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We attended the club a few weeks back and I was totally unaware of the conspiracy going on over me between a couple we have known for sometime, my wife and a woman that came as a guest with the couple. The evening started off as normal catching up with friends, stories and laughter. I met the friend, I’ll call her Pam, she was a quiet shy woman late fourties’ short dark hair very very thin. She seemed a bit nervous but over the next hour or so at the table we all talked and in time she relaxed and joined in. While I was talking about an up coming bike ride the ladies had been talking between themselves. Something was said, we didn’t hear, that made them laugh. Pam busted out with a loud belly laugh that obviously caught her off guard…she caught herself, hand over her mouth and we all laughed more at her shocked look. That broke any remaining ice on her part. As the evening progressed people were splitting off in pairs, threesomes, foursomes and moresomes. A typical club evening. That is when the wife of the couple and my wife approached me when Pam excused herself to the ladies room. M told me about Pam, how long they have known her. How they valued their long friendship and chose to not include sharing sex play but that Pam was very curious and interested. M said she wanted her friend to have a very good experience and wanted me to ask Pam to join me. She knew I would only do what she was willing to do and not push her into things she might not be ready for. M and my wife then gave me some back ground on Pam’s past let’s just say it wasn’t pleasant and her ex was a huge Ahole. so I guess while I was busy discussing bikes, rides and an upcoming holiday ride the ladies were telling Pam about me and building her confidence. Pam returned and we started talking her and I. Just natural conversation. M her husband and my wife left together for a room and Pam and I remained. In time I asked Pam she would like to join me in a room. She looked a bit startled and blushed quite a bit. I thought I had blown it. But Pam nodded her head yes. I stood and reach out for her hand. She took mine and I walked her down to a closed room with gentle lighting, a double bed and mirrored wall. I looked at her and smiled she quietly smiled back at me and stepped into the room……. with permission from Pam I will be writing a story of this adventure later. In conversation with Pam she later explained to me the conversation she had over weeks with M and her husband and later on the phone with M and my wife. Pam’s hesitation at first but later her agreement and later meeting that evening. Her nervousness. putting this all together it was my wife and friends conspiring to pimp me out. I am flattered of course…..and greatly happy meeting Pam. But my wife pimped me out…..lol damn.

You know what? This is actually good news. He has opened up something very deep inside of him, a place where very, very few have ever been. He trusts you. He trusts you very deeply or he wouldn't be telling you this. Step by step. Build on it. If this is going where I think it might be going, he's going to love you even more deeply than before this.

If my partner isn’t interested in something I don’t say anything to try and get them to reconsider! I respect what they say and abide by it. Everything we do comes from us having great communication and listening skills with each other. If we didn’t we would not have succeeded in the things we have done together. We would have crashed and burned like some of the other couples we have known over the years that clearly did not know how to be honest and communicate with their partner.

One additional point: Should Roe vs. Wade be overturned by the US Supreme Court, the freedom to have an abortion doesn't, as some have hyperbolically declared, simply "disappear". The issue simply returns to the legal domain of the states. Each state will regulate abortion more or less consistent with the will of it respective citizens. Some have denounced this is as "un-American" (whatever that means) and insist the freedom to have an abortion must be absolute (unrestricted; so-called abortion-on-demand, and federally funded by US taxpayers) and codified into federal, universal law; law that supersedes the authorities of all 50 states to regulate abortion as they see fit. This line of reasoning is very easy to poke holes through. Some rights were so important to the Founders--rights deemed so essential they literally define what it means to be an American citizen--as to be expressly guaranteed by the Bill of Rights. One such right is the Second Amendment, the right of an individual to keep and bear arms. Note, in spite of the right to keep and bear arms being expressly guaranteed by the Second Amendment, its limits are largely defined and regulated by each state. The laws pertaining to the right to keep and bear arms in, say, California or New York, are extremely more restrictive than those in, say, Florida or Missouri. This phenomenon is not limited to the Second Amendment. Most of our rights and freedoms are subject to the individual interpretations of the states and localities in which we reside. Consider the use of marijuana, for instance. In spite of marijuana still being an illegal substance at the federal level under the Controlled Substances Act, more than 29 states have passed various laws making the use of marijuana for medical and/or personal use, legal. I don't see many so-called "pro-choice" supporters decrying the state regulation of the Second Amendment (or marijuana.) Why? Can the freedom to have an abortion be anymore important, more essential than a right expressly guaranteed by the Bill of Rights? Certainly the Founders didn't think so. I believe many, if not most, pro-choice supporters are more than happy to have the Second Amendment (not to mention marijuana) regulated by the states. I am certain they believe it is perfectly rational the people of California and New York should have the freedom to regulate firearms far more onerously than the people of Florida and Missouri. And this is exactly what the Founders intended. The United States is not a democracy; a one-size-fits-all federal government monolith where the tyranny of the many decides the fates of the few. Rather it is a constitutional representative republic consisting of a federation of states. The Founders intended each state be allowed to govern itself within a particular federal framework; each state to interpret laws and freedoms and govern consistently with the will of their respective populations. In concrete terms, it means Florida and Missouri have different interpretations of the Second Amendment than California and New York. And it means they will have different interpretations of other freedoms, including abortion. Should Roe vs. Wade be overturned and the issue of abortion returned to the states, rather than this being "un-American", our system of government is functioning exactly as intended. Should one eventually be unhappy with her state's regulation of abortion (or any other freedom), one has many remedies available--up to and including voting with her feet. More than 2,400 people EVERY DAY move to Florida and Texas, many of whom are relocating from states like California and New York. Why? Obviously, they've grown dissatisfied with the governance (i.e., policing, taxes, school choice, so-called social justice 'priorities', cost of living, and so on) of their former home states and decided to pick up stakes and move. Again, this means our system of government is functioning exactly as intended. There is a reason you do not need a domestic passport to move freely from one state to another. It is an amazing privilege to live in a country that gives us the freedom to decide not just where we live, but largely how we are governed.

Let us know how it goes I'm quite eager to hear! I'm sure we all are (not in a prurient sense)

He decided to tell me about some things he had repressed for many years one incident in particular that completely ruined his sexual confidence in his teens and he was terrified of dating and intimacy until he met me. Had I known that I never would have suggested it but he made it clear I did nothing wrong and does not blame me he kept repeating that, he thought he had a handle on it but seeing me with that man made him feel just the same way as he did back then and just wanted to run away. That's why he went to his brother that day he just needed to do a time out and get his emotions in check and I understand that now knowing what he went through what happened to him was just cruel.

Be it swinging or going out dancing are you actually trying to understand reluctance and respect their boundaries or pressuring them into doing what you want because you think it will be fun and they should enjoy it too?

Seems like an odd “general question” to be asking if there’s not a woman involved, and I don’t think I’m the only one here who took it that you’re talking about a real person. You asked how to respond to someone who’s hesitant, and I told you there are too many unknowns about her hesitation for the people on this board to be able to answer you. I don’t consider that negative … just realistic!

NC, I never said this was for me, I was just asking a general question. Since you admittedly speak for everyone here and seem rather negative, I'll move on.

First you wrote, “I am trying to show my wife what she would be in for😈” Then you wrote, “She just really wants to see what guys would do with her . Guys feel free to be explicit. Let her know what she would be in for.” And after that, you wrote, “Really what we were looking for is an idea of whether she would attract someone at a club we are thinking of visiting in Ct … Posting what men would do to her would boost both hers and my confidence.” The people on this board have more experience in the lifestyle than you have. In many cases, a TON more experience. So they went beyond what you asked to try and offer helpful advice and observations about your first trip to a club based on their experience and acquired wisdom. What was your reaction? To whine about how unhelpful they are. bbarnsworth said it pretty well: “The people here are very, very good. Sometimes what we have to say isn't what people want to hear.” On the side facing me, it appears that you really aren’t interested in the collective experience here and don’t want to be told anything other than what “men would do to her”. So I wrote something very explicit — as YOU requested — and that’s why I then asked, “Happy now?” There’s another piece of this that you (apparently) also fail to grasp, even though several posters pointed it out … namely, that there’s more that makes a woman attractive than just a hot body. Quoting bbarnsworth again: “a woman with the best body and the worst personality is...at least for me...going to find I'm not interested in the slightest. A woman with below average looks but a great, engaging personality is going to find I'm very interested.” So the fact is that while some men won’t care about anything other than looks, others will … and there’s no way to tell you what the men at a club will “do to her” because there’s no predicting which men you’ll run into there. What it sounds like you *really* want to know is what your first experience at a swing club will be like … and if that’s the case, then just ask that. And you ought to want to know what it will be like for *both* of you. But that’s a far cry from wanting to know what men will “do to” your wife.

If you cannot get her to talk about this openly, then neither of you are ready to move forward. MOST people have problems with swinging (or ethical non-monogamy), but some will go ahead and reluctantly try it for their partner. This is always a bad idea. If either of you don't want to do it because you aren't interested in doing it, then DON'T. If you don't have your trust and communication to the level where you can openly talk about this, then don't do it. Women are too quickly judged as a slut or cheap or whatever, so sometimes that is the reason why they may hesitate, but with trust and communication, that can be taken care of. You need to find out what her reluctance is and see if it is something that can be addressed, but it may be that she just isn't wired for swinging (like the majority of people). If this is the case, then nothing you do or say will change that you you will need to just accept it. Good luck and let us know how things progress...

I'll begin by saying that I am a dyed-in-the-wool social libertarian (not to be confused with a being member of the political Libertarian Party, completely unrelated) and wholeheartedly agree people should be free to do as they please with as little government interference as possible. Yet, no freedom is absolute. There are limits to every freedom we have, up to and including what happens to our own bodies. For example, we are not free to smoke crack. We are not free to have sex in public. We are not free to operate our car without wearing a seatbelt. We are not free to go on a cruise without proving we are vaccinated. We are not free to board a plane without being subjected to both search and seizure. And so on. In most instances, we accept these limitations without so much as raising an eyebrow. The exact limits of our personal freedoms become particularly thorny issues whenever we reach an intersection where our own freedoms start to interfere with, or infringe upon, the freedoms of other people. Like it or not, abortion is one such example. Abortion is, by definition, the cessation of life. People can argue about what "stage" of life the unborn may be at any particular moment during pregnancy. But, the underlying fact that a life is being snuffed out cannot be denied. And, therein lies the crux of the issue: At what point does a person's individual freedom to terminate a pregnancy become subservient (take a back seat) to the right of the unborn to be unmolested? Many argue, Is there any more basic right than the Right to Life? As far as the issue of morality is concerned, What are morals? Morals are socially agreed upon limits--guideposts, if you will--that help to explain acceptable versus unacceptable behaviors and norms that allow society to (more or less) function. We all agree an adult having sex with a child is immoral (and, thus, illegal.) Why? It is because we understand a child is incapable of having the ability to consent. The child is "at the mercy" of the adult and, thus, powerless. The adult has both a moral and legal obligation regarding the "standard of care" that is automatically afforded the child. In the eyes of many Americans, perhaps even a majority (?), abortion takes on a similar hue: The unborn is entirely powerless and "at the mercy" of the adult. At what point does the adult have both a moral and legal obligation regarding the standard of care afforded the unborn? It's a very thorny thing, not so easy to define. While polls show most Americans support a woman's right to have an abortion, those same polls show Americans overwhelmingly believe that right is not absolute. Most people polled see a great distinction between terminating a pregnancy at, say, eight weeks versus eight months. Roe vs. Wade created far more problems than it solved and left unresolved the most difficult issues. It was a heavy-handed, poorly-reasoned decision that used a cudgel to treat a societal wound that required a scalpel. That should be obvious to even a casual observer. Otherwise, we wouldn't still be debating the issue nearly a half-century later. Lastly, I take issue with the notion that swinging and abortion share any linkage. They are entirely unrelated issues. The presumption that an unplanned pregnancy automatically equates to an unwanted pregnancy, one that can only be resolved by having an abortion, fails to pass even the most basic examination of the facts. In the US, according to the CDC, more than 40% of all births are to unwed mothers (a statistic believed to be significantly under-reported thanks to California, the most populous state in the union, no longer recording the marital status of mothers.) Billions of people are walking the earth right now thanks to "unplanned" pregnancies.

My only surprise? The Lunatic Fringe has yet to declare Justice Alito a Russian spy... lol 😉 Yet.

Thanks for not saying, "stranger!"