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I'm sorry you've had to experience this. I'm not sorry about him. It sounds to me that regardless of swinging, his type of relationship was about him, and not the couple. I could be jumping to conclusions, but that's the way it seems. You are absolutely correct that a solid relationship first is critically important for a couple to have before engaging in swinging. The old saying; swinging is a magnifying glass. What it finds, it magnifies. If it finds love, it magnifies that. If it finds problems, it magnifies the problems. Obviously it found the latter in the case of you and your ex. You might want to take some time out, catch your breath, and get yourself on firm footing before trying to decide if you want to get into swinging as single female. If (if) you decide to get into swinging as a single female, you have a number of things to consider. If you're bisexual and get into swinging as a single female, you are the much fabled "unicorn"; rumored to exist but no one's ever encountered one. Ok that's stretching the truth a little But, you will be in very, very high demand if you went that route. You will be a couple's dream come true. Given that, you can be extremely picky and find the situation that works best for you. You want a connection? Get it. You want to have more of a feeling for the couple, a sense of closeness? Get it. Any couple worth their salt will view you as an amazing gift, and treat you like a queen. Even if you aren't bisexual, this is likely to be the case. Single females are uncommon in the lifestyle regardless, and are in very high demand. You'll need to learn how to weed out a LOT of contacts. Being on a swinging site as a single female you're going to get the attentions of a lot of people. It might be a pain to work through all of that. A tip I often give; put something in your profile some ways into it that says something like "If you've read this far, let me know in your contact email by telling me your favorite color at the beginning of your email" or something like that. If the contact email from the couple or single male doesn't have that, delete the email, block them, and move on. They obviously haven't actually read your profile and are just looking for a hookup. This can be a wonderful journey for you! Please keep coming back and ask whatever questions you have, feel free to vent, or just speak your mind in general about what's going on in your thought processes about all of this. We'll be happy to listen and offer possible answers.

Hello anonymousx, We wish you well in your journey, where ever it takes you and what ever path you choose. It appears you learned some hard lessons in your now past relationship; time to move forward. There are always going to be selfish folks in any facet of life, swinging is no different. Watch for them and stay clear. Swinging will be here if/when you are ready. This is your time, so take it. Just for you. Good luck to you.

Yes this stuff happens, so it's important to keep emotions in check and give each other some wiggle room in terms of boundaries.

So sorry to hear that your relationship has ended, however, in an attempt to put a more positive spin on things, it's better to find out now (even though you have already invested several years into the relationship) than to have things continue for several more years before finding out that it wasn't going to work. This is why we are constantly saying love/trust/communication is so very important. Also, that swinging is the sprinkles on the ice cream sundae of life...not missed if they aren't there, but just that much better when they are. We have enjoyed swinging during the time we have pursued it, but if either of us wanted to walk away, we both would without a second thought. The relationship we have is so much more important than anything we do in it or as part of it. You really should take a break and take some time to recover from what has happened. We wish you the best and if you are even in Nor Cal, invite you to come over and say hello some time (we would love even just seeing a unicorn just once to know that they really do exist...lol).

Every time we swing with a new couple or single we have a pregame discussion where basic rules are laid out. If you say yes to bi play then establish the boundaries. If you say no then no means no. We have never not once engaged with a couple who flagrantly broke the rules of the pregame discussion.

Thank you so much for your lovely and thought out response. I really appreciate your words and you absolutely worded my relationship perfectly despite not knowing me. It was very much about him, his thoughts, how he thought it should be and Why I was never quite enough or right in any element of it. I think taking some time to reflect on this is definitely a wise move so I can figure out which direction I wish to go in. I held such excitement for joining the swing world as a couple and how it may look, so it feels very different to take that path as a single. For one the fantasies now feel a little skewed so yes... I will take the time. If red flags are a thing, there have been many along the way to tell me that my ex partners desires were not based around "us" and more so about "him". It felt very micro managed which I now see was power and control. Often being locked out of our profile or the profile being deleted if I had angered him in a clash in opinion regarding how to navigate this, but no bigger sign of my irrelevance than using our couples profile to pursue more for himself whilst having prevented me from being part of it or accessing the site. It was often used as a weapon or punishment against me so I was crazy to proceed knowing this. Trust, communication and love failings , but I have learned that my gut instinct works.. If only I listen to it lol. I hope one day I am able to be this unicorn! Lol . Thank you again for your message x

I am in total agreement. We have a crew working on our place this week. I said to my wife, as much as I fantasize about giving head, I just don't find any of these guys attractive. But, I'm fairly sure that if they were naked and hard, fucking my wife, I'd be all over it. For her part, she thought one of the men was really cute/hot. Thought he was so sweet and had a nice personality. I think that is the difference between her and I. I'm more focused on the looks not the personality. And frankly, I think a lot of men are unattractive. Sorry guys. Maybe it's conditioning. I don't know. Either way, back to the original question. I think swinging has certainly expanded my mind and certainly offers opportunities to experiment, but I think I was probably fairly open to bi male play before.

So as expected and going against all advice given in this lovely forum , swinging finally stole my relationship. Alongside me wanting to thank every person who has taken the time to give me advice I also wanted to vent my frustration. Me and my now ex partner were together for several years. We decided to venture into swinging and admittedly I was much slower than him in terms of wanting to have sex or swap. Our fantasies and I'd say views didn't align and I preferred the slow approach to protect our relationship, whilst going all in was his apparent approach. I craved the journey to be about "us" and he craved the journey to be about multiple sexual experiences apart or together. I feel so sad and devastated that although the chance to fix us should have been first priority, he made the decision to proceed in engaging, arranging meets and locking me out of our profile so he was able to continue on his journey without my awareness... To me that feels like betrayal and cheating. Our relationship came second to the swinging I absolutely felt a solid relationship first was the answer to a prosperous swinging journey and have been duped that my relationship was not as important as I actually thought it was. So now I am trying to process and decide if I should go solo on this journey as a female or pack it in altogether. Meanwhile only 1 hour after our relationship ending my ex partner is meeting and doing what swinging should be... But single and without concern for me or our relationship. I wanted to rant and vent, but I also wanted to say to anyone who has given me previous advice that... You were right and thank you ! A life lesson I guess xxx

Reading posts and reading profiles with so much talk about bi-sex. My take is bi is very common with women, the younger we are the more prone the woman is to want to engage. Now I’m reading more about bi men on here even though research says bi men are a minority in swinging. This has brought up our feelings of how we would react if something went further than expected. I see profiles that say Straight or one or both bi, are we correct that if we say we are straight it will be respected. Are we overthinking by putting more stress in a meeting. Is there a soft bi for women like just kissing and touching boobs? I think a bi male would shut us down.

Big influx of first time posters like this.

I am sorry to hear how this played out for you. It is correct that now is far better than later. It might help to consider what swinging is and what part if any you have with it , or it with you. I may stir up a hornets nest but I will say this anyway. Swinging is in my view a couples sport. It is often described as Ethical Non -monogamy. ( For the sake of this discussion I include marriage a and committed relationship as one thing. A "single" is someone not in either type of relationship.) When a single person has sex with another single, they are just hooking up. That goes back as far as there was sex. It is not swinging. While it may look similar from the outside promiscuity does not equal swinging. From what I have seen singles often have more partners, but fewer encounters. When a single person has sex with either a couple or a member of a couple who is playing with consent of their partner, the married portion is "swinging" in some sort of definition. The single person is still hooking up, but also participating in the others "swinging". If the married component is playing without consent of their partner then they are cheating, not swinging. Depending on a number of factors the single is either just hooking up, participating in the other cheating, or cheating. This depends on knowledge of the situation, and intent on the singles part. A Swinger who is not playing by the couples rules are cheating. Unless you have a thing for married men or playing with couples, you have a normal healthy conventional sex life before you. That is far from boring. You could even get group sex going that way.

Ditto to the above. In our experience, when we decide to play with a couple, we find out what their limits and rules are and then we honor them. If we are told that it's okay for the women to kiss and touch each others boobs, then that is what (may, depending on how things are progressing) happens and NO MORE unless expressed permission is given in advance. No always means no and we are not going to challenge it. While there MIGHT be other couples that will try pushing the boundaries, usually a word will put an end to it. I think once you lay out the limits, you should be okay...and if they go contested, a word from her (or you...you are there to help keep things in check) will put an end to it.

People don't choose who they are attracted to. That's why when you just put yourself out there in a profile and see who shows interest you get a much more diverse group than you might expect.

Yes, if you say you are straight, and not interested in any bi-play, the vast majority of people (couples and singles) will respect your decision. I wouldn't worry about that. Play the way you want to play, and have fun. If your wife simply wants to touch the other woman, and/or kiss her, but not go further, that shouldn't be a problem. (Now, I'll issue a warning, learned by experience. Let's suppose your wife says to the other woman, 'it's okay to kiss me and feel my boobs,' and then you get into play time. Then the other woman puts her hand on your wife's pussy. Your wife may decide in the moment she likes this, and won't object. For her, that would be okay. But, for you, it might wind up feeling like a rule break. Coming in the middle of play, you'll have to make a decision: either simply accept it, or call a halt to it. Either option might lead to less than optimal results.)

Think we have that licked. That’s an Alan joke, sorry.

I can’t answer definitively what will happen with what will happen when you start meeting others. Most profiles on pay sites ask questions of what you are looking for when meeting, it would be foolish to be untruthful. Our search started with females who are bi or bi-curious, woman who want to explore a possible bi side. There are many many profiles that state both swingers are straight, if that is what you are looking for restrict your search parameters to straight only. The scams you will find on meeting others have very few concerning bisexuality, read into all requests before meeting. You may be correct that female bisexuality is more common, in our searches and in our circle of LS friends it is because that is what we searched for while male bisexuality is not common or is repressed in our meetings. We have never encountered a man insisting on male contact, I have seen casual male male touching with no overt sexual acts. I realize you are looking for answers by check out forums, keep in mind there is exaggeration in some posts. Keep reading and you will learn whose advice is worthwhile and whose posts to disregard. Have fun in your exploration and be careful.

Lynda Gayle was a wonderful soul. She was warm, kind and generous of heart. My friendship with her proved an avenue of growth for me in the erotic realm. My life is decidedly richer and for that I’m grateful. I miss Lynda Gayle and think of her often.

Back in the day when magazines had the tear out multiads I saw one to subscribe to a swinger magazine so I did. We were already nudists and WU had always liked to tempt fate being seen fucking so I thought we should learn more about swinging. Also bought, "Lets Ask Julie." We were already doing nude cruises, some with Castaways were open to swingers too, seemed like nice folks so we went on one of the Big Ship cruises that involved several swinger travel groups as well as Castaways. One couple told us about Club Relate which we researched and eventually joined. Sadly the owner passed away last year and it closed, it was a great place to grow a variety of interests.

That is a reasonable position, but I'd carve out the exception for not wanting what you don't know. I had plenty of opportunity over the years for MM contact but never wanted it. The closest thing in porn I enjoyed to it was passable trannies fucking women... As mentioned above, it wasn't until watching my wife suck cock during our second swap that I got really curious and started to consider it. Then a couple years later when it actually happened, and I performed oral on another guy during a threesome with my wife, my expectations were shattered. Holding another penis in my hand felt completely different than I imagined and having it in my mouth was infinitely more erotic than I anticipated. I don't really find men attractive (though I do find some unattractive) and have no interest in kissing, dating, cuddling etc with a male. But in a fluid sexual situation, I enjoy giving head which wasn't a repressed fantasy for me--it was something I'd have NEVER tried but for swinging.

Not taking a position here, just point out the obvious: daddy (for lack of a better term) issues.

My Mrs has changed the parameters on our search from 25-55 to 25-35 way below our real age. She is still reliving our recent meeting thinking that others that age will want her as well. I’m thinking that we were fortunate that our meeting went well while thinking others that age might have sinister thoughts. I am feeling my virility as well. I was able with the aid of pharmaceuticals to keep up, no pun, while I had the anxious feeling that I would be a failure. I can understand why an older woman wants a virile younger man and question the need of a younger woman wants an older man. I don’t think I want a woman twenty years my senior, why would a younger woman want me?

If it ok to ask, how old were both of you at the time when you meet. Also did you both played with other people before you 2 meet.

Yes both sets of parents knew each other and he and I met at a christmas orgy we both attended

I noticed there are less and less surprises in the lifestyle. Things that surprised us just a short time ago now seem the norm. Just watching TV, commercials, movies we see the normalization of what was once shocking. My advice is take chances as long as you are comfortable, nobody knows your comfort level. Discuss with your partner both of your place of comfort. I found later in life that I had desires that i suppressed that I wish I explored earlier. The younger couple are exploring as you are, go along with your comfort.

People have different opinions. Men are from Venus, women are from Mars or something like that. Some of our swing partners became friends. Some were only swing partners. We have really held off from swinging since covid, but not only because of covid. We notice that those swingers more enthusiastic about sex have not maintained contact with us. Those who are more casual swingers remain friends.