couple weren't on the same page... That is a combo that will likely never work out... I would think...

[cm89 16]

We only play with condoms. We have met some truly great people but, you never know...

[BradAndJanet 70]

It depends on the couple; how well we know them and trust them, their sexual history, their preferences, etc. For instance, someone we just met at a club? Condoms, no question. Others? Maybe not...

[windsor4fun2 130]

We ran into one couple in a chat room that advertised she HAD to bareback because of a latex allergy. The woman was using it as a "selling" feature in attracting people. My wife sent her a private message saying there were non-latex condoms available. My wife was told to mind her own damn business. I just don't understand people some times.

[Yummi 16]

Originally posted by cm89

We only play with condoms. We have met some truly great people but, you never know...

 

Even really great people get STD's unfortunately...

 

However, I really can't imagine giving oral to a guy with a condom on.

[yawanna 17]

why not? Hookers do it

[Mich149 16]

We have had a couple or two say that they prefer without and one even tried to insist on it, but I'd have to say we're there with spoomonkey. We don't do it, but the idea of finding people we're that comfortable with is appealing.

 

As for blowjobs with a condom? Even the "flavored" ones taste awful and that would just ruin it entirely.

[gsu22 187]

Always condoms for me......but like others have said, once you get comfortable with people and know their history....then maybe no condoms........its all about trust in my humble opinion.

[VegasLee 1,486]

Originally posted by yawanna

why not? Hookers do it

 

Simple, my wife is not a hooker!

[EternallySingle 32]

There is only one woman I know I would ever go bareback with. I've known her for 15 years, know her kids and their grandmother, who she last ahd sex with, her favorite positions, what she looks for in men (not me, but the occasional sex is GREAT), and when her last comprehensive STD test was. I know that because nine years ago I asked where I could get a test done right and she took me to a clinic she goes to. Since then we go to the clinic together every nine months (you get fewer funny looks if you go with someone...or at least thats what she thinks) and we share the results with each other when we get them a week later.

 

Outside of her and the wife I don't have yet, I would NEVER go bareback with anyone I didn't know well. I did once on the spur of the moment and it scared the hell out of me when I had a "hot pee". Luckily, turned out I had a reaction to a drink I didn't know was made with shrimp, not an STD.

 

BTW, what kind of drink is made with shellfish anyway?

[jcbicouple 24]

Originally posted by Mich149

We have had a couple or two say that they prefer without and one even tried to insist on it, but I'd have to say we're there with spoomonkey. We don't do it, but the idea of finding people we're that comfortable with is appealing.

 

As for blowjobs with a condom? Even the "flavored" ones taste awful and that would just ruin it entirely.

Dito Everything you said!

Just as a "Food for thought": Years ago, one of my good friends had a STD.........Unfortunately, she NEVER had a single symtom. She was what the doctors described as "a carrier". Chances are she had spread it to anyone she slept with over the course of what the doctors estimated to be somewhere between 5 and 10 years. She found out when she was engaged and her fiance came down with an STD.......guess where he got it?

[yawanna 17]

Simple, my wife is not a hooker!

 

absolutely!! nor am I

 

However, men who engage the services of a prostitute must wear a condom, that she provides, even for bj's. So why wouldn't a man use protection when 'swinging' with the female of a couple that he knows and supposedly respects.

 

Shouldn't he be just as careful, if not more, for the health and well being of the female of the couple he and his wife are playing with. And wouldn't he want the same safety and assurances taken for his wife by the other male.

[Greg & Sheryl 368]

Originally posted by bear_n_bunny

Here's my query, are bareback swingers common?

 

Based on our observations, we'd say bareback swingers are very common. Although the majority of swingers on this board seem very conscientious about condom use, we haven’t seen too many people using condoms at the events we’ve attended. It’s possible that this lack of condom use is unique to those particular events, while elsewhere condoms are the rule rather than the exception. However, we do have some theories as to why some swingers prefer to go bareback.

 

Most of the swingers we know are over 40. Unlike younger, more fertile couples, most of the people we know have finished breeding and have sterilized themselves. This removes an incentive to use condoms to prevent pregnancy. Furthermore, couples over 40 became sexually active before HIV reared its ugly head in the 1980’s, so they were never indoctrinated with “safe sex” messages as they were growing up.

 

Regarding HIV, although it is understood that anyone can acquire the virus, from a statistical standpoint it is still a virus that largely strikes gay men, IV drug users and low-income, inner-city minorities. Generally, swingers don’t fit into any of those categories, so the swinging community has been virtually untouched by this disease. Unlike the gay community, HIV has never pushed the swinging community into widespread condom use.

 

While is it possible for certain cases of STDs to be asymptomatic, symptoms usually manifest themselves among at least one partner (usually the male) within a given committed couple. Given that swingers generally belong to a well-to-do demographic which is more likely to have access to quality health care, it would seem that an infected couple would get any STDs taken care of before they pass it on to any other couples.

 

However, that last scenario would seem to be uncommon. After all, if committed couple A is clean and they go bareback with each other (as most committed couples do), and committed couple B is also clean and goes bareback with each other, what’s to keep them from going bareback if they get together and swap? It would seem that for an infection to occur among the circle of committed couples, the infection would have to come from an outside source. This might be an argument to avoid going bareback with singles even if you go bareback with other couples.

 

In spite of these points, it is understood that nothing short of abstinence or absolute monogamy will reduce the odds of avoiding disease to zero. It is up to every swinging couple to assess the risk involved in everything they do in the lifestyle. Some couples don’t swap at all because they feel the risk is too high. Some couples feel comfortable going bareback with other couples because they feel the pleasure of doing so outweighs the risk.

 

It’s like riding a motorcycle. Some people will never get on one. Others will ride, but always wear a helmet. But for others, feeling the wind rip through your hair is part of the whole experience.

[IndyGirl2004 18]

What you say is very interesting. The part about those of us over forty not being as familiar with the HIV/Aids situation because our teenage years were just prior to the outbreak certainly doesn't give us any excuse to be ignorant about it or to bury our heads in the sand (now, I could really say something naughty here, but will refrain;). Hopefully, we are old enough to also be well-read about it all and to make more informed and safer choices despite when we became sexually aware. If anyone over forty hasn't been paying attention to the fact that totally safe sex doesn't exist, then shame on them. Besides, isn't it a bit more enjoyable when you have that little added piece of mind that you've gone the extra mile to be as safe as possible?

[Greg & Sheryl 368]

Originally posted by IndyGirl2004

The part about those of us over forty not being as familiar with the HIV/Aids situation because our teenage years were just prior to the outbreak certainly doesn't give us any excuse to be ignorant about it or to bury our heads in the sand.

 

We weren't trying to imply that those over 40 were less aware of HIV, only that HIV had not impacted their sex lives as much because they didn't grow up with HIV.

 

Originally posted by IndyGirl2004

Hopefully, we are old enough to also be well-read about it all and to make more informed and safer choices despite when we became sexually aware.

 

True, but even though another couple may be equallly well-read and informed, they still might come to completely different conclusion regarding what is an acceptable risk for them.

 

Originally posted by IndyGirl2004

Besides, isn't it a bit more enjoyable when you have that little added piece of mind that you've gone the extra mile to be as safe as possible?

 

That depends on the individual. Some people spend all their lives playing it safe, while others aren't afraid to take some risks. We would suggest that life wouldn't be as enjoyable unless we take some risks. Aren't we all accepting a certain element of risk by being swingers in the first place?

[IndyGirl2004 18]

All of your points were very well taken and I agreed with them. Sorry if I didn't come off that way:)

 

Yes, opting to have several sexual partners is more risky and so I think more thought and care should be taken when getting ready to invite someone to have sex. Having read many threads about the experiences of others, it seems that there are many people who do take this extra step, but by the same token there are many who don't.

 

If and when we do decide to swap with others, I will be among you who do try to be more safe.

[Lorrie 21]

Originally posted by Greg & Sheryl

 

It’s like riding a motorcycle. Some people will never get on one. Others will ride, but always wear a helmet. But for others, feeling the wind rip through your hair is part of the whole experience.

 

:claps:

 

And to everything else you said.

 

Your post was one of the most objective, mature, intelligent, thoughtful posts I have ever read at this site. You managed to say it all without putting any biased feelings in it.

 

MEGA KUDOS!

[b_and_sc 16]

I"m the first to say I hate condoms!!! However, unless there is a long-time relationship and lots of trust (and even then it's a big maybe), we always use condoms.

[BettyAnnMBSC 24]

Condoms present one quandry for us though... In addition to preventing pregnancy and many STDs - condoms also very thoroughly prevent sloppy seconds or even "thirds, fourths, and fifths...

 

Now, I have two playmates that very much enjoy the feeling of sloppy seconds and a cream-pie seems essential in order to provide the full experience

 

Then in our case, we are particularly careful about who is allowed to ride bareback and who is not. Those who are a very few indeed. Add to that STD concern that I am of child-bearing age and condition, and we had to seriously consider all possible risks.

 

Even then, as was said already, it is sometimes a risk we elect to take. Swinging in general is a risky behavior (socially, medically, emotionally) and yet we don't elect to not participate. We simply evaluate various risks and elect to either accept or not accept those behaviours based on the immediate circumstances...

 

Not to minimize the impact of STDs but, statistically, it is very much more likely that any of us is going to be killed in an auto accident this week than it is that we will contract HIV this week == and yet, we still elect to get in the car.

[bear_n_bunny 43]

Bunny and I have discussed this, but I thought I'd put my two cent's worth in...

 

I've been swinging a bit longer than Bunny has, and I have gone bareback a few times. However, in each case it was with someone I knew well and trusted and vice versa. Just the same, I understand her concerns and abide by them.

 

Having said that, there is still no such thing as zero risk, even with condoms. The swingers we play with on a regular basis are people we could certainly go bareback with and not worry much about it. But then, these are quality people we trust. However, we still use them just the same (BTW, I used my first polyurethane condom this morning and will never go back to latex.., more for comfort reasons than anything else (well, and to keep Bunny from getting knocked up, too...

 

I am of the opinion that a lot of this STD stuff has been overhyped, due to HIV, and to a somewhat lesser extent, herpes (given that one will kill you and the other is forever, perhaps this is understandable at least to a point, considering how incredibly stupid most people are, especially when it comes to matters sexual).

 

The car and motorcycle analogy is a good one. Both have significant statistical risks, but if you exercise good judgment in operating them, you really have very little to worry about. The same thing applies to sex (and this is whether you are a swinger or not). If you are choosy about who you couple with, avoiding the usual high risk groups and those who are just plain skanky (you know them when you see them), in terms of probability, you will have very little to worry about.

 

Someone made mention of the "over 40" crowd, and us not having to deal with STDs back in the 1970s and all that. True, we didn't have things like HIV to worry about (and truth be known, we still didn't for the most part, even after HIV appeared on the scene, as long as you were not a gay male or IV drug user), but there were still things like syphilis and gonorrhea out there. But even so, and after all the profligate fucking we did back then, very few of us ever got any kind of STD.

 

Moral of the story is that, again, if you exercise a modicum of good judgment (which translates to being choosy about the kinds of people you play with), the risks are low.

 

Just the same, I'm not going to buck Bunny on this, and have no particular desire to. While barebacking is not totally ruled out, the rule of thumb is still "wrap that rascal"...

 

-- Bear

[bear_n_bunny 43]

Thank you for all your feed back. We just spend the weekend with our favorite playmates and discussed the subject. It was generally agreed that going bareback was not worth the risk. One, both of us ladies never want the embarassment of going to the doctor with one or having to tell everyone we've played with about it. The other point was that with all the new condoms, in this case Trojan Supra polyurethane condoms, that it wrapping it up wasn't that bad.

 

The gentleman made a point that he only liked to play with ladies who he thinks he doesn't have to use a condom with; then uses one any way. He avoids partners he feels the need for full body latex to play safely with.

 

While I do feel strongly about STDs and such, I do give blow jobs without condoms and would never do one with - Ick. I also insist on condoms as a subtle emotional protection. I only want to have sex with Bear au natural.

 

- Bunny

[mrs good times 73]

Greg & Sheryl Dito

 

You portrayed my thoughts on the subject. I was just too "Chicken" to post it myself.

[magnum 78]

Quote

Originally posted by bear_n_bunny

Bear and I went to meet a couple last night that he had corresponding with. The lounge we met in was a little loud since it was full of cowboys from the Rodeo, so the guys ended up talking with each other, and the ladies chatted. In the course of conversation she reveals that they were not going to swing with some couple they met and liked because the woman insisted on condoms and her husband didn't do condoms.

 

What! I was shocked. I couldn't think of anything to say as it was so casually offered. Needless to say I handled it badly by not saying anything and calling the evening early. It was something to speak with Bear about, and not in a lounge full of cowboys from the Rodeo.

 

Here's my query, are bareback swingers common? As much as I trust and enjoy our long time playmates, I think I'd still insist on a condom. Not just to prevent me getting pregnant, but avoid those tricky and deadly STDs. No matter how honest someone was about being clean, the fact of the matter is STDs nowadays can hide out for years.

 

As an example, after being celibate for six years once, my yearly PAP came up funny. Turns out it was chlamydia. Who knows how long that little nasty had been lurking around in my system. I would hate to think I'd in all honesty told a partner I was clean and then given them something.

 

The point of this rambling is, how can swingers justify ever being OK with going bareback? If you are OK with it, can you share why? If you do insist on bareback, shouldn't that be something in your profile or shared up front?I know I don't everything on the subject and enjoy the different opinions on the board.

 

I'll be the first to admit I enjoy sex without condoms far more than with, but I don't think I could justify it. As well, it is something separates mine and Bear's love making from our playing.

 

-- A Shocked and Confused Bunny

 

Interesting...I am a single male that swings with friends and have been for about 2 years now.

 

We started with condoms and it worked out, they are a hassle but nun the less we used them. For about the last year we have gone without condoms.

 

I will share with you, I have been tested and everything is good "negative". It is definitely more fun without condoms, I have the same concerns as you. They do not play with any one else nor do I.

 

I do not have a girl friend/wife at the moment which is really not my preference to tell you the truth, it just happens to be the situation.

 

When I find a girl friend, will I still swing with them? If she is into it yes, but I will not push the issue either...that is another story all together...

 

She, the wife of my swing friends, has her regular check ups and she has had no lurking little bugs, fortunately.

 

We are lucky that we have an exclusive swing thing and can really enjoy the sex.

 

Just wanted to give you my 2 cents.

[Alura 2,773]

Quote

Originally posted by suntory

Ok but HOW do you know the guy your wife is screwing isn't Bi?? this is the problem or one of them!

 

You can never know for sure, Suntory, but if you take some time to get to know the people you play with, you can reduce the odds to almost nil. We believe restricting our play to couples also helps.

 

Once again, let me say that this is what we've done in the past.

 

I don't think we'd exclude a couple just because they'd played with single men, but it might cause us to get to know them a little better. It's unlikely we'd choose to play with a couple with a bi husband. Again, we'd have to get to know them and assess the risks.

[bear_n_bunny 43]

Trust is great. I trust all the couples we play with. Does that mean I should trust the couples they have played with in the past or are still playing with? Just how far should this trust extend?

 

Until there is an over the counter, immediate results, full spectrum, test for all the nasties out there, I'm not playing bearbacked. As well, I like the fact bareback play is just for Bear and I; added intimacy.

 

-- Bunny

[austxmark 41]

I rarely use condoms. My usual thought is if I do not trust you enough to have sex without a condom I do not trust you enough to have sex with one. I am thoughtful and careful but there is a risk. But I look at it this way. There are about 900,000 people in America who are thought to be HIV positive. About 500,000 of them are within the ages 35-55. Which is about 55%. Texas has 27,000 HIV cases which is about 16,200 in that age range. About 2,100 of the total 900,000 are from heterosexual contact. That makes the risk .2% which is 420 people in Texas. Take into consideration i only have sex with females and so that is half that number...i.e. - .1% or 210 people. Finally take into consideration the risk of transmission is 3.1 percent (female to male) if the women is actually HIV positive, this will leave you with a risk factor of 3.1% of 0.1% = .003% or less than one person. To look at this another way, that's 3 out of 1000 chance of contracting HIV IF THE WOMEN HAS IT. I can live with that risk as it is way less than almost anything I do. I have included the web sites where the data was obtained. Lot of numbers and maybe I messed up my calculations but at any rate the risk is very small.

 

Lancet: Probability of female-to-male transmission of HIV-1 in Thailand

[lcjtsd 20]

We just spend the weekend with our favorite playmates and discussed the subject. It was generally agreed that going bareback was not worth the risk.

 

Many of you have read out previous posts on this subject including CreamPies, etc. We have said that if you are going to do oral without everything covered up, why insist on rubbers for intercourse. This is our experience from only two months ago.

 

We enjoy MFM and met a guy at a club we frequent. He was really nice and wanted to party with us. He had only one request, he insisted on wearing a condom. Even though we like the Cream Pie experience, we decided that it would be OK and went to the room. Of course, oral sex was unprotected. He did my wife, she did him, I did her, the usual. When it came time for intercourse, he put on a rubber and we all had fun.

 

One month later, guess what...Yes...Chlymadia. Damn! Well, my wife and I went to the doctor, took some pills and now it's gone. Since our previous playtime with another was over six months ago, we know this is the guy who we caught this from.

 

What have we learned from all this?

1. Having sex with others is risky.

2. All swingers choose to take the risk.

3. You can get an STD from oral.

4. People who play "Double Standard" sex (unprotected oral and protected intercourse) are only fooling themselves.

 

This experience has solidified our attitude on this subject. The only "Safe" sex is monogamy or, if adding others, full latex body suits with air masks. Does anyone know where we can get his and hers full latex body suits? But then again, what fun would that be?

 

Please no flaming. This is our true life experience in swinging.

[DeNastyOne 15]

With so many diseases out there today and the nature of some to "hide out", there is absolutely NO WAY my Master would ever allow anyone to be with me without using one. The ONLY person who gets to go in "au natural" is my Master and only him. Age isn't a factor, there is a huge percentage of people over the age of 65 with STD's who live in homes where they have lots of unprotected sex.... just my thoughts on the subject.

[Nymph an' Satyr 22]

It’s like riding a motorcycle. Some people will never get on one. Others will ride, but always wear a helmet. But for others, feeling the wind rip through your hair is part of the whole experience.

 

Anyway, all the flaming aside- this is one of the best analogies that I've come across- I will add it to my permanent repertoire. Thx!

[reguyngirlky 15]

We only want to swing with condoms; NO amount of pleasure is worth acquiring a STD. As stated by Bunny you just never know what someone may have lurking. We know as a monogamous couple for the past four great years we are safe and clean and we certainly will stay that way.

[guitarlover 16]

Still swing virgins here at this point, but exploring. We met a guy into the lifestyle who said he would only go bare back, that skin on skin was the only way to go. That put up a red light for us, immediately. Needless to say, he didn't score that night.

 

I feel it would be best for my S.O. and I to save 'bare back' for ourselves and insist on protection for anybody else if and when that occurs for us.

A question that I still don't understand is why 'head' seems to be OK without protection, but a condom is needed for penetration. STDs can be transmitted orally, right?