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Looking for general advice on this. Backstory, Mrs 2B and I have been happily married 5 yrs 7 total. We had our first lf experience together in November. I had some previous experience with any ex of mine who was bi. We had many threesomes,a gf for a year, and 2 soft swaps. My wife is bi, been in relationships with females before. So in November, one of my best friends D (old co worker now at different location, same co.)and his wife J were apparently discussing getting to know me and mrs 2b a little better. We were already each other's go to couple for double dates, family gatherings, even the last 2 thanksgivings. We each have 3 kids who's ages rival each other. Great friends to nough of us. D had told me before of the few threesomes they had before. It had been a while and his wife mentioned to him that she was attracted to my wife. Both wives are very sexy, so my buddy and i almost instantly agreed that we have no problem if our wives got it on. A week later we had our first soft swap at their house. It was great. My and mrs2b fucked like rabbits for a week. It was the same for them. It was really erotic and everyone was comfortable. We had a second encounter 2 weeks ago and it was great again. We started kinda late that night tho, so no new boundaries broken. To the point, so the next day i Gerry s text from D asking if we'd like check outTrapeze, which the wife and i had already planned to do. So we agree. J (the girls chat almost daily) asks my wife what our limits and rules are? At that point we hadn't outlined any rules just going with the flow. My wife had mentioned she was neutral on whether she wanted to full swap as was I honestly. I felt no jealousy during our 2 soft swaps, i kinda view oral as foreplay, not that extreme to me. Thinking of intercourse however makes me a little nervous. I am turned on by it. Wouldnt mind trying out his wife at all in fantasy, but never considered it in reality as i truly look at J as my buddies wife, hot as she may be. Just a respect thing. Last night during a rather intense love making session with mrs2b, she says "I want to see you fuck J. Do you want to?" i said "I'm not against it, have you asked her about it?" What do you want? She says "I wanna watch" I ask "what if D doesn't just wanna watch me fuck his wife?" She says "i guess ill have to sit on it" add she's riding me. We fucked till 2am dirty talking back and forth. It was fantastic. Apparently I'm the last in the group to come around lol. I'm really ok with it, it just seems to be happening quicker than i imagined. Ive talked with my buddy who said they feel comfortable with us. I feel i need to talk with the wife when we're not fucking however to make sure everything is good. If so this next weekend may be when we cross over. Nervous and excited at the same time. Anybody else cross over with good friends? Everything's been really fun so far, don't wanna rock the boat so to say, but i am nervous and i wasn't during the soft swaps. First time jitters maybe?

While I'm in agreement about the hazards with friends, it's how we got started, too. Oral/soft and then moving quickly to full swap once we realized we were having a good time with it. Your rules are roughly the same as ours and it's worked for us. Have fun!

Quick update, I know you've all be on the edge of your seat waiting to hear what happened next. We had the opportunity to get together with our friends last Friday. I had expressed in our group chat that I was planning to slow things down. I wasn't sure where that stood to be honest because I never received much feedback. It was as if it wasn't really an issue to her. Even though she never really expressed an option on the topic I decided to follow through and slow things down. I slowed things way down, half speed and I would conclude it was a huge success. She was more vocal while we fucked than she had been in the past. We fucked three times in the same night (I didn't cum every time, we would take half hour/hour long breaks as a group) and that hadn't ever happened before. I also received more flattering messages in the days that followed than I had received in the past. She expressed just how much she had enjoyed herself and said that they couldn't wait to see us again. I feel like it's pretty obvious my slowing down lead to her enjoying herself more than she had in the past. So thanks for helping a fella fuck a little better. At the end of the day we all just wonna be able to fuck a little better, right? :-)

Hopefully we won't completely vanish off the face of the planet like the orgy couple a month back.

I think my initial apprehension is concern about any potential drama in the future. We've been good vanilla friends for over 4 years so im hoping we are able to keep that intact. Everyone was comfortable after both encounters, and its still normal. We've had a couple vanilla evenings since the last time we played. The wives are really into each other, and communicate well. The only rules we've come up with so far are condoms during penetration, and same room so we can all experience it together. I do plan to keep updates on our situation here as it unfolds. This is a great forum, I plan on sticking around in general!

Normally we warn couples to stay away from friends as well, but as you said, Pandora's Box has already been cracked open. First thing I would recommend is outlining the rules and limits and then just keep on taking it slow. There have been successful couples that play with friends, you all just have to be careful and communicate with everyone involved. Let us know how things progress...

Normally, the wisdom is don't mess with your friends. But you've already been doing that, and (up till now) there's been no repercussions. You've been taking it slow, the two of you have been communicating well with each other, the other couple is on board. Why not take the next hurdle? Your nervousness is understandable, any time you try something new and a little uncomfortable you're filled with angst.

Sounds like the sex nazis…."papers, scnell!!!!!!" We are REALLY happy we were not the other couple at the club! You've managed to reduce recreational sex to a lab report. Actung Actung!! You vill NOT have fun without PAPERS!!!!!! Seig Heil!