Need help to clear up some feelings about swinging

[Savajo 1]

Hi team,

My husband and I have been swinging for over 10 years now. We both enjoy it a lot and we learned so much from it.

But... if course there's a but, otherwise why would I write here:) Sometimes I feel pressured into it. And I hate it. And I don't know how to keep having this conversation with my husband.

I constantly feel like I would disappoint 3 people if I dont participate. And my husband and I kept having this conversation that I hate expectations on the night. It just kills my mood. And he gets all excited and asks if I'm excited and that makes me feel like I have to "deliver". And I just like to go with a flow. When I explain how I feel, he says it's all in my head. That yes he's disappointed, but it's up to me. And I feel like it's a confusing message. "Yes I'm disappointed, but you have to deal with it and I'm not forcing anything."

I find it very frustrating. We are locked in our own feelings that might harbor resentment. 

I'll give you an example. We were setting up a date to meet a new couple on Friday. They kinda flaked on us. So hubby suggested if they don't come do we want to meet a couple we know already. At the time I'm getting our kid ready for school and I've got a job interviews today and tomorrow. I honestly answer that I'm not in the right space of mind right now, I didn't give it any thoughts yet and frankly don't really care right now. After everything is sorted i text saying yes, I thought about and let's meet with the other couple. The other couple texts us saying they are keen and he's got viagra (cause he needs it sometimes). Hubby says did you see the texts, are you excited. I explain that it's putting expectations again. Then he says that I should've stopped it before it because a big thing and the other guy got viagra. How was I supposed to know he had that in mind? Why is it my responsibility to manage expectations? I was just thinking let's have drinks and see how the night go. And all of the sudden I'm the one who gave an impression it's going to be something big.

Please don't get me wrong. I do love swinging. And I'm having fun, and I think I marriage is so much stronger because of it. But I just wish we had a better way to communicate. 

Is it me? Is it all in my head? Does anyone else have the same issues or have suggestions how to deal with it?

Thanks:)

[AndrewandAnn 360]

This is a good post. And the situation you are describing is fairly universal in most relationships, both inside and outside of the lifestyle.

 

Ann and I have a theory by which we live:

 

Most problems in relationships occur due to unfulfilled expectations. When one has an expectation that ___________ (fill in the blank) is going to happen, and it doesn't, one is disappointed. Often that disappointment turns into resentment. Unresolved resentments often manifest themselves in conflict. It can be a vicious cycle that screws up the best relationships.

 

It appears your husband has the expectation that you will be as immediately excited and invested in the prospect of having sex with another couple as is he. When he perceives you aren't, he is disappointed.

 

It appears you have the expectation that your husband appreciates you simply want to go a little slower and, more importantly, that he is understanding and respectful of your feelings. When you perceive he isn't, you are disappointed.

 

Managing expectations (i.e., setting realistic expectations; communicating expectations; resolving differences in expectations, etc.) is, therefore, essential to having healthy, well functioning relationships.

 

My suggestion? Set a time during an innocuous part of the day to have an open and frank conversation around your expectations. Lay all your collective  expectations out on the table and have a conversation around them. Avoid the blame game. Simply try to understand where he is coming from and, likewise, he to understand where you are coming from. Then discuss where the differences exist and work out a plan to accommodate each other. Start with the easiest things first. Build consensus and momentum. Solving the easy stuff will make solving the harder stuff a lot easier.

 

Note that trying to have this conversation in the "heat" of planning an evening with another couple is not going to work. It needs to be when both of you are calm and swinging (sex) is not immediately on your minds. When sex is on our minds, our prefrontal cortexes get hijacked by our lizard brains. Our ability to reason and be objective gets overpowered by our desire to satisfy our sexual urges. 

 

It would probably be a good idea to involve an outside therapist or counselor to assist you with this. Frankly, I would imagine this kind of thing is present in other areas of your relationship, too.

 

Lastly, here is some food for thought on a topic where a lot of couples can get tripped up: feelings.

 

You can be respectful and understanding of how others (i.e., your husband, your friends, your swinging partners, etc.) feel. However, you are not responsible for their feelings. You didn't cause them to feel anything. Their feelings are of their own creation. You have every right to proceed at your own pace, and to establish your own limits, regardless of how they may react to it.

 

Likewise, you are responsible for your own feelings. Nobody else causes you to feel a certain way. Others can be respectful and understanding of your feelings. But, they are not responsible for how you feel. Your feelings are of your own creation.

 

When we take responsibility (ownership) for how we feel, we take back the power we have been giving away to others. It's a profound change. It alters how we relate to others and how others relate to us.

 

Best of luck to you. I'm sure everything is going to be okay 🙂

 

Edited December 2, 2021 by AndrewandAnn

[Fitlakecouple 451]

1 hour ago, AndrewandAnn said:

This is a good post. And the situation you are describing is fairly universal in most relationships, both inside and outside of the lifestyle.

 

Ann and I have a theory by which we live:

 

Most problems in relationships occur due to unfulfilled expectations. When one has an expectation that ___________ (fill in the blank) is going to happen, and it doesn't, one is disappointed. Often that disappointment turns into resentment. Unresolved resentments often manifest themselves in conflict. It can be a vicious cycle that screws up the best relationships.

 

It appears your husband has the expectation that you will be as immediately excited and invested in the prospect of having sex with another couple as is he. When he perceives you aren't, he is disappointed.

 

It appears you have the expectation that your husband appreciates you simply want to go a little slower and, more importantly, that he is understanding and respectful of your feelings. When you perceive he isn't, you are disappointed.

 

Managing expectations (i.e., setting realistic expectations; communicating expectations; resolving differences in expectations, etc.) is, therefore, essential to having healthy, well functioning relationships.

 

My suggestion? Set a time during an innocuous part of the day to have an open and frank conversation around your expectations. Lay all your collective  expectations out on the table and have a conversation around them. Avoid the blame game. Simply try to understand where he is coming from and, likewise, he to understand where you are coming from. Then discuss where the differences exist and work out a plan to accommodate each other. Start with the easiest things first. Build consensus and momentum. Solving the easy stuff will make solving the harder stuff a lot easier.

 

Note that trying to have this conversation in the "heat" of planning an evening with another couple is not going to work. It needs to be when both of you are calm and swinging (sex) is not immediately on your minds. When sex is on our minds, our prefrontal cortexes get hijacked by our lizard brains. Our ability to reason and be objective gets overpowered by our desire to satisfy our sexual urges. 

 

It would probably be a good idea to involve an outside therapist or counselor to assist you with this. Frankly, I would imagine this kind of thing is present in other areas of your relationship, too.

 

Lastly, here is some food for thought on a topic where a lot of couples can get tripped up: feelings.

 

You can be respectful and understanding of how others (i.e., your husband, your friends, your swinging partners, etc.) feel. However, you are not responsible for their feelings. You didn't cause them to feel anything. Their feelings are of their own creation. You have every right to proceed at your own pace, and to establish your own limits, regardless of how they may react to it.

 

Likewise, you are responsible for your own feelings. Nobody else causes you to feel a certain way. Others can be respectful and understanding of your feelings. But, they are not responsible for how you feel. Your feelings are of your own creation.

 

When we take responsibility (ownership) for how we feel, we take back the power we have been giving away to others. It's a profound change. It alters how we relate to others and how others relate to us.

 

Best of luck to you. I'm sure everything is going to be okay 🙂

 

Most problems in relationships occur due to unfulfilled expectations. When one has an expectation that ___________ (fill in the blank) is going to happen, and it doesn't, one is disappointed. Often that disappointment turns into resentment. Unresolved resentments often manifest themselves in conflict. It can be a vicious cycle that screws up the best relationships.

 

Jumping of this theme - the way to avoid the expectation trap is to make 'agreements'. As in, I agree to have drinks with couple ABC. If at the last minute you pull the plug - you have broken an agreement - and the other party has a right to be disappointed, etc. But, if you follow thru and meet for drinks you have kept to the agreement. If the other party has other unspoken expectations about what might happen after drinks - that is on them, not you.

That said, it can be incredibly frustrating when trying to make connections and the only response back is 'we'll see' or 'let's play it by ear', 'let's see how I feel saturday', etc.

[enhancer 1,586]

Good communication is being able to be honest and open with each other, actually hearing what each other is saying and respecting what each other is saying!  It does not sound like that is what is happening here.

 

Personally I would take a break from all the lifestyle play and expectations that are clearly coming with it until the communication part is fixed.  

One thing we both agree on is that anything we do that is lifestyle related comes with no expectations from each other or the people we meet!  Maybe that disappoints other people, but we don’t really care.  We are only in control of our own feelings and don’t owe anything to anyone else other then each other.

The day that the lifestyle becomes more important to one of us then our relationship together is the day I am out.

[GoldCoCouple 4,068]

We agree with Enhancer: Your communication is damaged. It sounds like you are saying how you feel...some of the times, and he is hearing what you say...some of the times, but the rest of the times it isn't working. Ms. Gold and I don't have very many surviving rules, but the few we do have are applicable here, and the rules are not just for sexual situations, but for everything:

 

Never move faster than the slowest member is comfortable with

Always ask permission (including if the other is interested or not in a couple)

No means no (and this isn't just saying no to something sexual...if either of us are not 'feeling it' with another couple, we can say no and we move on to the next couple...no explanation expected or required)

If one of us wants to take a break, then we both are taking a break until that person is interested in continuing again

No expectations other than enjoying a night out with our partner (sex is never expected or required)

 

Our rules are not just for swinging, but for everything. There are times when one of us may feel like the other isn't comprehending what we are saying, and it is okay...no, required for the other to say that they don't feel like they are being understood.

 

It sounds to us that he's having fun right now and doesn't want you to rain on his parade which, in turn, is taking more of the fun away from you making you feel bad about it. He may SAY he isn't forcing you to do anything, but he IS forcing you to play along in a passive-aggressive way. You both need to take a break from swinging until you can get back on the same page. It may take a week, it may take several years (especially when you have kids involved), but it is more important that you fix the relationship before it gets too damaged. You can always return to swinging later...lots of swingers take breaks and eventually come back...and some don't but that's okay too. Swinging should ENHANCE your relationship, not become a central part of it. Sprinkles on the ice cream sundae of your love...the sprinkles are not necessary, but they make it just a bit better by being there. Take some time to reconnect before things start to really break down. Good luck and let us know how things go.

 

[Fundamental Law 2,903]

One of the best things about LS couples is that they grasp the importance of clear and open communication. The standards discussed here are simply that much higher than we ever see most vanilla couples of our ken. Much better to hold to high communication standards and acknowledge when one falters than to ignore the need and benefit of those standards.