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We would not play with people who are cheating. In our country, sometimes the cheated upon spouse shows up with a shotgun. Call us quaint, but the fun of the lifestyle for us is doing it together with other couples who are doing it together. No adverse judgment against people who disagree, just how we roll.

No, don't do it. What happens when the wife finds out and files for divorce (imagining worse case scenarios here)? EVERYONE will know what went on. Playing with friends, especially cheating friends, are just not worth it.

First, a big welcome to the board Imnewhere8484! You are definitely in the right place for couples who are curious about swinging, and as you say, not tripping at the starting line. My wife and I would never play with a married person who is playing without permission. We're into swinging to enjoy ourselves, to enjoy each other, and to enjoy the people we have sex with. We would never...ever...want to contribute to the unhappiness of another couple. Just the thought that we are effectively backstabbing the unknowing spouse, is completely repulsive to us. Even if she never found out, it's still 100000000000% wrong. Neither my wife nor I would do it. Think of it this way; she wants this guy because she could vet him for STDs. So, do you trust a guy to tell you he has no STDs when he's willing to stab his own wife in the back? I would never trust such a person, not in a thousand years. You can find decent single guys who are in the swinging world. My wife has found several, and has been fortunate enough to have had long term relationships with two of them. I would recommend finding singles guys on swinglifestyle.com, and filter them well. As in the vanilla dating world, there are going to be some of them that aren't worth the time of day. But, there are some great guys out there to be had, guys whom you can trust. To other points; you're going to have some uneasiness whether it's this guy or another. The first time your wife has sex with another man, even if you're very much looking forward to it, it still going to be a bit of a nervous moment. Kinda like they say...the first is never the best. Same goes for swinging :-) I've watched my wife have sex with a lot of men now, and it was definitely better with subsequent men. It was better for her too, as her own nerves were on edge the first time. And there's a piece of advice for you; don't judge swinging by the first encounter. A lot of what you are saying sounds great. The communication sounds wonderful, and the desire to help her achieve her greatest sexual satisfaction is a wonderful basis on which to take your first steps into this lifestyle. Chances are, she will love having sex with other men as much as you enjoy watching her do so. If you have any other questions or thoughts you want to bounce off of us, feel free. We're a helpful bunch here.

Early in our thirty-year relationship my late wife and I decided on certain people we had permission to have sex with if the opportunity ever rose. I chose Brigitte Bardot and "Jill," my high school sweetheart. Laura chose Harry Belafonte and "Terry," the first guy who ever kissed her back in Junior High School. Well, we didn't have any luck with Brigitte and Harry, but Jill was at my high school reunion and said, "Hell, yes! I'd love to!" Jill and I spent an afternoon in a hotel room with a "Tryst Kit," which Laura had prepared. (Champagne with a corkscrew and two glasses.) We went to Laura's reunion fully intending to get her and Terry together. A spark of static-electricity jumped between their lips when he kissed her. She prolonged the kiss with a taste of her tongue, not at all like Junior High School, she told me. Unfortunately, that was all she got the whole weekend. Laura and I agreed later that he hadn't realized what was being offered. His lady was not all that friendly. If you're thinking Laura got screwed (or didn't) in this transaction, there was another time when she asked if she could add "Richard" to her "fuckable" list. We set it up for the next week when I was going to Dallas on business. She was successful that time. I'm just a hick Okie, and I don't claim to be an expert on how to succeed at swinging, but it seems to me that a couple can do almost anything without threatening their marriage. The key is to talk about it, both before and after.

If the question is, should you encourage her to have a relationship with this particular man, I see only one objection: He's married. Some people (and the two of you will have to determine this,) don't wish to enable a cheater. And from what you've said, I'm not sure if he's a cheater or in an open marriage. If it's the latter, I withdraw any objection I have. Normally, in the swinging world we don't encourage encounters with friends. However, this is not a close friend to both of you, he lives quite a distance away so if any feelings are 'caught,' logistics will be hard to overcome. I'd say this man is as safe as any for your wife to have an encounter with. Best of luck.

Folks, let's not give this fire any more oxygen. The quote above demonstrates possible significant psychological trauma or damage that this individual may have suffered at some time in the past. In fact, it is almost pathognomonic for what used to be termed, in the DSM-V, as "narcissistic personality disorder". The OP has responded to all of our attempts to redirect what amounts to triggered narcissistic rage into productive conversation by utilizing grandiose projections of himself in order that his ego not be further damaged. There is no arguing with an individual with these psychological characteristics. Focusing attention on him only increases his feelings of being "special" and "in control". No amount of logical reasoning will penetrate this pathology. In the words of the WOPR computer from "War Games", (a reference which all of you who are ancient like me will understand)....."A strange game. The only way to win is not to play." Let's not play here. Let's go play in the LS and leave the OP where he belongs....with his imaginary women, his narcissistic rage, and his self-ostracism from what is, in my mind, a vibrant and healthy community. T

I wrap mine in a tissue and put in a lined garbage basket. I have seen less sanitary people leave them around. Ick!

This is exactly how we feel. My wife doesn't want to feel like a cum dumpster for guys that don't care about her. That isn't enjoyable for her. Sex is only good for her if she likes the person she is fucking. I would think regardless of who the person is, friend or no friend, if you are fucking them, especially on a regular basis, you would have to have some sort of feelings for them. Also, with regard to my wife "seeing him behind my back", she is a very honest person and I don't think that could happen... secondly my friend lives 8hrs away from us by car, and third my wife would know I want her to fuck him so she wouldn't have any reason to hide the fact that she was going to fuck him if by chance they were together alone sometime somewhere without me.

All our MFM have became twosomes at some point, don't get me wrong practice has helped me to develop a multitasking skill but the closest I get to climax and in order to have a good orgasm I need to focus, concentrate in only one person. My husband has no problem moving away and watch me perform, he usually reaches for his phone an take a couple of pictures/videos.

Yes we are into it, it is a huge turn on for him and I love to perform for him.

I've been with talkers, with screamers, with people so silent you might think they were mute (except for heavy panting.) If everyone is having fun, don't worry about it. As far as 'I love you' goes, never had it happen in my presence. I assume it would cause a bit of an awkward silence, then if nobody was pissed (I wouldn't be,) I bet a spate of laughing would occur. I wouldn't worry about it happening, the dynamic doesn't often lead there.

I've met a lot of people who used that definition of "swinging" exclusively. I am old enough to remember the 1960s & early 70s usage as defining anyone engaging in NSA sex as a 'Swinger'. Be its singles who had serial partners, couples swapping, or singles and couples in groups of various combinations. I left the LS of a extended period after the early 1980s (drug use by others was one reason) But in retrospect the there swinger was becoming restrictive by then to couples swapping. I was never married, but had a series of girl friends who were partners in threesomes, couples swaps, and group or orgy sex. Currently have a FWB whom I meet a few times a month for LS activity. We also meet others separately & enjoy chatting about our experiences.

Part of the interest for me is the differences in how people have sex or express themselves. Just be yourself & relax. pretty much the same. While there is such a thing as 'too much information' or detail or talk, good communication is as important here as anywhere. It has happened. Don't worry about it, you won't do it.

Thanks so much for the advice!!

What about 3 singles in a MFM? Maybe I’m splitting hairs, but that’s my experience. I love it.

If you tell them it's ok to see each other on the side and play alone, they'll have no reason to do anything behind your back. Those things burn very hot for a short while and they're fucking all the time, but then it flames out. But you're left hearing the good stories. To varying degrees, my wife and I have an emotional/romantic attachment to those in the closed group of couples who we play with. One guy in particular, he and my wife even exchange "I love you"s both when fucking and when saying goodbye. It doesn't bother me or his wife that they care about one another. It's good for me that the guys she fucks don't treat her as just a cum dump, but actually like my wife to a degree the way that I do.

I always block and copy periodically when writing a post, both phone and computer. If a post is lost, you can start over and paste.

I’ve thought this for a while now, Jane. And that would be my most charitable take.

I think this Nappy little troll is playing with us. Child’s game of last word. No one here is asking him to bang non HWP women. Most people here are respectful of each other’s preferences. I am not sure what he hopes to accomplish here, he is the only one singing his praises. Are these hot women literate? Please invite them to share their view of how wonderful you are. Frawn all over you I promise not.

It's actually pretty amusing to see someone brag so much, and be so arrogant. You're just proving all of our points Nap. Anyone can jump on a forum and claim what you do. And if it happens here, I'm sure it happens in real life at clubs. It's no wonder you're butt-hurt about people rejecting you. You just don't understand that to us, physical features are great, but if there's a personality flaw, most of us simply say, no thanks. Good luck with your supposed business and girlfriend success. I'm sure were all so jealous and heartbroken because you're taking yourself out of swing clubs.

You're right, Napoleon, bi-sexual single women (whom we affectionately call, "Unicorns" because of their rarity), are much more welcome than single men. Or single heterosexual women, for that matter. If you do some searching on this Board, there are threads about heterosexual women who hope to get laid (perhaps excitingly)by someone else's husband, while she enjoys her freedom to go home afterward. As I recall, some wives took exception to this and refused to lend her man out. You see, Napoleon, Swinging is more about caring for our playmates' needs than to satisfy our own. Yes, we have fun, but most of us don't need to put down other people to accomplish that goal.

I sense a Napoleon complex going on.

My guess, Napoleon, is that you approached those folks with a friendly demeanor, after which you followed up with a lecture on how smart, financially brilliant, and sexually capable you are, just as you did with us. That's probably why you got the "don't call us" response.

Specifically, you complained that they were pleasant and happy to meet you, inviting you over to their tables, but became rude after you'd sat down and talked to them for a while. If a resume entitled "SINGLE MALE" gets you job interviews, but the job interviews end with a firm "don't call us, we'll call you", it's not the resume that's the problem. It's something about you that's only obvious once you start talking that's wrecking the interaction. I'm sure they're devastated.

Having read your posts, Napoleon, I think there are other issues you have which contribute to your lack of success in our swinging world. You exhibit symptoms of "Malignant Narcissism." Have you considered a career in Public Service?

Right, and I'm very impressed. You seem to be missing my point, which is that this is how you choose to spend your free time. Successful people focus on rewarding activities, and it raises the question of what reward you're getting out of your behavior. Most people are here to learn how to have more fun. The obvious explanation is that you have some anger at the "swinger world" and are trying to find somebody to take it out on. You're choosing to act as a turd in the punch bowl, and the guy who enjoys that role is always a dysfunctional little twerp at heart. I'm not saying that to be mean. I finally went back and reviewed your post history, and it's unbelievably clear that you have an ax to grind with "swingers" as a whole for failing to be impressed by you and ultimately rejecting you. Your very first post, two years ago, was you complaining that you'd attended a party and that people, after talking to you for a while, would start rolling their eyes. You chalked this up to them being "rude" instead of you being, say, "annoying", "boring", "egotistical", or "obviously delusional". You're surprised by this, but also try to act like you've been coming to clubs for a long time. Then you go on to other threads and start making various extravagant claims that everybody here ignores, until you disappear for two years. Now you're back, embittered about swinging and bragging that you gave up on that "world" years ago. I was exactly right the first time. It's just not hard to read between the lines that you are desperate for approval and act scorned when it doesn't happen. Everybody who is immediately turned off by your toxic, desperate personality once they spend some time with you - which seems to be everyone you meet while attempting to swing - is therefore the problem, and old and fat and alcoholic, too. "It's not me, it's the discrimination against single heterosexual men by all those hateful women I didn't even really want to have sex with anyway! Why won't somebody tell me what I want to hear, that I'm not the problem?" This is a character defect that is repulsive to others and perpetuates your problem. Why would you ever think the things you're saying to try to impress people would actually make you attractive to them?

If Napoleon had done his homework he would have known most swingers are much more mature than him. Maybe when he walked into a club alone we were all so taken back by his beauty we were too intimidated to approach him. It sounds like he was never invited to the parties for more HWP people. There is a classy way to carry one’s self and say in your brief experience you didn’t find women you were attracted to. I politely decline playing with people I am not interested in, you are rejecting people. There is a difference and the mature members of this board understand. Not all swingers are alike and fortunately you only stayed briefly. So broad statements That you find 90% of the women unattractive or standards on bisexuality are based on very limited experience. I suspect in general you find less than 10% of women attractive. Have you seen Padoc’s wife? She is hot! She’s not bisexual and I can respect that. There are many discussions here on male bisexuality and many feel there is a double standard. People need to be honest in what they are looking for. In my geographic area I see more bisexual than straight men listed. Napoleon, why choose that as your screen name? I actually think you are a troll trying to get a reaction. I bit. Otherwise I hope you enjoyed your rant. We try not to frawn on single men, just some make it so easy.

So I'm just dying to know. As a busy real estate developer with three girlfriends, wherever do you find the free time to complain about something you claim to have no interest in on a forum dedicated to it, nevermind roleplay your thoughts about desserts like someone who spends too much time on the most socially-awkward chat rooms? Actual successful people focus on time that adds value. Why would your posts add value unless you're feeling deeply scornful over rejection in the "swinger world" and your only outlet to dig out those bad feelings is this forum? Say hello to your three girlfriends who live in Canada for me, and good luck with all your exciting real estate deals, big guy.

Now I think I get it... the problem isn't her being with another guy. The problem is her changing the plan at the last minute. If that's the case, I think that's what you need to address. Talk to her. Tell her that you don't like it when the plans change at the last minute, that you were looking forward to the event you had planned and you are disappointed. Don't try to compel, or guilt, her into doing something she isn't comfortable with. I would suggest instead suggesting that if she isn't comfortable with the MFM threesome concept, you just stop planning to do them. If she does want to try it, and backs out at the last minute again, cancel the whole thing... tell the guy that sometime came up and you can't meet, sorry for the last minute notice... then everyone's disappointed but I think that may help the conversation around how to really address this.

And there is the problem. If you are okay with this arrangement then all is fine. But I don't believe that is the case or this thread wouldn't be here. The common rule among swingers is that nothing happens without everyone's consent. You need to tell her that you don't like being left out. If she loves and respects you, she will either start to include you or stop having other men. If she continues in spite of your objections, then you know what she really thinks of you. At that point you can think about whether or not you want to end the relationship or accept your role as a cuckold.

Been there done that. You are not alone... you have to also look at it from the nature perspective. Once her body allows him to enter her something else takes over. Her body craves his seed. We had the same our first mfm that came out of a night chatting with an old friend, a massage turned into a threesome. It was quite amazing and I ended up in the same place as you. To be short, as we changed positions and he positioned himself between her legs, I pulled her panties down, he started with our permission rubbing his cock on her pussy, she got so excited she basically demanded her fuck her. He looked to me, I nodded ... an emotional roller coaster later as he could see his cock sliding in... as I listened to her sounds, breath, she grabbed my cock for a bit but then purely focused on him. As he thrusted, her eyes rolled back, she came and he kept going, I became a tourist bedside. He started to pull his cock out to unload on her out of respect for her and me, she grabs his cock sticks it back in thrusts toward him and I could hear her say..."fuck me, put your seed in me...oh, put a baby in me" and he unloaded. My cock was so hard it hurt. As I moved toward them when they were done.. same thing. Good nite honey... we slept, was awake with a super hard cock. I finally fell asleep hours later to find him spooning with her, her head arched back a bit, hard nipples and he was slowly fucking her again, I could hear their sex juices as he blew another load in her.

My wife and I haven't done the hotwife thing, but I had a nice long-term affair with a hotwife after my divorce. Our sex was incredible. I have no doubt that she shared our adventures with her husband after she got home. Good memories, even though this experience happened many years ago.

As many of the responses suggest, the issue is not politics (or religion, or sports team allegiance, or...). The issue is (in)tolerance. The toxic blend of the 24 hour news cycle and infinite numbers of electronic soapboxes has numbed our abilities to listen, compromised our abilities to think critically, dulled our willingness to edit. Rational discourse has given way to polarizing rhetoric: "you are 'for' something I am 'against'". Our vanilla and LS lives are thus diminished.

I brought up swinging. I really want to watch my husband with other women. It’s one of my biggest fantasies and if I get to be with other guys in the process it’s a win win ?

It was me Rick for sure, we started going together when we were 17, she was a sweet innocent church going Catholic virgin, I took her cherry when we were 18, we married at 21, had our family at 28 and 30, we joined a nudist club when we were early 30's and soon found out their was a lot of swinging going on ther, naturally I wanted to join in, it took a lot of talking but the wife finally went with her first EVER other guy when we were 35 and married 15 years, what a Pandora's box I opened, it was very sexy and fun seeing my 35 year old wife exploring her new found sexual freedome, she had me biting my tongue a few times with some of the things she got up to. We are now mid 70's, married 55 years and still very much in love, our playing with others has slowed to almost "ALMOST" a stop, but we sure have had a wonderful and exciting sex life. Rick.

I've always thought it would be quite a thrill to have a gangbang but 10 May be too many lol. Maybe 5 or 6.

I guess it depends on what hubby thought and if he got real turned on by it. I'm curious from your female perspective how it was for you playing separately with another guy. Were there ever times another guy was technically better in bed than hubby, but still not the same as being with hubby?

Glad you enjoyed your gangbang! Every woman I've known who has done one has loved it. It's L's favorite flavor, too. She loves being the center of attention for a group of guys. Each guy get her more and more turned on, so by the time the other guys are worn out, I get the best sex of the evening. L gets so hot from gangbangs that she's almost insatiable, so the local guys nicknamed her "the legendary Miss L." We've hosted many, many gangbangs over the years. Folks who have questions about them are welcome to contact us and ask.

We joined a small swinger group here on the gulf coast a while back. Our little club is Jade Pleasure Club. Right now there are three couples and 3 single men who are members.

We've enjoyed mfm for years and my hubby likes for me to suck him while I'm being fucked. He enjoys watching me being satisfied.