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I'm going to admit the girls do talk. Not only do we talk we can be be more open than guys are. I think me and my friends can get pretty raunchy when we are talking. In talk, sizes are talked about. I think we all say size doesn't matter but in girl talk it is takked about. Maybe it's done for laughs, there is some truth to it. And guys, if you only went 20 seconds, we did laugh about it. We have joked about how much you ejaculted, how hairy you are,sounds you make, and if you are good going down. Sorry if this makes guys uncomfortable but I think we are more open than all your locker talk. BTW, my husband is the best lol.

I'd have to list intelligence as one of the most attractive features of the folks we played with. Our "dates" usually included dinner. The conversations normally lead to more understanding and honed the attractions. Without that, we probably wouldn't have played.

Haha, I don't play with younger guys and say this all the time. Your post prompted me to think why, and I think it's that I don't want to be a that'll-do option, I want to feel like I'm insanely hot and completely irresistible.

I have had male friends tell me to stay away from a certain woman. I was told that she was a "dead fish" in bed, and then played with her a few weeks later. He was 100% right, she laid there completely silent, with her eyes closed, and didn't move. I felt like I was fucking a blow up doll. After about 10 minutes I just gave up. If a woman isn't into it, I have a very difficult time getting into it. Me and my wife try to never speak bad about anyone else in the lifestyle, and try to change topics when others do. Women may talk more, but guys do talk.

Some people here have probably seen my previous posts about our experiences with Mrs. E's long-time friend and her significant other ("husband" for simplicity). The conversation had started gently a year or two after she let it slip during a girl talk phone conversation that I had a related fantasy, and when we were visiting them in Vegas in the fall, Mrs. E's friend made it known that her and her husband sometimes played with another couple and that we were invited to hang out at their pool if we were inclined. This was what she needed to get started, since she was comfortable with her friend and friend's husband, and while we kept the night "soft", she tried and learned a lot. The following night we connected with that couple alone and did our first full swap. In the spring, we met up with her friend and husband again and spent a long weekend at a vanilla resort, which also went unexpectedly great. They gave us the space we needed to enjoy the city and still have plenty of playtime with them. No tension at all. So now fall is rolling around again and they're suggesting we all meet up in Palm Springs. Us, them, and the third couple. I've been to Palm Springs, Mrs. E hasn't. I know it's smallish and it's implied there will be a lot more free time hanging around the resort than on our last trip to a busier area, but overall, I like the idea and think with two couples there, it might actually be just as easy for any of us to get some alone time when we need it. She likes it, too. However, she only had some soft play with both the husband and the wife from the third couple. We both like the wife, they got some girl-talk bonding in after playing before she played with the husband and they've stayed in touch, and we have no strong opinions about the husband. He was in her mouth while I was behind her for Mrs. E's first "spit roast", and that's about the extent of our connection with him. Point is, she's maybe overthinking full swap with them. Part of this might be because she only met them the once and hasn't seen them face-to-face in a full year. Part of this might be because the wife likes girl-on-girl play and Mrs. E is tweaking herself out about seeing her again. I've reminded her that ultimately, there's no rule that says we have to do full swap with them or that she has to indulge with the wife, but I get the same answer I often get about going to a club. "We can't go there and just NOT, that would be weird." Anybody have any advice to put her at ease? Should we have a conversation with somebody, here? She isn't typically a very direct person and I don't think she wants to talk to the third wife about how she feels about it. I've put off the decision as long as possible, she doesn't want to say 'no' and really wants to go to Palm Springs, but it's time to buy tickets.

After a few years off from parties, I returned with a new friend in tow to help me feel more at ease. He's new to things so rather than opt for a party where I knew I'd have some friends I directed us to one neither of us had been to... then proceeded to do everything wrong. I know better. I'd just forgotten. We did a few things right and made a few mistakes as well... the mistakes had pretty big effects We arrived early (at the beginning of the party) because I hate walking into an already crowded party. I prefer to let the room fill around me so that my comfort level can increase as the party fills up. We were actually a little later than I usually try to be... yet when we walked in the room was still pretty empty... Mistake #1: We headed to a table in the back corner (in non-swinging situations this is my norm, but I forgot that in social situations it's generally a bad idea). Mistake #2: We sat down (at a table with other people). Again, I forgot. My MO for years was to not sit down (almost ever unless we knew it was with someone we were interested in), instead we'd drop our things and then proceed around the room to meet and greet anyone and everyone. Mistake #3: We stayed put. The longer you stay put the harder it becomes to get up and move around and meet people. This is a classic newbie mistake... the sitting and waiting for people to come to you... I know better...and yet I did it anyway. It's so easy in these situations to blame everyone else when you don't end up meeting people. We did meet two couples (the couple we sat down with and one other couple we'd met in the hallway on the way to the party who later joined our table), unfortunately there was no mutual interest with either couple. At first I couldn't figure out what had gone wrong and wanted to blame the party. "It was like these people just came with the people they wanted to play with... there was that one guy who came over to say hi, but his wife wouldn't even leave their table of friends.....). However, looking back and after re-reading my own damn book I realized it was all on me, because I knew better. Needless to say our next party went very differently... sit, we did not. Meet people, we definitely did. Have a great time? Oh yeah. Even old hands need a refresher course when it's been a while.

If you are speaking of the instinct to have multiple partners, then I see your point. It would not be practical or wise for a person recognizable in popular culture or public service to show himself or herself at a swingers' club or even a private swing party.

Alura, regret that we didn't meet when your spouse was alive. We suspect it would have been a delightful and memorable acquaintance. While many in the LS look forward to brief interactions focused on NSA play, we approach others -- and our times with them-- rather differently. Among body parts, we are more interested in the organ between the ears before those between the cheeks.

I'll agree that there is an army of single men, and married men posing as single men, wanting to be in the LS. But the overall quality is so low, that a dedicated, educated and articulate man can do quite well. If a couple is looking for a single guy, they are looking online. It's too difficult to navigate a bar full of potential candidates and the success rate is low. It's very easy to get the attention of a couple with the right ad. I have no idea how a single guy in a club would do but judging by the attitude I have seen here over the years, I'd skip it. It may work for you though, Good luck.

Not talking about getting laid. I'm talking about familiarizing yourself among the "real swingers". Get the vibe of things and see what it's like actively being part of the scene. I understand and do not disagree with you. Yes, the single males are highly represented and most turn out to be fakes or a-holes. Not me and in case there's a dude reading this who is also not a douche bag maybe I can help. To counter your point though: Couples have told me many many times that the good single males stick out and are rare. Which makes a good single male something of an asset. Also couples talk about issues with other couples and also meeting the right single gal. So, there's no absolutes and there are always outliers. I think you're just a Debbie downer. A super hot and incredibly sexy Debbie Downer so I ain't mad at ya. Best of luck TO EVERYONE!!!

Yes, like Dan63 says, somebody already a member of the group nominates you after which a group owner or group moderator approves you.

Just by way of an update, things are going great so far. We arrived yesterday afternoon beat up from the flights, but she loves the scenery, and we didn't realize the third couple wouldn't be arriving until today. That gave her a little time to adjust and for us to get our clocks reset. Happy to say we didn't waste much time, our play partners kept us up late last night. We still woke up early this morning, she's out by the pool and I'm just finishing up a couple of things that popped up while we were travelling before I shut down at work for good. Thanks again for the encouragement.

For us the secret was to find the first "secret group" and then from there we were able to network out to many others. How do you find that first group? Generally through networking. Talk to people at your local swingers club or other locals in the LS. Sooner or later you will locate someone that is member of one of the groups and they will add you, and from that point it is just a matter of being friendly and building your network.

The guy was a sneak! In a group situation as described, one should assume condom use unless it's been previously discussed and agreed upon. Who cares if they are "condom optional"? He was trying to put his dick in you, he should have asked first. We are not big fans of condoms and are past concerns about procreation. Still, any sleezeball can pay admission to a club or get an invitation to a party. He clearly didn't care about your concerns so we totally agree with putting him on the top of your "do NOT play" list. He is untrustworthy. We enjoy bareback with very VERY select friends but we have never ever engaged in penetration with a couple without a clear understanding of their standards and without total agreement between us all.

I think a lot of people put in their profiles that they don't have sex on the first date to cut down on people expecting it to happen. That way if things work out and they want to, they can and all is good... but it's a whole lot easier to just say goodbye, maybe we'll see you later and end the night and move on when there's no expectation. Most people are NOT good at blatantly stating "hey guys, nice to meet you but there's no interest here." And for others, in a couples situation, it may give them more ease to be able to go home and talk about it more rather than to try to communicate non-verbally that they are/not into the couple before their partner commits them to something they aren't totally into.

My ex put an abrupt end to our playing after several years of activity. To be fair, we were never super active. While we went to a lot of parties and clubs, we only had maybe two full swaps and he was only ever open to playing with couples where it was all or none (which limited things a great deal). Looking back, I don't think he was ever fully comfortable with the lifestyle. That said, it was (and probably always will be) part of who I am and taking that away put a huge dent in our communication. It was far from the thing that lead to our split, but probably played a role, just as my realization of how much I missed it played a role (but there were a lot of other contributing factors). As others said, not everyone is wired for this lifestyle (including some who really want to be).