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This topic is going to be around for a long time. Here's a somewhat different perspective on the vaccination thread. 1. When the virus first surfaced, no one had immunity. The virus spread rapidly, and felled many of the most vulnerable. 2. Prior to the vaccine, the virus continued to spread contained only by social distancing, masks, handwashing and so on. As those preventive measures were relaxed, the virus spread faster. We learned how many would get sick in the July-August "second wave". 3. By the time the third wave started, a couple of things happened. Vaccine started to make its way into use, and there was focus on those vulnerable patients remaining alive. Moreover the number of people mildly infected or asymptomatically infected had grown to the point that the virus started having trouble finding a non-immune host. Put differently, the effective R number started dropping towards 1. What we're seeing in the hospital and in the intensive care units are the "unlucky unvaccinated". These are individuals who, as a matter of random chance, missed getting infected in the first year or so of the pandemic. This is not unlike the situation with any other respiratory virus--in any given year, some people simply escape infection rather than having low-grade or asymptomatic infection--and then get infected on the next round. Unfortunately, some of these people will have especially horrific infections. See, for example, https://www.webmd.com/vaccines/covid-19-vaccine/news/20210618/man-refusing-covid-vaccine-later-needs-lung-transplant It's not just SARS-CoV-2, the cause of COVID. As social distancing has relaxed, we are seeing a off-seasonal spike in other respiratory infections. See https://www.webmd.com/lung/news/20210614/with-covid-easing-germs-are-on-the-hunt-for-us The uptake of vaccine among practicing physicians speaks to the their level of concern. 96% is "nearly all". Some nurses have declined. From personal knowledge, those who work in the front lines are far more accepting than those who do not have direct daily patient contact. That's our general sense, and emphatically not based on systematic collection of data. The bottom line is that a substantial number of people --at least in the USA--are going to continue to decline the vaccine. Most will be lucky. Some will be unlucky and end up in the hospital, in the ICU and so on. As the Delta variant becomes prominent in the USA, we think there may be an uptick in those serious cases as the variant is at least a bit more transmissible (that is why it is becoming the dominant strain) and likely causes slightly more severe illness. The current vaccines are at least partially protective, and for COVID partial protection means not ending up in the hospital, in the ICU, on life support. The next uptick could be as early as the fall season. Cooler weather favor respiratory illness, and we will likely see an uptick in transmission as kids return to face-to-face classes. Kids typically (but not always!) have milder infections. Kids also will have difficulty maintaining distancing. Unless they are vaccinated, transmission will be probable. And then we will get into the wintertime "influenza like illnesses". It's going to be an interesting 12 months ahead. Our perspective is that the vaccines are the best countermeasures that we have, and we will continue to roll up our sleeves as the seasonal influenza vaccine is rolled out, the COVID booster is rolled out, etc. We understand the concerns, and nothing is risk free. But we also have looked at the numbers, and the numbers tell us that we are at far less risk from a serious reaction to any of the vaccines than we are from the viruses themselves. We are headed to a gathering of LS people in about 5 weeks. We expect all will be vaccinated.

SEIU also opposed mandatory influenza vaccination for health workers about a decade ago.

Same here. A few guys with greater skills than me have made my wife squirt. I once made another guy's wife squirt with vaginal intercourse at a swing club many years ago. It was a first and a last for me, but I understand she was very prone to squirting orgasms so I didn't let it inflate my ego. Plus, the substances I've seen emitted do not seem to be pee although I honestly don't know its composition.

Kathy squirts almost every time she orgasms, which is to say almost every time she has sex. (She’s a super easy cummer.) She always puts a doubled-over beach towel under her ass so as not to soak the linens and mattress. She experienced orgasms from the time she began masturbating as a pre-teen and in her late teens had an orgasm the first time she had intercourse. (Anecdotally that seems fairly rare.) But she didn’t begin squirting until she was post-menopausal. At the same time, she reported her orgasms were stronger and seemed to last longer than ever before. It would be easy to conclude she was urinating. That the combination of the aging of the muscles that control the bladder and the stronger orgasms lead to a partial voiding. But, even if she pees, gets immediately into bed and masturbates herself to orgasm — which generally takes less than two minutes (yeah, I sheepishly confess that I’ve timed her. ?☺️) she still soaks the towel with something that doesn’t smell like urine. So, I don’t know, I’m still agnostic on whether squirting is a form of urinating or if there is some fluid that is mysteriously released by the contractions that are part of orgasm. For my own part I choose to honor the soaked towel as a manifestation of a wonderfully intense and fulfilling experience on Kathy’s part.

A few men have successfully elicited this response from my wife. She was surprised that she could do it. She said it was a pleasant feeling of release, but less powerful than an orgasm. There is a finger movement/placement technique to elicit it, but it has eluded me without formal training. You Tube?

All this Covid / vaccine chat is a boner killer. How 'bout if you want the vaccine - get the vaccine. And, if you don't want the vaccine - pass on it. And leave it at that.

1199 SEIU United Health Care Workers East is the nation's largest health care union, representing more than 450,000 nurses, pharmacists, nurse practitioners, physician assistants, laboratory technicians, radiological technicians, dieticians, and other medical professionals, in New York, New Jersey, Massachusetts, and Florida. Anyone even remotely familiar with, for instance, the educational requirements of a nursing degree or pharmacology degree, and the state board examination requirements for licensure, would literally laugh-out-loud at the notion that these medical professionals are somehow under-educated.

Things that make you go hmm.

Both my father (now recently deceased from cancer) and my mother worked in the medical field all of their lives (father = pharmacist mother = nurse practitioner). Both were/are now retired. My mother is 94. Pretty much the highest risk group...neither got or wanted to get the vaccine. My father, before he passed, went to great lengths to be sure his death was not listed as covid related. “In addition, indemnity has been removed from most companies involved, including pharmaceutical companies, vaccine manufacturers, testing labs, and diagnostic centers, who are providing medical procedures or products." Be aware, that we are not taking a side in this, we have both had covid, and because of our jobs were required to be vaccinated in order to keep working. We are just trying to present additional information. Don't kill or attack the messenger...

Don't kill the messenger: Please watch "The Social Dilemma" on Netflix. It explains that the information you are getting is only information that backs up the viewpoint that you already have...not necessarily the truth. This is what has caused (IMHO) the HUGE rift between people the last year or so (not just about Covid, but everything in general). If you only get data that supports your belief, then you end up thinking anyone who opposes your thinking is a nut job. Not picking sides here, just trying to enlighten other people as to why you end up thinking that anyone who doesn't agree with you is totally crazy when the 'facts' point out only one result (and the facts you are being given only reinforce your already given point of view). Half the world isn't crazy, but very few are being given ALL of the facts needed to make an informed decision. On the internet: If they aren't trying to sell you something, it's because YOU are the product they are selling (aka: your data). We now return your thread to your normal topic

I used to believe all that "patriotic duty" stuff too. Then, I started noticing the number of times our gov't has misled, and outright lied to us. So, some skepticism about whatever our collective leadership tells us in certainly in order. Particularly when they pull the "it's your patriotic duty" card... It's their body - it's their choice.

Hey sorry guys just now getting a chance to see all these replies and i am not always online to check. First things first i do beliveve in science and i am not taking away from what has been said or the progress that has been made. We are not anti vaccinations and we have no objections to taking vaccines when we feel comfortable to do so. People decide to make decisions based on their own understanding and knowledge of things. We have made a choice to not decide to get vaccines as of yet and thats ok. Just like people decide not to swing and thats ok. Does our decisions affect others? Of course it has that potential but we are also open about our decisions. What is concerning is that we haven't told couple in the past that we both decided to not get the flu vaccine and let that alter our life when the flu has killed several thousands each year. We have became so mentally focused on this pandemic that we judge others based on decisions they may or may not make. I guarentee that each of your passing judgement have either not gotten or have slept with someone that has not gotten common and proven safe vaccines in the past and not even thought twice about it. We dont force others to make decisions regarding vaccines because it isnt our right to do so and this is one of those rights. If someone makes a concious decision to meet us knowing what they know then thats a decision they chose to make.