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Our journey. The wife and I have started talking lately about spicing up our sex life. We did some research and pulled the trigger to do a lifestyle cruise in Nov this year. Once we pulled the trigger we swapped between being very anxious to let’s hit the gym and find some sexy outfits for her. Last weekend we went to Vegas and I asked her to go to a club. At first, she was very hesitant and felt like we were rushing. I wanted to know before the cruise what we were getting into. It was my birthday weekend and she said we could go but no promises on how long we stay. We had a Vegas show to see that night and the plan was to go right after the show. She wore a skin tight black dress that had me going immediately. After the show we went straight to the car and headed the 11 miles to the club (Red Rooster). I digitally worked her to ease her nerves and mine. She was wet and it seemed to help. As we pulled close to the club which requires you to go thru an almost empty part of town that heighten our nerves and were we being crazy. We reached the club and there were 40 cars parked on the street, and they have a parking lot that was packed with more. This was much more than we were expecting. We entered with our hearts racing. I grabbed her hand wondering if I had just put the love of my life at risk. Inside was a dance floor packed with normal people having a good time. We went to the sitting area where 2 girls without tops were making out. Our nerves decreased. We continued into a room which had a few single males standing over something we could not see, but it felt creepy and I took her out. Nerves back up. We then headed for the dance floor and danced several dances. We had a large breasted blonde who danced next to us and kept taking her top on and off. My wife’s nerves diminished as she was openly grinding on my pants and allowing me to openly fondle her. We then headed upstairs where there were 4 couches facing each other and 1-2 couples on each couch. Off to the side was the couples’ area. I led my wife there but to enter you had to be naked. She said she just was not ready and the nerves started to escalate. We went back to the couches and found a seat. A couple next to us was rubbing each other. All the couples were gorgeous. I started fingering my wife and she allowed it. Then to my surprise she started rubbing me and pulled my member out and went to town. Other couples were doing the same thing. Some were watching my wife. We played with each other for awhile and then my wife said she wanted to go back to the hotel and fuck. We left the building and she exclaimed “I can do this! I am so proud of myself.” We headed back and all she could talk about was how exciting it was. We made it back to the hotel but never slept that night. While we never connected with any other couple’s that night the experience already greatly enhanced our sex life. We spent the rest of the weekend shopping for sexy outfits for her. We can’t wait til Nov… Is this a normal start? Should we expect the same from the cruise?

Personally I find desperation extremely unattractive and that is one of the reasons I felt that our online were a waste of time.

Just as a quick update...first thanks so much for the advice and comments. We have been talking and we are making progress. I think it was a lot of the 'shock" of realizing I could be totally into this couple with his 'hurt' after our last long time effort didn't pan out (whole other story-short version, spent tons of time talking with this couple, making plans, met twice for dinner - they were from out of town- and hubby and the other wife had a great connection...then they ghosted on us). He is looking for a 'girlfriend' out of swinging. Now, it took me a bit to understand what he meant...but I'm 100% positive now that he is after that NRE...sex is almost secondary to what he's looking for. And I fully recognize that is something I can't give him. After all, we've been together 30 years! So When I was all about the sex...he struggled to understand that. Again...we seem to have switched roles here...or at least what the guy/girl roles traditionally look like. As a very traditional guy, I think he struggles with that as much as anything! We are still on hold, although he has said if I wish to have a girl/girl experience with this lady of the couple, I am free to do so, as long as I give him all the lovely details. So I am considering that, but taking my time with it. Ultimately, he would really like to be there to participate, but is not yet ok with me doing the same with the other couple. I believe that has more to do with his first impression of the guy (on the loud side, although very pleasant and respectful... Plus the other is a tattooed guy with a funky beard which hubby has issues with....hubby's issues are weird I know, but whatever!) I think if he had found that NRE connection with the lady of the couple, we would have been all in. At least this way, we are doing a lot of learning and communicating, which is never a bad thing!

Consent implies the ability to make an informed decision. It evolves over time. It demands an understanding of the consequences of the decision, both short term and long term. I can ask most nine year olds whether they would like to have an ice cream cone, and then ask whether they want vanilla or chocolate. Those who are lactose intolerant or have juvenile diabetes know the consequences of eating ice cream, consequences that do not affect the population at large. They are in a position to consent to the ice cream. Sex and other intimate behaviors also have consequences. The problem is that the landscape of intimacy is decidedly unfamiliar to young people. They do not know they have the right to say "no" at any time. They are unfamiliar with the physical and emotional consequences of intimacy. They rarely understand the risks of pregnancy or of sexually transmitted infections. Above all, they do not understand the connections among intimacy, vulnerability, and power. The fact that there exists an "age of consent" is intended to provide some assurance that they understand what it means to consent to sex and other intimate behaviors. That assurance is weak at best. Society owes it to young people that sex and intimacy should begin on terms they understand, and is not pressured. Age matters. However, understanding and reasoning matter more.

Yes, this is a normal start. The perceived fear is almost always greater than the reality. You have now stepped across that line and discovered that simple fact. While it's not for everyone, it can fun to be sexy and sexual with others around. The secret is having a relationship that is strong enough to be able to allow your defenses down so you can both enjoy it. Let us know how that cruise goes!

There are SO MANY single men looking for...well, anything, that they constantly are sending emails to everyone just hoping that one will provide a bite. Even thought the odds are huge that they will find a couple interested in them, there's still that small chance that some couple will respond ("so you are saying I still have a chance"). This same thought process is what keeps the lottery alive as well. As long as sending emails are free for these single men, couples not looking for single men will keep getting them. DELETE

Rules usually evolve, this is normal. They are usually set at a point where someone is concerned that there could be a problem...but all too often when you get there you find out it really isn't a problem. Just remember, do not change the rules when you are in a situation. Discuss rule changes in a non-sexual environment with just the two of you. Oh, and even if you could plan this, it almost always goes off script as soon as it starts. Have fun and let us know how things went for you both. Good luck.

Just go with the flow. Have few expectations going in (other than having fun,) and see what develops. Just make sure you don't violate any rules you have as a couple. It'll be fine!

Other than the biological urge identified by njbm, I'm wondering has this ever worked? Actually, here is a better question: has anyone actually decided to connect with a single male despite posting a profile that says "couples only"? I know I haven't. Makes me wonder what is the success rate of this approach is.

My wife and I have discussed going to a club and exploring our sexuality for years. Talking about bisexual encounters gets us going in bed. We were in town for our night out over the holidays, and she brought it up again. She either wanted to go to a strip club or a lifestyle club. I chose some options presented them to her for some research and she chose a local lifestyle club. I then sent her some etiquette information and a post or two from here to review. The info on this board is very instructive. We had our talk last night, talked about fears and desires, and set our rules. I told her this first time was all about her and she appreciates that. Then, at the end, she said that she was actually worried that she would love it and go all nympho. That could be fun. Then we fucked like rabbits. The sex life is defiantly better fantasizing about swinging. Can’t want to see what it is like after our first visit next weekend.

Two seemingly disparate questions. Both get to the notion of partnership. Partners keep the line of communication open, no matter how hurtful it might seem. Going to bed mad with the communication line open usually results in "It hurts when you won't hold me." "Maybe you should hurt--you hurt me." "Can we break the cycle of hurting each other?" After a few turns of conversation, one or the other says what they're really angry about and the issue is addressed if not resolved. The only exception is when one or both parties is too tired to have a rational conversation. Communication also includes disclosures of wants and needs. "I want to have sex with someone besides you" might sound like a horrible thing to say--but it's a lot better than not disclosing that want and cheating. The quest for sexual alternatives--if not variety--is biologically hard-wired, and it makes a lot more sense to get those fantasies out on the table. Once exposed, they are a lot less threatening. And in a partnership, it's fun to fulfill the other's fantasies. Not every day, but enough.

I enjoy just about any position, but spend most of my time on my back, naked, with my legs spread and up in the air. Seems most natural/comfortable for both parties in an MF situation.

Now, honestly, if my wife said that to me I'd be on cloud nine. When we did swing, she was usually pretty reserved and quiet about what she enjoyed or wanted to do. But I can understand your apprehensions. It sounds like this came out of the blue. Like Luvin eye full wrote, take your time and discuss it more. And, hey, talking it out can be lots of fun too. Your wife sounds like a gun lady and you just might have as much fun as she will. OK, one more thought, she hasn't told you which of your friends are swingers but give some thought to all of your friends and see if there isn't a wife or two that you just might love to have sex with.